11/08/2022, The Midterms, aka build on 2020 aka The Election Thread

[Jinsai]

A bunch of Democrats were elected to the House and Democrats flipped the House based mostly on healthcare.

NOT on “we hate Trump.”

I don’t care about Trump’s base. They’d vote for him if he was brain dead hooked up to life support.

We are discussing what motivates Democrats to vote; in the Midterms, it was issues, mostly healthcare.

And I believe that issues MUST be the Democrats’ focus in 2020 if they want to win.

HRC focused WAY too much on “Trump sucks” and not NEARLY enough on the issues in 2016.

to dismiss the mid-terms in 2018 (which had a historic youth turnout) as largely fueled by anti-Trump sentiment?

Let's just call things what they ARE, not what we'd like them to be.

RE: Healthcare being a primary issue.... Besides "build the wall," Trump's biggest campaign promise was to kill Obamacare, and he convinced people ON OBAMACARE to follow him down that road. A lot of people don't understand the ramifications of what they're chanting for, but it's a mistake to dismiss them and their equal (or, due to our electoral college system, undue) influence as a voter.

I hate to say it, but we have to analyze and read the voting inclinations of the other side, even if it means evaluating what motivates bigots. I hate it, but it's a game that republicans are MUCH better at. If, for no other reason, to just alert them to the fact that they're fucking themselves out of brand loyalty.

[elevenism]

The Biden thing: I saw this coming a mile off.
I swear to god,he's creeped me out with his touchy-feely bullshit for YEARS.
I WISH it had been some sort of conservative smear campaign, but video doesn't lie.
THAT'S why I've never been very excited about a Biden candidacy. I hate to say it, but some of that shit... IDk. It just doesn't look right to me, especially the stuff with the younger girls.

Furthermore, I'm GLAD this is coming out now, rather than later.

[ltrandazzo]

I just donated $10 to Pete Buttigieg and $20 to Elizabeth Warren for two reasons - I like underdog stories that make sense for our progress as a nation and I appreciate that someone is covering the finer details of policy and proposals. That's the message I'm sending with my money right now.

[Demogorgon]

Pelosi basically slaps Biden on the wrist and says that, while he needs to be less "touchy feely", it doesn't disqualify him from a presidential bid: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...D=ansmsnnews11

[Sarah K]

There is no more rumbling of Cuomo entering? He's been laying the groundwork in NY HARD the last few years. I'll be shocked if he doesn't run.

Not that I think he would make a good president - just surprised after all of the obvious moves he has made in the state recently.

[theimage13]

There is no more rumbling of Cuomo entering? He's been laying the groundwork in NY HARD the last few years. I'll be shocked if he doesn't run.

Not that I think he would make a good president - just surprised after all of the obvious moves he has made in the state recently.

He's pretty unpopular - I think he's only held the office so far because no one better has challenged him. And I think he's smart enough to realize that if his own state isn't huge on him, there's no way in hell he'd ever get the nomination, let alone win the general.

[Demogorgon]

I still think the field is too crowded. Yeah, i know how many candidates the Republicans had in 2018, but the difference between those folks and this crop of Dempocrats is stark. I mean, the Republicans, almost every one of them, were a bunch of schlubs. Ted Cruz? Jeb? Chris Christy? Nah. This field of Democrats are far and away a smarter and better qualified group of people, and each one of them has a slice of the base that will want to vote for them alone or not at all. The DNC nomination is going to be a bloodbath. I'd like to be wrong, but we won't know til 2020.

[allegro]

Don’t you think it’s going to REALLY shake out during the caucuses, though? I don’t see it staying that large past the spring of ‘20.

The Republicans kept their field too big for too long. I don’t think this will happen with Democrats.

[Demogorgon]

2016 had two Democrat powerhouses for the majority of the race. Establishment choice Clinton, and firebrand progressive choice Sanders. That in itself was a mess, and voters are still angry about how that turned out. This time around, i just don't see any of the current crop pulling as much of an emotional reaction. It's going to be a real trick to get the base to rally behind just one, and that one is going to have to be real damn special. The only thing keeping voter apathy down is a near universal hatred of Trump, and i honestly don't think that will be enough. The Democrats need somebody to really step out of the crowd and own the race, and i don't think they can afford to wait for the caucuses to figure it out.

[Demogorgon]

I 100% agree that it should be about issues. The problem is that the base has been soaking in the briny "Trump Bad Trump Trump Bad Bad Bad Trump" solution ever since his election that it's going to be difficult to separate it now. I mean, just look at the last 10 pages or so of this very thread for a fairly clear sample. The media has pushed it, the Democrat leadership has pushed it, civil rights groups have pushed it. The midterms were ugly; the next general election is going to be even uglier.

[allegro]

Whoa, progress ...

WGN and the AP are calling Lori Lightfoot as the winner of the Chicago mayoral race.

