Controversial Music Opinions...

[aggroculture]

I'm still a pretty big Morrissey fan, I've heard the vast majority of what he's published and, honestly, if you find the music uninteresting, you're totally correct. It's bland, pedestrian rock music as played by a band of middle-aged men who would be gigging at pubs and bar mitzvahs if not for their friendship with Moz, and it's a whole lot of Morrissey's love-it-or-hate-it personality. You're still trying, though, so you must be seeing some value in his music. I'll take a different tact in trying to convert you. People like Morrissey because, as a songwriter, he has a gift for writing lyrics that are broadly, deeply relatable while being vague enough to be open to vastly different interpretations. His songs are very rarely autobiographical, they're about wheelchair-bound geniuses, faded boxers, glamourous gangsters, British nationalists, guilt-ridden priests, and other compelling characters. He writes with an almost supernatural level of empathy, an empathy which is all the more interesting when seen in light of the man's surly, narcissistic personality. Morrissey is not dissimilar to the Jack Nicholson character in As Good As It Gets - a nasty, bitter little man who can only see all the beauty in the world through his art. If that paradox fascinates you, you'll get a lot of mileage out of Morrissey. If all you can see is the boring music and the vain prick singer, look elsewhere. The world's full of good music and Morrissey's got enough fans.

I think that's very well put. What I would add is Morrissey's knack for nailing great, great pop melodies and marrying them to lyrics you'd never think would work as pop hooks: writing a song around the phrase "the world is full of crashing bores" and making it work is an example of what makes Morrissey a genius. You hear some of his songs and go "how the fuck did he do that?" I think when it comes to pop he's a professional and talented in ways that most frontmen/lyricists do not come close. He's really good at encapsulating a certain feeling or mood or idea with a lyric and a melody, and making you feel at that same time that you've never heard it before and you knew it all along. That's why I think Morrissey is among what the best pop has to offer. I also think he's gotten better and better with age: I don't have much love for The Smiths, but I love Morrissey's solo material, in particular his 00s albums.

[hobochic]

Love this thread.

I think it's interesting, hobochic, that you're still seeking conversion after having seen most of what Morrissey has to offer and still not feeling it. I'm still a pretty big Morrissey fan, I've heard the vast majority of what he's published and, honestly, if you find the music uninteresting, you're totally correct. It's bland, pedestrian rock music as played by a band of middle-aged men who would be gigging at pubs and bar mitzvahs if not for their friendship with Moz, and it's a whole lot of Morrissey's love-it-or-hate-it personality. You're still trying, though, so you must be seeing some value in his music. I'll take a different tact in trying to convert you. People like Morrissey because, as a songwriter, he has a gift for writing lyrics that are broadly, deeply relatable while being vague enough to be open to vastly different interpretations. His songs are very rarely autobiographical, they're about wheelchair-bound geniuses, faded boxers, glamourous gangsters, British nationalists, guilt-ridden priests, and other compelling characters. He writes with an almost supernatural level of empathy, an empathy which is all the more interesting when seen in light of the man's surly, narcissistic personality. Morrissey is not dissimilar to the Jack Nicholson character in As Good As It Gets - a nasty, bitter little man who can only see all the beauty in the world through his art. If that paradox fascinates you, you'll get a lot of mileage out of Morrissey. If all you can see is the boring music and the vain prick singer, look elsewhere. The world's full of good music and Morrissey's got enough fans.

Thanks for that post. Yeah, I have a fascination for stuff that provokes me. I guess I have a tendency to get attracted to people I don't fully "get" as well. I liked your description of why you love Morrissey more than Morrissey and find this bit especially interesting:

"His songs are very rarely autobiographical, they're about wheelchair-bound geniuses, faded boxers, glamourous gangsters, British nationalists, guilt-ridden priests, and other compelling characters. He writes with an almost supernatural level of empathy, an empathy which is all the more interesting when seen in light of the man's surly, narcissistic personality."

