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Thread: Grimes

  1. #211
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    It's weird how the very thing that you love about an artist can sometimes flip, where that exact same quality now comes across as a negative thing.

    I was thinking about this recently while revisiting Tricky's whole catalog and observing his music's steady decline beginning after Angels With Dirty Faces. Certain descriptions could be applied to his later music that could also be applied to the old stuff (dark, atmospheric, blending hiphop/pop/rock, and so on), but he began executing that concept in a way that fundamentally changed the way it came across to people, and you could just feel it. No one but the most die-hard dickriders can reasonably argue that post-90s Tricky is anywhere near as good as 90s Tricky. With Grimes I feel like something similar is starting to happen. What I've always loved about her music is this very earnest ADHD quality. It felt like she was having so much fun just making noise and trying weird things and dabbling in whatever whims she felt in that moment. The idea of her music being a modern day meeting ground between aphex twin and mariah carey was kind of absurd, and yet she often did a decent enough job pulling it off. Plus she seemed kinda wild and crazy, climbing mountains while tripping on acid, swimming naked in the ocean, building that crazy house-boat contraption to float down the Mississippi river with live chickens on board. The girl is fucking NUTS. But that fun, reckless quality seemed to translate well into her songs. I remember reading about how she wrote one of her older songs in less than an hour (I think it was Feyd Rautha Dark Heart) after she took a shitload of acid and just poured herself into it as fast as she could. There's a kind of purity to that. She was always manic and weird, but somehow, at her very best, it was like she was able to harness all that craziness and channel it into genuinely good songs.

    On paper, this new album seems to bear all the same descriptors of her old music: it's weird, eclectic, poppy, hyperactive, fun, dark, etc. And yet something feels off to me. The AAA production values give all the songs a certain crude and garish quality, even the stronger songs. When I compare the new studio version of Realiti to the original demo that we all fell in love with, it doesn't hold up as well. The song is fundamentally great, so it's still enjoyable enough, but something has definitely been lost, something in the underlying feeling of it.

    Relistening to her older shit this morning and then playing the new album again, I'm realizing that, in spite of how wild and manic she used to be, there was actually an under-acknowledged sense of subtly and restraint in her music, especially her best songs. Her pop songs didn't exactly have epic choruses, but they had a enough pop tendencies to hold your attention, and when she mixed that with a certain blissed out/pure quality, it ended up working really, really well. I'm specifically thinking of songs like Be a Body, Night Music, the Realiti demo, Crystal Ball, Genesis, and others. It's funny how much of a deal was made about her failed attempts at writing pop songs for other mainstream artists, because it actually doesn't surprise me at all. Grimes pop songs just do not sound like Rhianna pop songs. Stadium pop singers wouldn't touch a song like Realiti or Be a Body, because the pop elements are so abstracted, not just by the ethereal production style (which could changed if needed) but by the actual song composition itself. This hasn't really changed. Flesh Without Blood may have a certain Taylor Swift-esq level of pop-rock production, but there's still no chorus as gripping as Shake It Off. This wasn't really an issue when the songs were presented with cooler production and a much better sense of overall style and atmosphere, but she seems to be shedding all of that and exchanging it for something that doesn't complement her music nearly as well. I think if she were trying to write Oblivion today the song would get kinda fucked up in her new process, which I suspect is the reason that there's not a single track on this album that's as good as Oblivion.

    It's a bummer because I genuinely feel that Grimes has an endless amount of future potential, and as someone who was excited to hear all the music that she was going to bring into existence, I hope she can clear her head a bit and make something better again. It would be kind of tragic if this was it. It makes want to go through her archive of unreleased material to see if any other Realiti-level demos are being left unreleased because of some bizarre sense of taste.

  2. #212
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    Recommended album to start with?

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfkiller View Post
    Recommended album to start with?
    Visions is fantastic, my favourite, she really hit her stride with this one. the previous album Halfaxa is a good listen too. The first album, Geidi Primes can be tough to get into.
    The latest album Art Angels is fantastic too, but very much a change in direction to what came before.

  4. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfkiller View Post
    Recommended album to start with?
    If you want to chillax and lose yourself a bit, hit Visions. If you want to bop around a little more and listen to some feelgood music, hit up Art Angels.

  5. #215
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    I opted for both, thanks peeps!

