Likes: 
Faceplams: Well this wrecked me. Saw the email she sent out earlier today and couldn't even finish it because I was at work, and I was already crying like two paragraphs in.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
Well this wrecked me. Saw the email she sent out earlier today and couldn't even finish it because I was at work, and I was already crying like two paragraphs in.
Captain Rustleboots
Warren is tight. This year is Sanders last shot and I don't think he's gonna win the primaries, she's got my vote in 2024.
Trollhunter
I’m sorry but this just is not a good reason to not go with the progressive candidate over a terrible one in the primary. A minority of Sanders’ supporters were rude and made fun of Warren supporters on the internet. First, his supporters aren’t him. Second, did anyone leave ETS or not like TR anymore because Jarhead, Salos, telee kom, Balthier, and other trolls that have come through here? Of course not.Originally Posted by allegro
If you want policies that will benefit the people that need them the most (aka MOST people), Bernie Sanders is that person now. Forget the fucking Bernie Bros. I have. They have been shitty with me at times because I’ve maintained respect and hope for Warren. I don’t let it hinder my respect and hope for Sanders. Especially now.
Warren’s email and all her statements today have been classy. I hope she lands something big after her efforts. She probably will.
Last edited by Swykk; 03-05-2020 at 05:44 PM.
Active Member
I'm gonna be blunt:
If you're not voting for a candidate - ANY candidate - because of how their SUPPORTERS behave, you're a fucking moron.
Yeah, Microsoft offered me a job making 500k a year doing easy work, but some people who use Windows are assholes so I won't work with the company.
Seriously people? Get a grip.
Real Hippie Asshole
What’s more surprising is the perception on the Democratic side—nearly twice as many respondents viewed Clinton’s supporters as very aggressive (30 percent) as said the same for Sanders supporters (16 percent
Meanwhile in 2020 we have people here calling arguably the most progressive candidate in recent history "sexist" because tribalism is apparently more important than saving this dumpster fire of a country.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
Instead of telling people to ignore the bullying and harassment that's been nonstop for over five years now, a better use of that time may have been addressing it, calling it out, and shutting it down - from top to bottom in the campaign, not to folks here specifically.
But also, Bernie does not understand policies or the implementation process. It's either that or he straight up lies to people and relies on their ignorance to not know how it works, either. Ideas and goals are not policies. Many Warren supporters are wonk or law folks, which is why many will not support Sanders in the primary.
If it was November right now, I'd rather see Biden between the two, because now it becomes strategic as to who can motivate the people who actually vote to go out and vote. And the people who actually go out and vote in large numbers are not folks on this board and our peers. But for me I think it will also hinge on VP picks. I disagree with people that either one of them should pick Warren. Put her in a position where she will actually be able to make a difference - Secretary of Education or Labor or the Treasury. Vice Presidents are meaningless, though they do matter a bit more here since everyone is 182 years old.
I don't think Warren will run in the next cycle. She would be 75 by the time she took office. I don't think her ego is big enough for that, and the only benefit of her being VP would be visibility and increased name recognition for the next election. I think she'd rather wrap up her career in a role where she can leave an actual legacy and progress behind.
Last edited by Sarah K; 03-05-2020 at 06:23 PM. Reason: Derpy brain can't do words good right now.
Trollhunter
The part about understanding policies is incorrect and you’re way too smart to not know that. He repeatedly has outlined how he plans to pay for said policies (lowering the ridiculous military budget and tax increases for corporations and the rich are just two I remembered without digging much).
Additionally, Sanders has addressed his angrier supporters. He did so again today. You cannot expect him to be able to control anyone but himself.
Stubby Member
Biden is by no means the safer choice. The only motivation most people would have to vote for him would simply be the possibility to remove Trump from office. The problem with Bernie's support is that, while energetic and motivated, many of them aren't registered Democrats; young POC and working class folk disenchanted with the two-party system who will jump at the opportunity to vote for him in the general, but aren't voting in the primary (I'm a little hesitant to chide younger voters who don't participate in the primary, but sitting it out doesn't do them any favors). There's no question that Bernie would motivate a substantial turnout that will make all the difference in the general election -- just look at his rallies.
Last edited by Aladdinsanity; 03-05-2020 at 07:21 PM.
God is an American
And since he's running for President and not dictator, how is he going to get the votes for these policies?
Trollhunter
That’s a bleak fucking stance to take. That’s why the aforementioned Senate race is important.