That's the kind of stuff that gets me interested. Can you tell me what songs are about "the wheelchair-bound genius", the "faded boxer", the "glamourous gangster" and the "guilt-ridden priest"?

I hope I like those.

[BlueCalx]

As for my controversial opinions, here goes:

Grunge was totally worthless from Nirvana on down. It's '80s college rock but with major label cheesemeister production, as played by jerkoffs with unbearable rock god messiah complexes. If you can read Kurt Cobain's journals and still think that he's a cool guy, you've got a stronger stomach than me and I just wrote a paragraph-long post about my love of Morrissey, ferchrissake.

Rage Against the Machine were inferior to Limp Bizkit.

Dinosaur bands like the Pixies or My Bloody Valentine who want to tour endlessly without ever bringing out new material need to hang it the fuck up.

Aggressive, bro-ey dubstep in the vein of Skrillex is totally awesome. I like the introspective, ambient stuff too, but I love the booming wubs at clubs and parties.

Of course the Beatles are great, but so is Frank Sinatra. Both are talented artists who were enormously influential, and who have no purchase at all on contemporary pop culture. If you call yourself a music fan at all, it's important for you to hear this stuff, but there's no point in trying to force yourself to have a relationship with that music that's like the one your parents or your grandparents had with it. Appreciate it for what it is but live in 2012, not a retro hipster fantasyland version of the '60s. Also, in the case of the Beatles, the music is so ubiquitous as background noise that to say you like their songs is a lot like saying you enjoy breathing air. Saying "I hate the Beatles" is either just straight-up trolling or moderately interesting cocktail party small talk.

[spegettiwestern]

Not sure why I didn't recall this earlier but I think Radiohead is pretty shitty. I've listened to every album a few times, whether forced to after announcing how boring I think they are or just out of curiosity for being the only person I know that isn't into it. I really don't get why they're regarded so highly.

I'm pretty much all alone for that one, I think, but I just feel that everything they do is mind-numbingly tiresome from the vocals, lyrics, to the production, etc. But everyone else thinks so highly of this band that my complaints are typically drowned out with their boring rants about how Thom Yorke's a musical genius or something.

[Conan The Barbarian]

Not sure why I didn't recall this earlier but I think Radiohead is pretty shitty. I've listened to every album a few times, whether forced to after announcing how boring I think they are or just out of curiosity for being the only person I know that isn't into it. I really don't get why they're regarded so highly.

I'm pretty much all alone for that one, I think, but I just feel that everything they do is mind-numbingly tiresome from the vocals, lyrics, to the production, etc. But everyone else thinks so highly of this band that my complaints are typically drowned out with their boring rants about how Thom Yorke's a musical genius or something.

This.

This band makes me want to puke. I gave them a shot, but ended up wanting to shoot myself.

[Space Suicide]

This.

This band makes me want to puke. I gave them a shot, but ended up wanting to shoot myself.

To be fair it takes time to like or appreciate what Radiohead creates. I enjoy them but it literally took years for me to even begin to like them.

I do think they're horribly overrated though and I think the King of Limbs sucks.

[AvelineCyborg]

Not sure why I didn't recall this earlier but I think Radiohead is pretty shitty. I've listened to every album a few times, whether forced to after announcing how boring I think they are or just out of curiosity for being the only person I know that isn't into it. I really don't get why they're regarded so highly.

I'm pretty much all alone for that one, I think, but I just feel that everything they do is mind-numbingly tiresome from the vocals, lyrics, to the production, etc. But everyone else thinks so highly of this band that my complaints are typically drowned out with their boring rants about how Thom Yorke's a musical genius or something.

You're not alone, trust me. I really don't get it either. I like only 3 songs from them which are Creep, Karma Police and Paranoid Android. If their stuff sounded like those songs more often I might dig them. Unless there's an awesome album of theirs I've overlooked. It's true that I probably haven't really given them a fair chance (sounds like you really have).

