Boston Marathon

[Deepvoid]

Oh yeah. Where were all the gun owners yesterday? They're armed to defend themselves, after all.

As Cenk Uygur from TYT said:
"If shooter killed 17 people in Boston Marathon w/ assault rifle it wouldn't get near the reaction it would if a terrorist kills 3 w/ a bomb. Our reaction as a country to Boston Marathon is going to be completely different if it's a Muslim w/ a bomb or a white shooter w/ a gun."

[Sutekh]

I don't think anyone ever said Muslim. You mean Saudi? Saudi was claimed by a few sources... as was "right-wing" and a bunch of other things that were completely pulled from the media's ass: http://politix.topix.com/homepage/55...an-for-bombing

Yeah no-one has any reason to suspect anyone in particular at the moment, but to be fair, Islamists or members of the Far-Right are the most likely options given the nature of what's happened and how it would fit into their respective worldviews

but there's other options, it could be something to do with mexico, iran, north korea. Could be an unabomber style lone axe grinder, or a spree killer. Going to stick my neck out and say it's almost certainly not an element of the far-left

[sweeterthan]

I got lightheaded at that picture, the shock...but on the upside, it probably doesn't hurt.

i guess that's an upside. :-/

I am trying to avoid the media coverage today. The speculation, the yapping about the same horrific events over and over. I just can't deal with it.

On the subject of people looking at the gory pictures: I understand why some folks would want to look at it. It's a very sobering and real way to absorb such a tragedy. For me tho, I can't do it. All I can think of is the mental and physical pain that these people are going through right now and I don't need to see it to imagine their pain. It won't get better for them for a long time and that's the part that is so heart wrenching for me.

[Fixer808]

Yeah no-one has any reason to suspect anyone in particular at the moment, but to be fair, Islamists or members of the Far-Right are the most likely options given the nature of what's happened and how it would fit into their respective worldviews

but there's other options, it could be something to do with mexico, iran, north korea. Could be an unabomber style lone axe grinder, or a spree killer. Going to stick my neck out and say it's almost certainly not an element of the far-left

Well, so far there's absolutely no clue whatsoever, so I certainly wouldn't speculate as to who may or may not have been responsible.

[ambergris]

I will start to speculate who's responsible once we know who's responsible.

[Sutekh]

Hmm to be honest, I disagree. By reading the political context and using rational deduction, you can speculate sensibly.

[october_midnight]

Canadian musician Matthew Good weighs in.

I've said it before, I'll say it endlessly...he's spot on.

[allegro]

This is reminding me, a lot, of the Atlanta Olympics Bombing.

I hope the FBI learned its lesson from that bombing, where they incorrectly blamed this poor guy and basically ruined his life, when it was really done by this guy.

[DigitalChaos]

What I don't get is, why the hell do people want to look at pictures of dismembered and wounded people?? Not just this thread, elsewhere too. Click this, it's ESPECIALLY gory!! That's some sick voyeurism right there.

I didn't see anyone actively seeking the extra gory stuff in this thread, just reacting to it. The warning labels were for those who choose not to look.
Why do some people look at them? Well, why does anyone even care about this news? People want to know what is happening in the world around them. The news is reality. The pictures are reality. Some people chose to water down the reality. I propose that doing so will alter your perception of the reality. There have been several instances where public perception of a war were dramatically shifted when a photo of the human damage was circulated. Sure, they all knew that horrible shit was happening... but seeing it changed things.
Sure, this will probably increase the purely emotional reactions that I detest, but reality is reality.



There are also the people attracted to the dark side of things. I mean... this is fucking ETS right?
"i've always been attracted to darker things, that's excited me, you know, what, how far things can go, if there's a snuff film i want to see it you know what i mean. i'm not supporting it but yeah i guess maybe i am but i am curious you know i want whatever that farthest level some can go." - Trent Reznor (2002)

[miss k bee]

Annoying people on Twitter feeding misinformation by putting up pictures of an 8 year old girl they think died in the bombing who was running for Sandy Hook, although it was an 8 yr old boy that died

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...usaolp00000003

and also pics of the man who was alledgely going to propose to his girlfriend at the end of the man cradling her.

[wizfan]

Speaking of Twitter, a popular Greek blogger tweeted a very insensitive joke about the Boston marathon, causing a huge amount of uproar. I feel ashamed.