Should we not vote for the progressive candidate because fuck it, Congress won’t act or would a progressive winning the presidency be opening a door? Americans might grow to expect more progressive policies from Democrats. Congress may feel the pressure from the voters.
Additionally, this would literally be the same scenario if Sanders dropped out because Warren had more delegates and she became the progressive candidate...but that would’ve been different to you guys somehow? No. We have to show them with results. This centrist nonsense has to go and it isn’t going to overnight. There will be kicking and screaming involved. Steps involved.
This “Bernie is a sexist like Trump and Biden/doesn’t get policy” shit isn’t going to fly with me. It just isn’t true. I’m sorry Warren didn’t get the votes she needed. It would’ve been awesome if she did. Unlike HRC, she would’ve made an excellent president. It didn’t happen and take the time to be upset but goddammit, do the right thing here.
Last edited by Swykk; 03-06-2020 at 02:23 PM.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
Yes, it would have been different. Because she understands policy and the implementation process.
There's been kicking and screaming for five years. It hasn't been effective.
Active Member
All I know for sure is that thanks to closed primaries, I don't have a say in who gets the nomination anyway, so it's utterly pointless for me to really get invested in any candidate. Like them or not, I'm voting for the D (that's what she said?) in November.
Stubby Member
Active Member
I get it... People are pissed and want to talk down candidates. Let's review some very relevant facts:
1. You're not just voting for President.
2. You're voting for who replaces RBG on the Supreme Court.
3. You're voting for the next Secretary of Education.
4. You're voting for federal judges.
5. You're voting for the rule of law.
6. You're voting for saving national parks.
7. You're voting for letting kids out of cages.
8. You're voting for clean air and clean water.
9. You're voting for scientists to be allowed to speak about climate change and for rebuilding the CDC.
10. You're voting for what a President says and does on Twitter.
11. You're voting for housing rights.
12. You're voting for LGBTQ people to be treated with dignity.
13. You're voting for sensible gun laws.
14. You're voting for Dreamers.
15. You're voting so that there will be Social Security and Medicare when you retire.
16. You're voting for veterans to get the care they deserve.
17. You're voting for rural hospitals.
18. You're voting so that someone else can have health insurance.
19. You're voting for the preservation of PBS.
20. You're voting to have a President who doesn't embarrass this country every time she or he attends an international meeting.
21. And you're voting against allowing the USA to become yet another authoritarian regime.
Trollhunter
@Magnetic I’ve seen that about 7 times today and have stated in this very thread multiple times I am voting for the Democratic nominee.
While there’s still time to figure out which person it’ll be, I’ll be supporting Bernie Sanders.
Bite me
Bite me
Out of context. It’s a debate. Watch the very end.
Biden to Warren: “You did a helluva job at your job”
Warren to Biden: “Thank you“
The implication that Warren didn’t blast him, first, or is too fragile for debate is hilarious. And sexist. We aren’t fragile.
Last edited by allegro; 03-05-2020 at 09:39 PM.
Bite me
So, you’re okay with Trump voters? You don’t judge Trump at all by his voters?
We Warren supporters aren’t morons; if it was a few assholes here and there, it’d be no big deal. But these people are the equivalent of MAGA assholes with roses in their profiles screaming at us about how fucking stupid we are. It’s a fucking cult. One guy told me that if I “joined,” I could talk to Bernie about “my ideas” and he was sure Bernie would consider them. WTF.
We’re more strategic, we’re working professionals, not hippies, we don’t want to lose freedoms via the loss of the SCOTUS, and now two old white dudes are the choice, so please get out of our way and let US decide, thanks.
Last edited by allegro; 03-05-2020 at 09:35 PM.
God is an American
I don't consider myself a Bernie bro and I won't yell at anyone for backing whomever they want to back in this election. Except for Trump. Most of us here in Canada are desperately asking you all to please not re-elect Trump. He is having an absolutely toxic effect on politics across this continent and worldwide. It would be great if you could find it in your hearts to hold your nose and vote for a Democratic President, whomever it may be. I like Bernie's policies too, but I know he's never going to get even one-tenth of the stuff he's promising to get government to do, not the way he wants anyhow; he'll be up against enormous resistance from moderates and the GOP, which will be a frustrating and ugly process, likely with prolonged periods of political deadlock and showboating and without much real progress made. Just like in the Obama years.