So far this thread has touched upon ones I agree with such as Iron Maiden, U2, Tool and others. One I can think of right now that I think is vastly overrated is Guns N' Roses. I really don't get their appeal especially considering what Axl Rose has become in recent years. With him alone I can hardly take this band seriously.

[Sutekh]

I absolutely love Amnesiac (which everyone seems to hate), and think Kid A & OK Computer are really good albums with very thick atmosphere. But yeah outside of that they bore me as well to be honest! It's really odd, they were shit hot at the turn of the century but zzzz before and after

people are writhing in pain at all this

[spegettiwestern]

That Radiohead cover band, Muse sounds better than Radiohead to me.

[pigpen]

Pink Floyd is better than Led Zeppelin.
In fact, Led Zeppelin is boring as all hell.. I don't know for sure how most people feel about them, but I just don't care.


Holywood is better than Antichrist...

James Brown was better before the "godfather of soul" era.

Jane Doe is not that great, IMO, You Fail Me is far superior.

Calculating Infinity Is boring compared to Miss Machine

Metallica's "old stuff" may be just as, if not more, boring than there later albums..

Leonard Cohen sucks

Thelonious Monk sucks

The majority of Primus albums are shit... they are pretty awesome live though!

Chronic 2001 is WAY better than The Chronic.

NWA sucks

Tupac sucks, Hologram mode was creepy.

Billie Holiday is better than Ella Fitzgerald and Etta James combined.



...There's more, I'm sure. Feels good to let it out!!!

[DVYDRNS]

Oh here we go.

Hows this for controversial...

I think Post Fragility era trent reznor music is over rated as hell. its not good. Those soundtracks.. yea give me a few months worth of living expenses and whatever instruments i want... I could have done those. no problem. and I'm sure many here could have done the same. He is not innovative. and don't get me started on the slip. Disgusting pile of trash. Embarrassing. And HTDA is crap. I wish Atticus would spend his time on something good... like a full length Error record...

Look at reznors Spotify playlists. they are stuck in the past. He refuses to be inspired by current artists. He was better when he took inspiration from his peers. whether he considered himself to be ripping them off or not... he was better then. I keep hoping he gets it back, and i still see moments of hope with things like the immigrant song and tetsuo. but overall i'm disappointed continually.

I downloaded the Niggy Tardust record. and it sucked. Then I downloaded the instrumental version, and it was awesome. I'm sure only because it was leftovers from Fragile music.
Tool is a band full of members who don't give a crap about whats good anymore. only whats technical. they all sit around in studio jerking off and recording it, and their fans are the most obnoxious people in the world who fall for it every time. The only thing I like about tool is I'm pretty sure they're fully aware of it and get a huge kick out of the fact that they've gotten away with it this long and are still making money off of it.

Cortini isn't that good. Unless he's remixing something.

TR Screwed up bad when he lost his connection with Clouser.

Radiohead... Oh jeeze... how over rated can this band get... why are people still talking about this band...

Bands like M83 and Big Black Delta and A Place to Bury Strangers are far more inventive than the reznor camp of today. Which only makes sense, because they are younger and allow themselves to be inspired by their peers. they aren't lazy. They want to be better than everybody else. and that causes them to push boundaries.

Switching Gears.

Lady Gaga... Anybody who's a fan of this music is a slave.


You might ask why I'm on this board anymore... because i grew up here i guess. I was here first.

[wizfan]

Look at reznors Spotify playlists. they are stuck in the past. He refuses to be inspired by current artists.

Actually, he does listen to some current stuff. Most of the "oldies" playlists were played before the concerts. Check out his "current driving music" playlist, there's a LOT of contemporary stuff such as Simian Mobile Disco, SBTRKT, Tobacco and even Foster the fucking People.

Okay, here's my controversial opinion: I love Korn. Almost everything they've done, I love to bits (except a few albums I disliked a lot, such as Untouchables). And I looooved their last two releases.