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mantra View Post
    It's weird how the very thing that you love about an artist can sometimes flip, where that exact same quality now comes across as a negative thing.

    I was thinking about this recently while revisiting Tricky's whole catalog and observing his music's steady decline beginning after Angels With Dirty Faces. Certain descriptions could be applied to his later music that could also be applied to the old stuff (dark, atmospheric, blending hiphop/pop/rock, and so on), but he began executing that concept in a way that fundamentally changed the way it came across to people, and you could just feel it. No one but the most die-hard dickriders can reasonably argue that post-90s Tricky is anywhere near as good as 90s Tricky. With Grimes I feel like something similar is starting to happen. What I've always loved about her music is this very earnest ADHD quality. It felt like she was having so much fun just making noise and trying weird things and dabbling in whatever whims she felt in that moment. The idea of her music being a modern day meeting ground between aphex twin and mariah carey was kind of absurd, and yet she often did a decent enough job pulling it off. Plus she seemed kinda wild and crazy, climbing mountains while tripping on acid, swimming naked in the ocean, building that crazy house-boat contraption to float down the Mississippi river with live chickens on board. The girl is fucking NUTS. But that fun, reckless quality seemed to translate well into her songs. I remember reading about how she wrote one of her older songs in less than an hour (I think it was Feyd Rautha Dark Heart) after she took a shitload of acid and just poured herself into it as fast as she could. There's a kind of purity to that. She was always manic and weird, but somehow, at her very best, it was like she was able to harness all that craziness and channel it into genuinely good songs.

    On paper, this new album seems to bear all the same descriptors of her old music: it's weird, eclectic, poppy, hyperactive, fun, dark, etc. And yet something feels off to me. The AAA production values give all the songs a certain crude and garish quality, even the stronger songs. When I compare the new studio version of Realiti to the original demo that we all fell in love with, it doesn't hold up as well. The song is fundamentally great, so it's still enjoyable enough, but something has definitely been lost, something in the underlying feeling of it.

    Relistening to her older shit this morning and then playing the new album again, I'm realizing that, in spite of how wild and manic she used to be, there was actually an under-acknowledged sense of subtly and restraint in her music, especially her best songs. Her pop songs didn't exactly have epic choruses, but they had a enough pop tendencies to hold your attention, and when she mixed that with a certain blissed out/pure quality, it ended up working really, really well. I'm specifically thinking of songs like Be a Body, Night Music, the Realiti demo, Crystal Ball, Genesis, and others. It's funny how much of a deal was made about her failed attempts at writing pop songs for other mainstream artists, because it actually doesn't surprise me at all. Grimes pop songs just do not sound like Rhianna pop songs. Stadium pop singers wouldn't touch a song like Realiti or Be a Body, because the pop elements are so abstracted, not just by the ethereal production style (which could changed if needed) but by the actual song composition itself. This hasn't really changed. Flesh Without Blood may have a certain Taylor Swift-esq level of pop-rock production, but there's still no chorus as gripping as Shake It Off. This wasn't really an issue when the songs were presented with cooler production and a much better sense of overall style and atmosphere, but she seems to be shedding all of that and exchanging it for something that doesn't complement her music nearly as well. I think if she were trying to write Oblivion today the song would get kinda fucked up in her new process, which I suspect is the reason that there's not a single track on this album that's as good as Oblivion.

    It's a bummer because I genuinely feel that Grimes has an endless amount of future potential, and as someone who was excited to hear all the music that she was going to bring into existence, I hope she can clear her head a bit and make something better again. It would be kind of tragic if this was it. It makes want to go through her archive of unreleased material to see if any other Realiti-level demos are being left unreleased because of some bizarre sense of taste.
    I can't agree with you more. And everything you said hits home when you listen to Oblivion, Genesis, or "David" an amazing track she didn't even bother fucking releasing. Absurd isn't it? I"m still convinced the scrapped album was the real album she should have released, which would have been as good as Oblivion. She didn't want to because it sounded "depressing" wtf???? I mean, WTF.

    I don't thinks she bounces back from this and that's sad as hell. So many times i listened to Halfaxa and Visions driving home at night. Real shame.
    Last edited by Rabbit; 02-03-2016 at 02:08 AM.

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post

    I don't thinks she bounces back from this and that's sad as hell. So many times i listened to Halfaxa and Visions driving home at night. Real shame.
    You don't think she can bounce back from her most critically and commercially successful album?