The trouble with Biden as I see it is: Trump and Giuliani have been peddling this narrative of Biden family corruption, and kind of succeeded at sowing seeds of doubt among swing voters about Biden, who might just look at the two of them as equally untrustworthy, and sit the general election out, instead of kicking Trump's ass to the curb. Biden's been framed by Trump's team as having family ties to Ukrainian oligarchy, thanks to Hunter Biden's activities there. And after all of the Russian interference narrative that the Democrats have been pursuing against Trump, putting in the one guy sneakily set up as having done the same thing — intervening internationally with family business tied to corrupt actors — once again the Democrats' guy is a poisoned chalice, in the minds of people they need to energize into voting for him. It's a difficult choice but you've got to pick one of these not-great-things.
Last edited by botley; 03-05-2020 at 10:35 PM.
Bite me
I believe that Bloomberg et al. are going to run ads highlighting Trump corruption and Trump nepotism, to counter that bullshit. And, that's what it is. Bullshit. We've been exposed to it for over a year, and it's bullshit.
Hunter Biden being hired by Burisma was common knowledge in 2014 and Republicans did not giveth one shit, and they had control of Congress. (a) (b) (c) (d) (e) (f) (g) (h) (i) (j) (k)
And, if Bernie is the candidate, we'll hear several months of Communist Manifestos, warnings of turning the country into Venezuela, and running videos of Bernie in Russia extolling the virtues of the USSR, etc.
Trump and the Republicans are going to play every dirty pool trick possible. They lie, cheat and steal. There is no "safe" Democratic candidate. The Democrats could have the resurrected corpse of Mother Theresa as the candidate, and the Republicans would post doctored videos of her in a whorehouse in Calcutta.
Last edited by allegro; 03-05-2020 at 10:58 PM.
Active Member
Dems, You Can Defeat Trump in a Landslide
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/25/o...wsN_KIcyPYyo6Q
Real Hippie Asshole
ETS Warren supporters: Bernie and his supporters are sexist and mean!
Also ETS Warren supporters: Fuck white men, and we're better than you dumb hippies!
Throbbing Member
People can vote for who they want. It's a free country.* But if Sanders' and Warren's places in this race were reversed, Warren supporters would (rightfully) have no patience for Sanders supporters flocking to Biden, whatever their reasons. So I find it very depressing watching the people who would condemn this behavior the most already gearing up to back Biden over Sanders.
At this point after (Sanders likely loses) Michigan, I fully expect Warren to play the unity-progressive and endorse Biden.
The shithead trolls will be inflammatory and annoying but they always are. I wouldn't worry about Sanders himself being too brutal - he dismissed Hillary's email scandal in a comedic moment and never went nearly as hard against her as she and Obama went against each other in 2008. He'll rightly press Biden's record on wanting to cut Social Security but he'll be too nice to address what is emerging to be one of my biggest fears about Biden in the general, namely the issues he at least appears to be having with his cognitive functions. I know about his speech impediment but this is something else and it seems to be getting worse as the campaign goes on. Looking at clips from him back in 2016 it is shocking to see how much his oratory skills have diminished. Sanders won't hit below the belt on this (I feel bad just bringing it up and only am because of the stakes involved here) but the right definitely will. I know how absurd the notion of a Trump supporter questioning the health of someone else's brain is, but they will, and they won't be afraid to get incredibly, callously mean about it. And if Biden's state gets worse, at a certain point it won't even matter what they say - it will play so horribly in any video coverage that their job will be done for them.
Obviously the right will attack with outright lies and falsehoods no matter what, but their fiction works better when mixed with the troubling reality of issues like Biden's questionable mental performance. Add this to the fact that Biden's record is unquestionably worse than his competition's on every important issue, and it's worth at least trying for Sanders.
This flew under the radar but was one of the most awful moments of this primary season. Biden has routinely responded to difficult questioning from voters by getting belligerent and telling them to vote for someone else, an unquestionably horrible tactic, and this is the most inexcusable example.
EDIT: * figuratively
Last edited by Deacon Blackfire; 03-06-2020 at 01:25 AM.
Bite me
Anybody claiming that Joe Biden’s gaffes are signs of senility are newbs.
Biden’s been like this FOREVER. That’s just ... him.
I’m going to preface this by advising that my Stepmom of over 40 years died of early-onset Alzheimer’s at the age of 62, so I’m intimately aware of the affects of dementia and Alzheimer’s.