Also, I love St. Anger. I know it's bad. I know WHY it's bad. I've seen the documentary. But I still love it for what it is.

I dislike Madonna. Not because she's super-famous or anything, I don't care at all about her celebrity status, but I never really got into her stuff.

Aerosmith. They do have some good tunes, but Steven Tyler is shit.

I love Audioslave.

King Diamond always sounded to me like a drunk Rob Halford.

I love Isis, they have some excellent tracks, but I cannot listen to any of their albums in one sitting without losing my focus. Ditto for Neurosis.

I can't get into old, "classic" heavy metal stuff. Ditto for many "classic rock" stuff. Yeah, I know a lot of the bands I listen to suck hard. But sometimes, I find "bad" music to be much more interesting than stuff everybody loves. And sometimes I just want incredibly dumb and loud stuff, like Excision.

And one more thing: James Blake? He sucks. Most overrated artist of the decade.

Whoa, that felt good.

[Ryan]

I love Isis, they have some excellent tracks, but I cannot listen to any of their albums in one sitting without losing my focus. Ditto for Neurosis.

Really? Opposite for me; I can't not listen to their albums in their entirety. They put me into a trance; especially Wrists Of Kings up to Garden Of Light. Eargasm galore.

[wizfan]

Really? Opposite for me; I can't not listen to their albums in their entirety. They put me into a trance; especially Wrists Of Kings up to Garden Of Light. Eargasm galore.

I guess I should give them more extensive and careful listens.

[BRoswell]

yea give me a few months worth of living expenses and whatever instruments i want... I could have done those.

Go for it. I want to see someone actually do this instead of brag about how they could make a better record.

He refuses to be inspired by current artists.

And then you mention these guys...

M83 and Big Black Delta and A Place to Bury Strangers

...who are obviously inspired by past artists instead of current ones? Please.

My controversial opinions:

Shitty bands and artists have always existed. MTV brought them into our homes for us to see, and social media has brought us even closer to them. The idea that there are more shitty bands and artists today then there were back in "the good ol' days" is a myth.

Rap music has been polluted by the "gangsta" mentality. Give me rappers who talk about real issues, joke around, or even do both at the same time. You can keep your cash, your bling, and your bitches.

Dubstep. I...don't get the appeal, especially when techno is so much better.

I hate the idea of having to hate a band just because they became popular. I like a lot of popular bands, and I like a lot of obscure bands. As long as the music is good and makes you feel something, why should the level of popularity bother anyone?

[Iran_Ed]

Oh here we go.

Hows this for controversial...

I think Post Fragility era trent reznor music is over rated as hell. its not good. Those soundtracks.. yea give me a few months worth of living expenses and whatever instruments i want... I could have done those. no problem. and I'm sure many here could have done the same. He is not innovative. and don't get me started on the slip. Disgusting pile of trash. Embarrassing. And HTDA is crap. I wish Atticus would spend his time on something good... like a full length Error record...

Look at reznors Spotify playlists. they are stuck in the past. He refuses to be inspired by current artists. He was better when he took inspiration from his peers. whether he considered himself to be ripping them off or not... he was better then. I keep hoping he gets it back, and i still see moments of hope with things like the immigrant song and tetsuo. but overall i'm disappointed continually.

I downloaded the Niggy Tardust record. and it sucked. Then I downloaded the instrumental version, and it was awesome. I'm sure only because it was leftovers from Fragile music.
Tool is a band full of members who don't give a crap about whats good anymore. only whats technical. they all sit around in studio jerking off and recording it, and their fans are the most obnoxious people in the world who fall for it every time. The only thing I like about tool is I'm pretty sure they're fully aware of it and get a huge kick out of the fact that they've gotten away with it this long and are still making money off of it.

Cortini isn't that good. Unless he's remixing something.

TR Screwed up bad when he lost his connection with Clouser.