    The only place where Art Angels has had a negative impact on her career is in your head.
    Last edited by Dream; 02-03-2016 at 03:40 AM.

  8. #218
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    LOL exactly! It's your right to dislike something but it's very clear that most do not share your point of view. It's fine either way.

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dream View Post
    You don't think she can bounce back from her most critically and commercially successful album?

    The only place where Art Angels has had a negative impact on her career is in your head.
    This means absolutely nothing. Given how popular she was getting it was obvious the album was going to be her most commercially successful to date, regardless of what the end product was and i could care two fucks about music "critics" they haven't been relevant in decades.

    I'm seeing a lot of her popularity coming from her image right now. She's "in" at this moment. That will pass.

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dream View Post
    You don't think she can bounce back from her most critically and commercially successful album?

    The only place where Art Angels has had a negative impact on her career is in your head.
    He's mad because Grimes didn't make the music he wanted to hear. Grimes doesn't owe him anything, so he's free to listen to something else. It's a bit ironic that Art Angels was even more acclaimed than Visions despite being more accessible/pop.

  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mantra View Post
    It's weird how the very thing that you love about an artist can sometimes flip, where that exact same quality now comes across as a negative thing.
    I just wanted to say that this was a really excellent example of how to critique an artist here without just repeating "I don't like it". I'm not saying everyone should write quite as much as you did to put their point across, but you've at least explained your reasoning and that's great, thanks!

  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmtd View Post
    I just wanted to say that this was a really excellent example of how to critique an artist here without just repeating "I don't like it". I'm not saying everyone should write quite as much as you did to put their point across, but you've at least explained your reasoning and that's great, thanks!
    yeah, i mentioned that before, too...but a certain member of the leporidae family came back anyway to continue being a jerk.

    i thought the Kill V. Maim video was fantastic. i was smiling and giggling the whole time (as was my wife). the only part that bugged me was that certain parts seemed like the lipsync was slightly off, but then it would come back into sync, so i can only assume it was intentional? idunno. but that has become our favorite song on the album and i'm glad it got such an awesome video (i wasn't nearly as into the video for Flesh Without Blood / Life In The Vivid Dream).

  13. #223
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    She has one album that diverts from her previous work and people freak. I'm not the biggest fan of pop, and being a new found fan of Grimes for only a few months, I can say that Art Angels is one of the only albums I bought on a whim and instantly enjoyed not knowing what to expect. Her older material is something I could get lost in for hours, but the new stuff just gives another sense of clarity, feels, and euphoria every time I listen to it. It's a great thing when you can go through an artists discography and find something more accessible to your ears that isn't shit.

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    I'm seeing a lot of her popularity coming from her image right now. She's "in" at this moment. That will pass.
    Well, shit it's a good thing that once it does, all the music people dig will still be there, huh? *slow claps*

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    I got impatient waiting for the 2 albums to come, so I ordered the other 2 while I was waiting. The parts to attach my vaporizer to this new bubbler thing should be arriving this weekend as well. I'm sure you'll all be getting my high as fuck review of each album pretty soon.

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  17. #227
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    Mostly sober failed mushroom experience reviews of Art Angels vs Visions:

    Both are good in their own way. Visions feels more like experimental stuff you would play in the background. AA seems to expand on that and refine the pop elements while at the same time getting weirder in some ways (singing styles?) without going off track somehow. I'll need repeat listens but right now I think I like AA more.

    edit notes: more engaging, makes you wanna dance and sing. Sad songs with a powerful hopeful fuck it attitude that's finally breaking out?
    Last edited by Wolfkiller; 02-05-2016 at 05:07 PM.

  18. #228
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    Current final verdict: This is definitely a love affair. She genuinely seems like she's just having a blast creating. She's very admirable.

  19. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfkiller View Post
    Current final verdict: This is definitely a love affair. She genuinely seems like she's just having a blast creating. She's very admirable.
    She's admirable because she's having a blast creating? I'm pretty sure every "musician" or kid with a keyboard and laptop is having a blast creating in their bedroom, why else would they be doing it?

    She began interesting, now she's just boring. And it's funny to me now because when i think about it, when i think back to her tumblr posts i kept wondering to myself "wtf is this girl saying right now" and worrying about some of the crap she was spewing, and references and names she would drop.

