Wait. Holy fuck. I've not seen the news.
So there IS evidence that the plane was attacked?
Edit: not sure why I asked, rather than checking the news.
FUUUUUUUUUUCK.
SOo, I wonder how we handle THIS particular brand of bullshit?
I was nobody. Nothing.
Wait. Holy fuck. I've not seen the news.
So there IS evidence that the plane was attacked?
Edit: not sure why I asked, rather than checking the news.
FUUUUUUUUUUCK.
SOo, I wonder how we handle THIS particular brand of bullshit?
Bite me
Not “attacked,” no. The majority of the people aboard were Iranian.Originally Posted by elevenism
It appears to have been *accidentally* hit by a SAM.
I was nobody. Nothing.
This is a fucking awful accident, if it's truly an accident.
(Unused symbol)
It would be interesting to know why that plane was targeted when it was so obviously close to the airport and, more importantly, climbing (ie not an aggressive posture)? According to Flightradar24 other flights departed the airport that morning...
*752 to Kiev 6:12am shot down
1185 to Istanbul 5:17am
*752 to Kiev was delayed...was schedule to depart at 5:15am
873 to Istanbul 5:07am
491 to Doha 5:01am
513 to Moscow 4:31am
872 to Vienna 4:23am
601 to Frankfurt 2:42am
Ballistic missiles fired between 1:45 - 2:15am
We'll probably never know.
Edit: I'm not suggesting it wasn't mistakenly brought down, just wondering why that particular one caught their attention on what appears to be normal operations despite the ballistic missile strikes.
Last edited by cdm; 01-09-2020 at 08:24 PM.
I was nobody. Nothing.
We will likely never know-i agree.
I'm just hoping this thing doesn't trigger...well, you know: the thing that the thread is about.
Will the U.S. consider something that killed Canadian citizens grounds for war? Will this be one of those mistakes that triggered a war, and go down in history as such?
Btw: @cdm , I appreciate the information you've provided here. I'm watching news on YouTube, and i've not seen some of the info you've found.
Active Member
Nope. The Commander in Chief doesn't give a flying fuck about anyone except white American citizens. A plane full of Canadians doesn't even register to him. But if there had been one dues-paying Trump Club member on that plane, we would have carpet bombed Iran already.
And so far, I haven't read any news about Canada launching a retaliatory strike (though maybe I just haven't seen those articles).
Active Member
So far we've just demanded a full investigation and justice, but no further details. I wouldn't expect a retaliatory strike. I would expect an inquiry, a trial of some sort and see what happens from there.
24.24.2.2866
It was a SAM site that took it down right? If I'm not wrong aren't those generally an automatic system? What I'm getting at is i don't know that any one person would have necessarily "pulled the trigger" so much as failure in disarming the system when there were no threats present.
Last edited by thelastdisciple; 01-10-2020 at 11:01 AM.
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It's a good question. I'm sure some weapons expert would know the answer regarding this specific system. Logically there would be some sort of automatic aspect to it...whether fully (radar picks up a target and fires relatively immediately) or partially (radar automatically picks up target but gives the opportunity for human intervention before firing). I don't know the answer and I haven't come across anything explaining it.
The US has said satellites picked up 1. the SAM radar switching on 2. two missiles launching 3. the heat signature of an explosion but [so far] I haven't seen the amount of time between #1 and #2. Did they switch the radar off to allow the flights to take off and then back on after 5:17am departure not knowing 752 was delayed?
One note on those departures: On Flightradar24 you can load earlier flights on the departure board but my account doesn't go back very far, a little over a day. To get the above departures I looked at yesterday's early morning flights and cross referenced to see if they were daily; some were and others weren't. What I listed are actual departure times according to the flight pages. The website cautions that they cannot guarantee the data is correct that they pull info directly from other sources. Generally the data is pretty accurate. I mention this because I've seen some sources say there was a ground stop that morning but these departures don't really back that up...it's hard to say without seeing the full board.
(Unused symbol)
This isn't without precedent (US & Iran) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655
You can read the wiki but the generally accepted scenario (accepted by everyone but the Iranians) is the US warship mistakenly shot down the airliner thinking it was a fighter jet. Investigations subsequently found the leadership on the ship acted in a reckless manner and was within Iranian territorial waters when it shouldn't have been. The countries settled for $60+ million in international court without the US having to admit fault. Iran never accepted that the incident was mistaken ID.
The difference here is with IranAir 655 the Navy claims to have tried to contact the airliner before firing. The airliner never heard these calls as they didn't have access to the frequencies. But with PS752 there is no way the Iranians tried to contact the plane...there was just no time. They fired as soon as the radar locked.
So with all that said I'm not sure we'll handle anything. Boeing will have to be granted a sanction waiver in order to offer investigatory aid, Treasury would surely do that although it is unclear if Iran will accept their assistance. The US could assist a third party nation at some point, possibly France, if Iran hands over the black boxes. Surely we'll offer something to Canada, potentially helping ID & transferring remains. This is all speculation as we didn't have any citizens on board and it wasn't a US registered plane. Aside from the fact that our actions in the region were a catalyst for the eventual incident the only US link is the manufacturer. Iran will have to decide whether or not they allow Boeing in.
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