Radiohead... Oh jeeze... how over rated can this band get... why are people still talking about this band...

Bands like M83 and Big Black Delta and A Place to Bury Strangers are far more inventive than the reznor camp of today. Which only makes sense, because they are younger and allow themselves to be inspired by their peers. they aren't lazy. They want to be better than everybody else. and that causes them to push boundaries.

Switching Gears.

Lady Gaga... Anybody who's a fan of this music is a slave.


You might ask why I'm on this board anymore... because i grew up here i guess. I was here first.

I'm going to try to keep this short, but you boil most of your argument down to the fact that Trent's living in the past. Are you sure it isn't you? I don't mean that in a condescending way, but one of the most prevalent complaints I hear about older bands is that they were better in the past. Bands grow, change and evolve. Since you used NIN and Radiohead as examples, I'll expand my opinion on the two. The run of Fixed through Still contain the majority of my favorite halos, now that period was over ten years ago. Trent's life was in shambles and I doubt he would want to go to that place again. With Teeth my not be one of my favorite NIN moments, but it could be seen as a sober rebirth. Approaching things with a different mindset and putting space between those dark days. I'd rather see my favorite artists healthy and creative, than brilliant and self destructing. I feel the same about Radiohead, there's a line on Supercollider that goes "I have jettisoned my illusions I have dislodged my depressions". In Rainbows has become my favorite from them. It may not be their best, but it sounds free of pressure(which it wasn't), confident and human. I remember hearing Jigsaw Falling Into Place for the first time and thinking Thom Yorke is singing about being at a party and enjoying himself. That's a long way from most of the subject matter on OK Computer. They've grown, they've changed and now the talent comes out in different ways.

[jmtd]

Look at reznors Spotify playlists. they are stuck in the past. He refuses to be inspired by current artists. He was better when he took inspiration from his peers. whether he considered himself to be ripping them off or not... he was better then. I keep hoping he gets it back, and i still see moments of hope with things like the immigrant song and tetsuo. but overall i'm disappointed continually.

You've hit the Nine-Inch Nail on the head. I was just listening to Skryllex and thinking the next NIN record definitely needs some WUB-WUB-WUB

[pigpen]

^
That WAS controversial! I agree for the most part, except for With Teeth. Everything else, meh. Ghosts Especially. I suck, and I could have made it. A lot of the art that came with that was pretty boring too.

[Space Suicide]

Yeah, Ghosts bores me. I own it but haven't touched it since I got it, back in 2008.

[piggy]

To hobochic, I would recommend the following Morrissey tracks...

For a good time: "Glamorous Glue", "The Last of The Famous International Playboys"
For melting your heart: "Now My Heart Is Full", "You Should Have Been Nice To Me"
Just plain nice to listen to: "Everyday Is Like Sunday", "Jack The Ripper"

[PooPooMeowChow]

I am really sick right now but

I kinda like Audioslave

[Space Suicide]

I am really sick right now but

I kinda like Audioslave

I don't get the hate at all. Audioslave are awesome, I think I was one of the few who were dismayed when they announced their end.

[PooPooMeowChow]

I don't get the hate at all. Audioslave are awesome, I think I was one of the few who were dismayed when they announced their end.

Cornell's lyrics in Audioslave are laughable and almost nonsensical. He voice isn't as good as it was in Soundgarden, I think he blew it some time in the mid 90's.
They also really over produced. almost no life in any of the songs.
I really like Audioslave cause I get to hear the Rage band stretch their legs and do something different, they're real talented. Cornell just drops the ball.

I can only hope the new Soundgarden album doesn't ruin my favorite bands perfect discography.

[Ryan]

To hobochic, I would recommend the following Morrissey tracks...