Lori Lightfoot is an African American lesbian married woman with a young daughter.

Several firsts.

This is awesome.

[allegro]

But “kill Obamacare” was dead in ‘18 as far as Trump was concerned.

The Democrats revived the fight because now Democrats want Medicare for All, or some BETTER and CHEAPER version of the ACA.

They’re doubling down, not just “saving” the ACA but replacing it with what SHOULD have been in the ACA in the first place: the Medicare public option.

That’s not an anti-Trump sentiment. That’s a demand.

We have to stop analyzing the motivations of the opposition. It eats the left like a cancer, waters down arguments, wears down resistance. Fuck the right.

The way to victory is to build an enlarging coalition on the left that outnumbers the idiots on the right. It must cast a wide net, and be inclusive. Labor unions, working class, uneducated, educated, immigrants, people of all colors, all backgrounds, using the Constitution to support and protect civil rights and the right to basic needs like healthcare, an equal wage, an education, a career, equal housing, equal treatment under the law.

People won’t get this by sitting on their asses behind a computer.

[Jinsai]

But the “kill Obamacare” was dead in ‘18 as far as Trump was concerned.

Now that he's enjoying his victory lap, he's bringing it back. Hopefully it bites him in the ass because people will see he DOES NOT HAVE A PLAN, but like I'm saying, we need to blast that message to his supporters.

This is a fight against a bunch of people who don't know what they're talking about, and they're plugging their ears, but there's got to be a way to bring it to their attention. There HAS to be. People fooled by this bullshit are the biggest threat when it comes to a Trump re-election.

[allegro]

Now that he's enjoying his victory lap, he's bringing it back. .

He already changed his mind on that. His own party leaders pushed back. Now Trump’s saying he can’t do anything until after 2020.

You CANNOT change the minds of people who love him.

No more than they can try to convince US to like him.

It’s futile to try. Forget it.

Focus on the Democratic voters who didn’t vote in 2016. Or COULDN’T vote in 2016.

[theimage13]

Now that he's enjoying his victory lap, he's bringing it back.

What do you mean? He's already said "nah fuck it" and put it back off his radar. He killed the notion of striking the ACA almost as quickly as he rekindled it.

edit: on another topic, a poll has found that "almost 70%" of Americans would be okay with a gay candidate.

Which means, for those who are good at math, over 30%, or roughly 1/3 of the country, would still be "not okay" with a candidate just because they're gay.

I know I keep saying this, but what a fucking stupid country this is.

https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-...-finds-n990211

[allegro]

What do you mean? He's already said "nah fuck it" and put it back off his radar. He killed the notion of striking the ACA almost as quickly as he rekindled it.

Yeah now he’s saying his father was born in Germany.

But his father was born in the Bronx.

[Jinsai]

What do you mean? He's already said "nah fuck it" and put it back off his radar. He killed the notion of striking the ACA almost as quickly as he rekindled it.

Then I guess he's testing the waters? I don't know, I can't keep up. I decided that until the fucking complete Mueller probe is released to someone other than Barr, I can't handle the stress of paying close attention to this shit anymore.

edit: on another topic, a poll has found that "almost 70%" of Americans would be okay with a gay candidate.

Which means, for those who are good at math, over 30%, or roughly 1/3 of the country, would still be "not okay" with a candidate just because they're gay.

I know I keep saying this, but what a fucking stupid country this is.

And that's just the 30% that's honest. You can bet your ass that a very upsetting chunk of that 70% would flip that opinion around in the privacy of a voting booth. There's a lot of things that have been coming out of the woodwork lately. A lot of it lands as "no shit, what rock have you been hiding under?" A lot of it is just stuff we don't want to admit; like that there's a scary number of ACTUAL NAZIs in America mobilizing under the guise of conservatism.

[ltrandazzo]

Elizabeth Warren - https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/03/eliz...xecutives.html

Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., will unveil legislation Wednesday that would make it easier to criminally charge – and lock up – executives for a company's wrongdoing.

The bill, called the Corporate Executive Accountability Act, continues the presidential candidate's push to hold leaders more accountable for a firm's alleged abuses. Warren will also reintroduce a plan Wednesday that would ramp up scrutiny of big bank executives.

Warren's bill would widen criminal liability to include "negligent executives" of corporations with more than $1 billion in annual revenue that have reached certain terms related to alleged wrongdoing.

Dan Pfeiffer for Crooked Media - https://crooked.com/articles/trump-campaign-unoppposed/

Last week’s most alarming piece of political news was not that President Trump won’t face criminal charges for conspiring with Russia to sabotage the 2016 election, or for obstructing the investigation of his own campaign. It was a report from Acronym, a progressive digital organization, which showed that the Trump campaign has spent $6 million on digital advertising since the 2018 midterm election.