    Now it all makes sense. Her last two albums were great because she essentially mimicked old school skinny puppy with her vocals on top. It worked, to an amazing result. Now she seems to have ran out of ideas so she'll try to be cheeky and ironic for as long as she can.

  20. #230
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    Why else would they be doing it? Is that really a question? How much soulless bullshit gets made for the sole purpose of appealing to the masses in order to get rich?
    You change your username to Whiney Hate Machine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    Her last two albums were great because she essentially mimicked old school skinny puppy with her vocals on top.
    what

    tencharacters

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    I just saw her live.

    She exceeded my extremely high expectations.

    See her if you can.

    The Art Angels songs sound great live and some of the old ones sound better now.

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    also if any of you guys liked SCREAM as much as I did Aristophanes released her debut EP a couple of weeks ago

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    lol, she never sounded like skinny puppy

  25. #235
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    For someone who puts an inordinate amount of effort into scrutizing her references and cultural signifiers as "poserish", you sure seem to actually hear things that aren't audibly there. It's not like it sounds like ICP, either.

    I think you're too emotionally invested in Grimes, Rabbit.





  26. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    She's admirable because she's having a blast creating?
    Uhh…yes. Sure, what some create isn't as spectacular as others (see: a million bands, artists, directors, etc.) but how isn't creating admirable? Could do worse with your time. Like trolling forums, but I digress.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    I'm pretty sure every "musician" or kid with a keyboard and laptop is having a blast creating in their bedroom, why else would they be doing it?
    Uhh…correct. Who’s disputing this? I guess it’s time to go to the bedroom of some kid you know who’s honing a craft to tell them what they’re doing isn’t admirable…it’s probably a waste of their time. But I digress.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    She began interesting, now she's just boring. And it's funny to me now because when i think about it, when i think back to her tumblr posts i kept wondering to myself "wtf is this girl saying right now" and worrying about some of the crap she was spewing, and references and names she would drop.
    Fair opinion. *shrugs*

    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit View Post
    Now it all makes sense. Her last two albums were great because she essentially mimicked old school skinny puppy with her vocals on top. It worked, to an amazing result. Now she seems to have ran out of ideas so she'll try to be cheeky and ironic for as long as she can.
    So? Like Wolfkiller said, tons of shit is created for the one singular purpose of cashing in. How is this new and/or worth whining about? Sure, we all bag on musicians that are washed up (Marilyn Manson anyone?) but you lost me at the SP name drop there. That’s a bit of a reach. Also, lol @ saying she won’t “bounce back” from an album that’s got her touring all over. How’s your tour going?

  27. #237
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    Grimes = Evil Dead Trilogy
    EDT went from mostly horror, to an equal mix of horror and comedy, to mostly comedy. Important note: the horror and comedy in these movies is really it's own thing. You can't be mad at Army Of Darkness being funny because the humor is still very Evil Dead and not just an Adam Sandler movie starring Bruce Campbell. The production value also slowly increased.
    That's how I feel after listening to all four albums. The first 2 are mostly experimental weird trance noise. Light sometimes nonsensical vocals. Visions was similar but had more pop structure and singing/lyrics. AA is mostly pop but it's still very Grimes and weird despite the catchier sound.

  28. #238
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    LOL at the notion that "she seems to have ran out of ideas so she'll try to be cheeky and ironic for as long as she can." The album has pretty much been well received everywhere. It's sold pretty well for being on an independent label. If you don't like the music, fair enough. But to say that she's run out of ideas or has become boring is clearly wrong.

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    ^ yep

    Google the word "tastes"

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    Some of you are funny in here. Really.

    On one end you blast me for saying she's like everyone else having fun... Bieber used to sing in the streets, probably because he enjoyed it. Now that he became a rich douche that studio execs took a hold of because of $$$ signs i'm sure most of you would consider him one of those "cashing in" But then when the criticism i have of grimes is thrown into the mix it's "well she's been well received" so i clearly must be wrong. Well received by fucking whom? The people that also shove crap down everyones throats? Cut the crap. You can't reference something only when it supports your arguments.

    Referencing having mass appeal when it suits your needs isn't fooling anyone. The irony here is that Grimes was and probably still is extremely worried of how people view her. She has definitely bent her style to what she assumes would please the most individuals possible.

    From what i see of her is that she clearly WANTS to be extremely popular. That's the fucking irony here.

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