[Amaro]

As Cenk Uygur from TYT said:
"If shooter killed 17 people in Boston Marathon w/ assault rifle it wouldn't get near the reaction it would if a terrorist kills 3 w/ a bomb. Our reaction as a country to Boston Marathon is going to be completely different if it's a Muslim w/ a bomb or a white shooter w/ a gun."

This man on break at work was saying something like "I hope it's just some messed up college kid behind it, or else..."

Referring to the possibility of it being foreign terrorism. And how that's where he has a problem.

[DigitalChaos]

As Cenk Uygur from TYT said:
"If shooter killed 17 people in Boston Marathon w/ assault rifle it wouldn't get near the reaction it would if a terrorist kills 3 w/ a bomb. Our reaction as a country to Boston Marathon is going to be completely different if it's a Muslim w/ a bomb or a white shooter w/ a gun."

This man on break at work was saying something like "I hope it's just some messed up college kid behind it, or else..."

Referring to the possibility of it being foreign terrorism. And how that's where he has a problem.

The easier it is to draw a line between "average American" and whoever causes a problem the easier it is for everyone to start blaming the "other" group. "Muslim" is more different than "white guy with a gun" is more different than "random college kid"


It's the stupid fucking tribalism that runs rampant in humanity.

[slave2thewage]

I don't think anyone ever said Muslim. You mean Saudi? Saudi was claimed by a few sources... as was "right-wing" and a bunch of other things that were completely pulled from the media's ass: http://politix.topix.com/homepage/55...an-for-bombing

Eh, it was the whole mention of countries like Iraq and Pakistan in one of the posts here. Mama can read the subtext.

[thelastdisciple]

What I don't get is, why the hell do people want to look at pictures of dismembered and wounded people?? Not just this thread, elsewhere too. Click this, it's ESPECIALLY gory!! That's some sick voyeurism right there.

That's pretty much what i said about when those Luka dismemberment "snuff" style videos came out and after the news broke that it was an actual real person being slaughtered, people were still going about it as if it were just an outtake from a fucking Saw movie or something, "NOT ENOUGH BLOOD, TURN THEM FOUNTAINS UP", "THIS ISN'T REALLY THAT GOREY GUYS", "CUT HIS FINGERS AND TOES OFF, DO IT NAOW!" etc.

Apparently it still never clicked in that it was a REAL person in there. I'm sure it'd be a different story if it was a bit more intimate....

Ugh, people are just so happy with being their desensitized selves these days.

I don't think we're all going to have to be surgeons, and have to get ourselves used to this stuff. There's no need for this fetish.

[allegro]

This man on break at work was saying something like "I hope it's just some messed up college kid behind it, or else..."

Referring to the possibility of it being foreign terrorism. And how that's where he has a problem.

Again, though, as I said (above), a terrorist bomb doesn't have to be "foreign."

[orestes]

Oklahoma City, Olympic Park, Amtrak Sunset Limited-- all domestic attacks. If this was done by a foreign source we would know by now.

[Wretchedest]

I agree. If this was by some group, especially an international group, responsibility would have been claimed. ideas asserted. If the bombing meant something to the attacker/s we would know what it was.

[DigitalChaos]

I've always found it interesting how we can't call it terrorism when it's a US citizen that does it. Especially if they aren't muslim.

I am waiting for the day that we start calling it terrorism and open up the global battlefield to include our own land. That'll be a great excuse to continue stepping on the rights of our own citizens. Hopefully Boston isn't used as a justification. There have been several people asking for increased government in response to this but it doesn't seem to exist heavily in the media rhetoric. I'm hoping that means this event won't be used for political gain. It would be a nice change of pace...

[Aladdinsanity]

I am waiting for the day that we start calling it terrorism and open up the global battlefield to include our own land. That'll be a great excuse to continue stepping on the rights of our own citizens. Hopefully Boston isn't used as a justification.

[hollowed_point]

I've always found it interesting how we can't call it terrorism when it's a US citizen that does it. Especially if they aren't muslim.

Um, I live in Oklahoma City, and ever since the moment we found out it was Tim McVeigh and Terry Nichols we have called it terrorism. DOMESTIC terrorism, but terrorism nonetheless. Don't see your point.

I am waiting for the day that we start calling it terrorism and open up the global battlefield to include our own land. That'll be a great excuse to continue stepping on the rights of our own citizens. Hopefully Boston isn't used as a justification. There have been several people asking for increased government in response to this but it doesn't seem to exist heavily in the media rhetoric. I'm hoping that means this event won't be used for political gain. It would be a nice change of pace...

Asking for increased government? Who (other than probably Bloomberg) has been calling for this? I've seen calls for heightened security at major venues nationwide (which makes sense and won't be permanent) but I haven't heard anyone screaming that we need more legislation. Are you trying to bait people, or what?

[Satyr]

Oh yeah. Where were all the gun owners yesterday? They're armed to defend themselves, after all.

Just curious....How are you saying someone armed with a firearm defends themselves against a bomb?

[miss k bee]

Sarcasm mate!

[playwithfire]

Just curious....How are you saying someone armed with a firearm defends themselves against a bomb?

how do i sarcasm is this bad

-----

To actually contribute something to this, which I don't *think* has been posted yet, I liked Patton Oswalt's words about this:

[Satyr]

Sarcasm mate!

Why bring up gun owners or firearms at all then? What was the point?

[orestes]

Obama declared it an act of terrorism yesterday. You were saying?

Oh right, that the U.S. government will declare war on its own citizen in it's war on terrorism and everything it entails: rendition, indefinite detention, drone attacks.

Right? Right?

/straw man argument

[DF118]

Just curious....How are you saying someone armed with a firearm defends themselves against a bomb?

Exactly! Everyone should carry bombs around with them all the time instead, this would be far less likely to happen.

[DigitalChaos]

Asking for increased government? Who (other than probably Bloomberg) has been calling for this?

My phrase was "There have been several people asking for increased government in response to this but it doesn't seem to exist heavily in the media rhetoric."

Here are the few instances of people asking for increased government that I've seen:

Peter King asking for more camera surveillance
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid..._cameras_.html

"This particular incident is going to cause the administration and Congress to evaluate our overall security programs around the country, particularly for major events. We can't leave it just to the communities that host these events to provide the security."
http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/po...other_suspects

Barney Frank saying that we should increase taxes to increase government involvement




I don't even care what these people are asking for. It's fucked up that people are leveraging this situation to advance politics... especially when we have no idea what actually happened.

[Space Suicide]

[hollowed_point]

My phrase was "There have been several people asking for increased government in response to this but it doesn't seem to exist heavily in the media rhetoric."

Here are the few instances of people asking for increased government that I've seen:

Peter King asking for more camera surveillance
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid..._cameras_.html

"This particular incident is going to cause the administration and Congress to evaluate our overall security programs around the country, particularly for major events. We can't leave it just to the communities that host these events to provide the security."
http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/po...other_suspects

Barney Frank saying that we should increase taxes to increase government involvement




I don't even care what these people are asking for. It's fucked up that people are leveraging this situation to advance politics... especially when we have no idea what actually happened.

So you're saying that because the bare minimum for the definition of "several" are insisting on more government interference in our lives that they speak for the majority of American citizens/politicians? Seriously? Peter King may be trying to further a political agenda, but he is, from everything I've seen, speaking as a small minority. If you seriously think that something he mentioned in a single interview is going to affect NATIONAL POLICY then you are absolutely blind to what is going on here.

Your second link is to the remarks of Saxby Chambliss, a "ranking" republican from Georgia, on how we can't leave security for events involving people from all corners of the globe up to local officials. Hardly concrete evidence of the opinion of the PEOPLE AND POLITICIANS REPRESENTING THE MAJORITY OF THE UNITED STATES.

Finally, Barney Frank, a FORMER congressman, gives his opinion on the situation and perhaps hints that the government needs to be more involved than necessary. A valid source for the opinions of the majority of American politicians/citizens? I think not.

Now, to quote you:

I am waiting for the day that we start calling it terrorism and open up the global battlefield to include our own land. That'll be a great excuse to continue stepping on the rights of our own citizens. Hopefully Boston isn't used as a justification. There have been several people asking for increased government in response to this but it doesn't seem to exist heavily in the media rhetoric. I'm hoping that means this event won't be used for political gain. It would be a nice change of pace...

In your last post, you took your OWN WORDS out of context. You were explicitly trying to imply that prior to this point, every domestic terror attack in this country has been used as a stepping stone to "stepping on the rights of our own citizens," and that it was BOUND to happen again, but you HOPED it wouldn't. I'm arguing that you are wrong, you are fear-mongering, and that what you are implying is flat-out wrong. Quoting me 3 examples of somewhat influential politicians/former politicians does not justify the fear you are trying to incite.

Yes, it's very fucked up to use this situation to advance politics, but it is not the majority, and this country isn't going to turn into a carbon copy of 1984​ because of it.