For a good time: "Glamorous Glue", "The Last of The Famous International Playboys"
For melting your heart: "Now My Heart Is Full", "You Should Have Been Nice To Me"
Just plain nice to listen to: "Everyday Is Like Sunday", "Jack The Ripper"

And for sheer unsurpassed lyrical brilliance, Maladjusted -






And, my personal favorite Moz track of all time, Ammunition -

I know these roads; an old hand understands. Above all, I know what's expected of me now, veering cliffwards. I don't need more ammunition, I've got more than I can spend. I don't dwell on things I'm missing. I'm just pleased with the things I've found.

[DVYDRNS]

Pay me a few months of living expenses and I will do it as I pointed out. And I didn't say it would be better. I said I could do something of the same caliber. But nobody would care because I'm not Trent reznor...

And the other bands I've mentioned... They are obviously inspired by past bands. That's not an issue. But they take what's current and build upon it. They are far more exciting than anything Trent's doing.

[Corvus T. Cosmonaut]

Chris Cornell has an okay voice in a very 1990s-alt-rock vein, but he's never in his career played to material that could put it to any kind of good use. Every band he's been in has the smell and taste of old boots netted in shit-foul sewage at the reclamation plant, and his solo material so uninspired and just so plodding it's a wonder anyone even still cares who the guy is at all. Part of this may stem from Cornell's not being a particularly good or interesting musician, another part's probably the problem of his lyrics (he could score third place in my high school talent show, maybe), and certainly his awful taste in music is a significant contributor. It also doesn't help that there's zero emotion in any of those moments where he's swinging for the fences.

Metallica? Man, it's not even controversial to talk shit about Metallica at all. They have an okay album, their first, and everything thereafter has been a waste of time. I know some people argue they've taken up the metal torch with gusto lately, but they haven't, and the people making these claims should be ignored as unworthy of attention.

It's a sweet mercy that I don't ever hear the name (or music of) 'Tori Amos' any more.

[xmd 5a]

The Smiths have never really clicked with me ("How Soon is Now" aside, love Marr's sound on that one). Enjoy a bit of Moz's solo stuff, though.

Isn't Anything > Loveless

New Order > Joy Division

Republic is fucking amazing, on that note

Can't stand Oasis. Blur were millions of times more creative (and their songs were catchier too)

Not overly into Radiohead pre-Kid A

I feel really guilty whenever I illegally download an album (unless it's incredibly rare or unavailable). *Note: I'm not against it at all*

[jmtd]

New Order > Joy Division

Republic is fucking amazing, on that note

I might get Republic one day, but today is not that day. "Regret" is great. Then I'm stuck. Help please? Just about any other NO album I can name at least two tracks that are great, but not Republic. (TBH I haven't got 'Technique' yet either.)

[Ryan]

I might get Republic one day, but today is not that day. "Regret" is great. Then I'm stuck. Help please? Just about any other NO album I can name at least two tracks that are great, but not Republic. (TBH I haven't got 'Technique' yet either.)

World, Ruined In A Day, Everyone Everywhere, Liar, Chemical, Special, and the beautiful Avalanche with Gillian Gilbert on vocals.



It was always special
It was like water down the drain
I'm intoxicated
Every time I hear your name
I try to remember
But nothing is the same
It was always special
it was like water down the drain

Patiently you wait for me
You're so blind
I thought it couldn't be
Then changed my mind
Drowning in the endless sea
Line all those lines
The traces of your memory
Don't belong with mine

[jmtd]

World, Ruined In A Day, Everyone Everywhere, Liar, Chemical, Special, and the beautiful Avalanche with Gillian Gilbert on vocals.

Just to be clear, do you mean those songs from the YT vid you supplied (queued): because if you meant the album tracks (obv. excepting Avalanche) maybe we'll have to agree to disagree or maybe it will click one day… it just hasn't yet.

in order for Eddie Vedder to show up at a random Best Western in Arizona, a little tipsy and hanging with the local drunks, and performing the best version of "Where the streets have no name" ever, in karaoke

Not a patch on the Pet Shop Boys cover :P