While more than a dozen Democrats are criss-crossing Iowa and New Hampshire talking to Democratic primary voters, Trump is already running a general election campaign. Trump can be beat in 2020, but not if he is allowed to strengthen his position in 2019.

And right now, too many Democrats and progressives are distracted by the primary or Trump’s latest tweet for our own good. If we don’t focus, and soon, Trump may get the berth he needs to bolster his standing and beat us again.

[Jinsai]

But what is the actionable suggestion to do something about Trump running an endless re-election campaign, ask him nicely to go back to work and do his actual job? You can’t fight fire with fire there, and you can’t do anything to legally pin anything to him it seems.... so?

[ltrandazzo]

But what is the actionable suggestion to do something about Trump running an endless re-election campaign, ask him nicely to go back to work and do his actual job? You can’t fight fire with fire there, and you can’t do anything to legally pin anything to him it seems.... so?

Dan has some ideas in the second half about Dem organizations and super PACs needing to spend more money on digital adverts to address the many controversies that have come up in just the last few weeks. He's not talking about taking legal action - he's talking about talking about these developments using an online megaphone in the form of digital adverts.

But it is a call for the Democratic establishment to get in the game, starting by investing millions of dollars in digital ads to make the case against Trump while the Dems fight it out amongst themselves.

Every day Trump gives Democrats more ammunition. Imagine the ads that could have been run last week when the Trump administration tried to eliminate funding for the Special Olympics to help pay for tax breaks for corporations and billionaires. There are only so many opportunities that we can allow to slip by before it is too late.

[Jinsai]

For those ads to hit the target audience, you’d need to get Fox News to carry them. I’m not sure how effective net based ads would be either... his supporters live in a bubble that would never run the ads. And even then I don’t see the special olympics thing getting much traction... after all, he came out and said it was someone else’s mistake, and we don’t have him on tape saying “fuck the special olympics!” ...and even if we did, it’d be like “we didn’t elect Trump because we were asking for a saint” or something about Hillary

it’s really exhausting

[ltrandazzo]

For those ads to hit the target audience, you’d need to get Fox News to carry them. I’m not sure how effective net based ads would be either... his supporters live in a bubble that would never run the ads. And even then I don’t see the special olympics thing getting much traction... after all, he came out and said it was someone else’s mistake, and we don’t have him on tape saying “fuck the special olympics!” ...and even if we did, it’d be like “we didn’t elect Trump because we were asking for a saint” or something about Hillary

it’s really exhausting

The target audience of Obama/Trump voters, undecided voters, casual voters, low-information voters and independents don't live on Fox News. They live everywhere else on the internet. Those other places care solely about ad revenue and based on undertakings by groups like Sleeping Giants, individual websites don't always cater their ads to their audiences and vice-versa. Living in Memphis, TN and having Google ads disabled so they're just region-focused, I don't see any ads that look favorably upon Democrats. Dem groups with money could change that by opening up their coffers and spending money on ads that highlight things Trump says outside of them being reported on CNN.

It's about reminding people of the things Trump says and the things his administration is trying to do. Digital advertising would surely help spread that around and would do a lot to ask questions like "Will YOU continue to allow this administration jail children and defund the Special Olympics?" and "Send a message to the Trump administration that the wall is a waste of YOUR money." etc.

[Jinsai]

I'd like to believe that it'd be effective. I just don't understand people who haven't made up their mind one way or the other about Trump at this point.

[allegro]

I'd like to believe that it'd be effective. I just don't understand people who haven't made up their mind one way or the other about Trump at this point.

They exist?

[theimage13]

They exist?

I would say people (or, GOP office holders) who haven't made up their minds about whether to treat him as a political ally or political foe still exist, regardless of their personal feelings. But otherwise, I can't imagine there's anyone who doesn't know whether they like him, hate him, or are just too apathetic to give a fuck about him.

[Jon]

I would say people (or, GOP office holders) who haven't made up their minds about whether to treat him as a political ally or political foe still exist, regardless of their personal feelings. But otherwise, I can't imagine there's anyone who doesn't know whether they like him, hate him, or are just too apathetic to give a fuck about him.

The bolded part is the majority of people I know and associate with. "I'm tired of hearing about Trump. I don't care." is something I hear more often than not.

[Jinsai]

The bolded part is the majority of people I know and associate with. "I'm tired of hearing about Trump. I don't care." is something I hear more often than not.

Well hopefully their general ambivalence will translate to a desire to just make all that Trump talk stop in the voting booth, or their mild irritation might be enough to make them actually mail in a ballot.

[Jinsai]

They exist?

They claim to... I'm dubious.

[Wretchedest]

There's a kind of person out there that aspires to ambivalence. I've known a few people who get really stuck up about not picking sides in a debate

[Demogorgon]

Biden proceeds to dig himself a deeper hole by joking about his tendency towards "affection": https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...D=ansmsnnews11