Watch this:
Now, watch this:
Last edited by allegro; 03-06-2020 at 04:54 AM.
Throbbing Member
Oh believe me, I'm well aware that Trump appears legitimately dementia-addled, in addition to being a moron and the world's biggest sack of shit. But even if you don't believe Biden is going downhill, it's an obvious line of attack they'll use with the Ukraine crap and at the very least in doesn't speak with much confidence to his public speaking abilities as of late.
But as some have said, who's to say there even will be debates.
Bite me
Speaking “without as much confidence” isn’t a sign of dementia.
Biden’s most recent debate performances were pretty damned good. In speeches, lately, he uses a large vocabulary, with complex thoughts; he never digresses so far that he forgets what he was talking about; he remembers key elements of the reason he’s there; he doesn’t go off the rails with circumstantial unnecessary details, etc. (all signs of dementia).
Here is a good article about Trump and how it’s likely that he is suffering from Stage 2 Alzheimer’s.
Semantic paraphasia involves choosing the incorrect words. For instance, after Attorney General William Barr released a letter on the Mueller report, Trump said: “I hope they now go and take a look at the oranges, the oranges of that investigation, the beginnings of that investigation."
Phonemic paraphasia, which is linked to the moderate to severe stages of Alzheimer’s, is described as "the substitution of a word with a nonword that preserves at least half of the segments and/or number of syllables of the intended word.” For example, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu becomes “Betanyahu,” big league becomes “bigly,” anonymous becomes “enenamas” or "anenomynous," renovation becomes “renoversh,” missiles become "mishiz," space capsule becomes “capsicle,” midterm elections become "midtowm" and "midturn" elections, and Christmas becomes “Chrissus.”
Last edited by allegro; 03-06-2020 at 05:06 AM.
Active Member
1) I never said people are morons for supporting Warren. Hell, she was my first choice.
2) No, I'm not okay with Trump supporters - but that has nothing to do with whether or not I would vote for Trump. I'd never cast a ballot for him because HE is the unbelievable fuckwit. And I'm not okay with them because they support an unbelievable fuckwit. But if I DID support Trump. I'd still vote for him even if I thought most of his base were bunch of insane, racist and sexist assholes.
Point being, a Democrat needs to be elected this year. It is absolutely vital for our chances at not destroying the country for generations to come. And regardless of who that Democrat is, if someone is out there saying "well I'm not voting for him because some of his fans are idiots", then you're an idiot too - at least, in regard to your voting stance.
Am I thrilled that it's come down to two old white dudes again? Fuck no. But I'm voting for whoever makes the ballot, period, because the stakes are too high to let the behavior of a small number of their fans keep me from the polls.
Administrator
I don't think Bernie's rabid supporters will hurt him in the general, but it may cost him the nomination because there's still an alternative in Joe Biden. We're entering the phase where these final two need to start building their coalition to win the general election and I'm skeptical about campaigning from a position of grievance and anger. It feels good and it obviously helped Trump win, but after accounting for Trump's base accounting for roughly 30-35% of the population, you have the rest of that 46% who voted for him in 2016 that held their nose.
Democrats and non-Republicans aren't good about holding their noses, so the candidates need to start opening their arms to each other's supporters. If that means Bernie needs to call out Chapo Trap House and some of the other media that's fervently supporting him, then so be it and frankly, he should especially do it if he's serious about winning this thing. This isn't 2016 where he was the protest candidate - he has a real shot here to win this primary.
(Unused symbol)
I was really excited about Warren. Yes, she had her flaws but her passion, knowledge, attitude, justifiable anger, humor, and empathy far far FAR outweighed the cons. To me, she was the obvious choice. I realize not everyone shares that view...that's fine. And I don't have anything against Bernie personally, he's probably a great guy, but I don't think he can win in Nov. This was my opinion in 2016 and it remains unchanged. His performance among black voters only solidifies that for me. It's been mentioned before, here and elsewhere: it is a highly flawed assumption that Warren voters would flock to Bernie once Elizabeth dropped out.
WITH ALL THAT SAID, if shit goes bonkers again in the coming weeks Joe tanks and Bernie finds himself the nominee...it's Bern Baby Bern.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
I’m not sure why it always gets framed as it only being his supporters, though. He sucks plenty himself. Yes, I know. Biden does too. We are left with two crappy choices from my point of view. I’m personally playing a numbers game from here on out. I will follow the lead of Black voters.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote