Controversial Nine Inch Nails opinions

[katara]

For one, it sounds completely out of place on the Slip, right down to its placement in the track sequence.

I always felt it was perfect in the track sequence. A sombre aftermath to the chaos of Head Down and a prelude to the quiet storm of Corona Radiata.

the obligatory piano ballad...

How obligatory is it, really? How many piano ballads had we had up to that time?

Something I Can Never Have
Right Where It Belongs
Zero-Sum (not really a traditional ballad, although piano is used throughout)

That's it, I think?

I do get what you're saying. It's just interesting to note how few actual piano ballads Trent's written.

[HWB]

I like it a lot, too. But I definitely understand the general disdain for it..

For one, it sounds completely out of place on the Slip, right down to its placement in the track sequence. It also lends itself to the overall concept of that album, which is Trent being fully capable of banging out a Nails album in a few weeks, if necessary. The song is fine, but it sounds like he had some words, sat down at the piano and started playing, and 15 minutes later had the general blueprint for an NIN ballad..

The whole album is like that: PHM-style radio fare (Discipline), ambient dronescapes (TFOUAD), layered Fragile-era song structures (Echoplex), prototype industrial-metal bangers better than anything Ministry has done in over 15 years (1,000,000, Letting You), and the obligatory piano ballad..

This is what made Hes Marks -- his next album -- so refreshing. He made this boilerplate NIN album in two weeks that any of his 90s fad fans could get into, then did a complete 180 and made a difficult, minimalist-yet-layered concept album that irritated 75% of his fanbase and did things no other Nails album has attempted before or since..

If the Slip is his Clash album, Hes Marks is his Sandinista..

One of the most impressive things about The Slip is how it explores pretty much every side of NIN in just ten tracks and does so with perfect flow without it feeling awkward or disjointed, the way Lights In The Sky starts up the more ambient side of the record is wonderful, the way album slowly climbs back to intensity with Corona/Four Of Us...is superb too.

I love Hesitation Marks but I don't see what's "difficult" about it. It is Trent's most accessible record

It sure seems like it..

I remember when it leaked like a week before it came out, and I was reading people's reactions to it here, and it was a lot of "HOLY FUCK THIS IS HIS BEST STUFF SINCE THE FRAGILE!!"

Now, any time someone praises that album, there's like a dozen replies about how a lot of the songs are terrible, Everything sucks, it starts out strong and then nosedives, etc. All you have to do is back up in this very thread at random intervals and it'll routinely show up. Nobody is calling it "his best since the Fragile" these days, I know that much..

Which makes it all the more hilarious when people talk up Add Violence as this grand artistic statement that really ties the Trilogy's room together. No it doesn't; even Trent and Atticus don't like that EP. That's why it's bookended by two EPs that sound nothing like it, and are both notably stronger and more focused..

Add Violence sounds like the EP that should have come between The Slip and Hes Marks, not between two EPs that a lot of people here actively consider Trent's best work since The Fragile..

Records always will have a big "wow" factor when released, especially for a band which most didn't think would ever release another album again or perform live again.

Come on dude, that thing about Add Violence, really? Trent never said he disliked Add Violence, or even its concept, he just decided to go for a new approach conceptually on Bad Witch as he felt the simulation thing was too easy to explain all of the issues. But there is no hint that Trent would think lesser of Add Violence somehow, that's just an assumption on your part without any evidence.

[HWB]

You know, I never thought about looking at the record as Nine Inch Nails’ version of a Berlin Trilogy record, but it totally works. I remember reacting almost exactly the same way to the sudden sonic shift between the A and B side of Low as I did to the A and B sides of The Slip.

Probably intentional, I always felt like The Slip's cover art was some sort of a homage/tribute to Bowie's Low too, but with its own twist so it doesn't feel like an empty reference, one of the best album covers probably, really love it

[bobbie solo]

Come on dude, that thing about Add Violence, really? Trent never said he disliked Add Violence, or even its concept, he just decided to go for a new approach conceptually on Bad Witch as he felt the simulation thing was too easy to explain all of the issues. But there is no hint that Trent would think lesser of Add Violence somehow, that's just an assumption on your part without any evidence.

I tend to agree about Add Violence. They played 4 out of 5 songs from it often enough on the CBI tour to solidify to me that they like the EP. And I took no performances of Not Anymore (and for that matter, The Idea of You) as purposeful, so they can surprise us with it live in a few years & we all go gaga on here & the rest of NIN fandom.

[HWB]

I tend to agree about Add Violence. They played 4 out of 5 songs from it often enough on the CBI tour to solidify to me that they like the EP. And I took no performances of Not Anymore (and for that matter, The Idea of You) as purposeful, so they can surprise us with it live in a few years & we all go gaga on here & the rest of NIN fandom.

I always felt like he was happy with it, he went as far to discuss The Lovers on a podcast in such lenghts he hasn't discussed any other song in his career arguably and then even released a rehersal footage of it on NIN's YouTube account, a lot of things point to Trent being proud of it.

[bobbie solo]

I always felt like he was happy with it, he went as far to discuss The Lovers on a podcast in such lenghts he hasn't discussed any other song in his career arguably and then even released a rehersal footage of it on NIN's YouTube account, a lot of things point to Trent being proud of it.

This is probably better evidence to support our argument more than mine.

[Magnetic]

I always felt like he was happy with it, he went as far to discuss The Lovers on a podcast in such lenghts he hasn't discussed any other song in his career arguably and then even released a rehersal footage of it on NIN's YouTube account, a lot of things point to Trent being proud of it.

Does anyone have an easy link to this podcast? I'd like to hear this.

[HWB]

Does anyone have an easy link to this podcast? I'd like to hear this.

http://songexploder.net/nine-inch-nails

[Magnetic]

Thanks!

[kaydraven]

I never got the feeling Trent wasn't proud of Add Violence or anything in the trilogy. It's all great, but Add Violence is definitely the highlight for me. As for Hesitation Marks, I seen others talk about it unfavorably, but I remember how much I loved it when I first heard it. Hearing "Came Back Haunted" and "Copy of A" got me so excited for NIN in ways that The Slip didn't do. I appreciate The Slip more now, but it didn't really click with me upon release.

[BRoswell]

Not sure why anyone would assume that Trent & Atticus didn't like Add Violence. It had two music videos created for it (three if you count the rehearsal video for The Lovers), plus the aforementioned Song Exploder episode. They may have abandoned the loose plot that they set up, but that seems more like an intentional zig when everyone expected them to zag.

[zecho]

Thanks!

This was maybe my favorite interview with musicians that decade. I wanted this treatment for like every song Nine Inch Nails has ever done.

You guys should definitely check out the other interviews Song Exploder has done. They've got exceptional taste, and interview a lot of the best musicians currently working. I don't think I've listened to an uninteresting episode.

[zecho]

Sorry, what’s the third video? I’m only seeing “Less Than” and “The Lovers” from rehearsal.

He's talking about the actual music videos for Less Than and This Isn't The Place. Two music videos and three if you count the rehearsal for The Lovers.

[piggy]

Ah. Thank you. I'd forgotten the "This Isn't the Place" clip, which I guess I hadn't even thought of as a "video." I filed it with "Burning Bright" as "promo clip." But I guess the only real distinction is in my head.

I don't personally consider them full-on videos, either. They're in their own odd little category. Same with "God Break Down The Door."

[BRoswell]

I consider This Isn't The Place a proper video because it tells a story as it unfolds. There's a momentum to it that's not present in Burning Bright and God Break Down The Door, which is a key difference.
@Prettybrokenspiral disagrees with me though. Care to answer why, or are you just going to facepalm me because your theory doesn't hold water?

[allegate]

sometimes when you present an opinion as fact you get shit on for it. that's how that works.

facepalms won't change that.

[implanted_microchip]

It’s a big shame to me that with how cinematic a lot of NIN work is we’ve gotten very few fleshed out videos for almost everything after With Teeth. With how detailed that universe was I think it’s a real shame Year Zero only had one video, and it’s so good it’s proof of how rich that material was for that kind of treatment. I get Trent’s dissatisfaction with the format and his experiences over the years but I would have loved to see more for the trilogy especially, Shit Mirror not being a single at least is baffling. That song has impressed a lot of people I know that I’ve shown it to who don’t keep up heavily with things and it would have absolutely lent itself to a great video. For the criticism his lyrics sometimes get I think a lot of the newer stuff especially has been so imagery rich and laden with great little details and I’d love to see what some directors could have come up with for them.

[kaydraven]

It’s a big shame to me that with how cinematic a lot of NIN work is we’ve gotten very few fleshed out videos for almost everything after With Teeth. With how detailed that universe was I think it’s a real shame Year Zero only had one video, and it’s so good it’s proof of how rich that material was for that kind of treatment. I get Trent’s dissatisfaction with the format and his experiences over the years but I would have loved to see more for the trilogy especially, Shit Mirror not being a single at least is baffling. That song has impressed a lot of people I know that I’ve shown it to who don’t keep up heavily with things and it would have absolutely lent itself to a great video. For the criticism his lyrics sometimes get I think a lot of the newer stuff especially has been so imagery rich and laden with great little details and I’d love to see what some directors could have come up with for them.

Yeah, I would love to see some videos for the new stuff. NIN usually have really interesting, thought provoking, or just freaking weird videos. I love how they're always more than just a straight performance video, which is all music videos are now. And lyric videos just aren't the same. They're interesting, but very little about them makes me want to revisit them. It's a shame that one of the more recent videos was the seizure inducing "Came Back Haunted."

[sonic_discord]

Yeah, I would love to see some videos for the new stuff. NIN usually have really interesting, thought provoking, or just freaking weird videos. I love how they're always more than just a straight performance video, which is all music videos are now. And lyric videos just aren't the same. They're interesting, but very little about them makes me want to revisit them. It's a shame that one of the more recent videos was the seizure inducing "Came Back Haunted."

Yeah, I remember getting excited about the fact that David Lynch was going to be directing it. And then I saw it. I think I've only re-watched it once since then. The video for Less Than was kind of interesting, but again, I think I've only watched that one two or three times, as well. I agree with @BRoswell 's take on the "videos" for This Isn't the Place, Burning Bright, and God Break Down the Door. Though I would say that I consider the live video for Ahead of Ourselves and the performance of She's Gone Away from Twin Peaks to be the closest we've come to getting a proper music video since Came Back Haunted.

[katara]

The videos for the Trilogy for the most part are not videos; they're visualisers.

Less Than's video would have been better if it didn't have the lyrics burned into it. Not super into lyric videos. I like the overall concept, though.
Ahead Of Ourselves is excellent. Fucking raw visuals, great performance, really exciting and dangerous. This is the best video to come out of this era.

I feel like TR has always disliked the format and was possibly only compelled to make videos in the past to fulfil contracts in the age of MTV. That said, he's gotten some amazing artists on board in the past. Would've been awesome if Mark Romanek was brought back for the Trilogy.

Absolute crying shame nothing came out of Year Zero aside from Survivalism. Maybe the ideas were all saved for the TV series which never ended up happening, and by that point, it was too late.

[TheBang]

I consider This Isn't The Place a proper video because it tells a story as it unfolds.

Also, it has a credited Director, Producer, DP, Editor, and Gaffer. It's a music video.

Burning Bright and God Break Down the Door do not.

[botley]

Absolute crying shame nothing came out of Year Zero aside from Survivalism. Maybe the ideas were all saved for the TV series which never ended up happening, and by that point, it was too late.

On my way now to direct a softcore video for Capital G Switch remix.

[Max]

Videos are really expensive to make, at least if they are going to be as epic as Closer. With the collapse of the music industry, it is not easy to find one. I do hope that someone figures out how to make them viable again. Once upon a time they were actually the cutting edge of film innovation and truly deep artistic statements. It’s the larger system driving this change though, not any individual artist lacking will or imagination.

[kaydraven]

Yeah, I remember getting excited about the fact that David Lynch was going to be directing it. And then I saw it. I think I've only re-watched it once since then. The video for Less Than was kind of interesting, but again, I think I've only watched that one two or three times, as well. I agree with @BRoswell's take on the "videos" for This Isn't the Place, Burning Bright, and God Break Down the Door. Though I would say that I consider the live video for Ahead of Ourselves and the performance of She's Gone Away from Twin Peaks to be the closest we've come to getting a proper music video since Came Back Haunted.

I can't even re-watch "Came Back Haunted." Usually flashing lights and stuff like that don't bother, but holy hell, that video gave me a headache. I couldn't make it through the whole thing.

[eversonpoe]

I can't even re-watch "Came Back Haunted." Usually flashing lights and stuff like that don't bother, but holy hell, that video gave me a headache. I couldn't make it through the whole thing.

making it even funnier that your avatar is from the video hahaha

i know what you mean, though. the visuals are definitely intense at points, despite the video feeling a bit slow.

[Prettybrokenspiral]

Came Back Haunted is one of his best videos since Deep; weird as fuck and largely misunderstood, imho. THTF was boring. Only was cliched. Survivalism was okay; kinda boring in a performance-video sort of way. That cartoon for Everything that dude made was Meathead-quality brilliance. Less Than was awesome. She’s Gone Away was their best performance-based clip of all time. Ahead of Ourselves had an interesting style to it, for a performance clip..

Burning Bright and GBDTD are visualizers, like someone said previously. TINTP is a screensaver, at best. All they did was a slow backtracking camera pan. Ffs, put me in front of that console thing and give me an hour, and I could do that much..

The Broken movie...now that’s a music video. Sleazy and Trent essentially setting the Broken tracks to the 7th Guinea Pig movie. Starfsuckers is still his most underrated clip of all time, too..

[BRoswell]

Also, it has a credited Director, Producer, DP, Editor, and Gaffer. It's a music video.

Burning Bright and God Break Down the Door do not.

Bingo.

[kaydraven]

making it even funnier that your avatar is from the video hahaha

i know what you mean, though. the visuals are definitely intense at points, despite the video feeling a bit slow.

Goddammit lol. Shows you how much I've seen the video!

[Helpmeiaminhell (is now in hell)]

The best NIN video will always be 'Gave Up'. Its an actual live performance and also an alternate studio version of the song (and superior) to the one on Broken. Plus you get footage of the Tate House and you get appearances from Marilyn Manson before he lost his mind from drugs and Richard Patrick before he lost his mind from politics. Its a veritable smorgasbord of 1992 industrial rocj

[kaydraven]

The best NIN video will always be 'Gave Up'. Its an actual live performance and also an alternate studio version of the song (and superior) to the one on Broken. Plus you get footage of the Tate House and you get appearances from Marilyn Manson before he lost his mind from drugs and Richard Patrick before he lost his mind from politics. Its a veritable smorgasbord of 1992 industrial rocj

I wouldn't call it their best video, but I agree that this version is much better than the version on Broken. This is actually the version I heard first, so when I finally heard the Broken version I was like "wtf is this?" The video is cool. It's funny to see Manson "play" guitar.