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Thread: NIN supports reproductive rights and Planned Parenthood. Get over it.

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by WorzelG View Post
    How can anyone who is a right wing evangelical Christian have got into NIN in the first place? Have they read the lyrics, it doesn’t even compute
    I would actually guess that perhaps some of them just like the sound of the music itself, nor do they mind certain songs and lyrics. It's kind of like how there are actually Christians and/or conservatives that don't mind watching R-rated films/TV shows or playing violent video games. And that from the looks of it, conservatives and Christians seem to outnumber liberals and atheists in real life, or at least depending where you go. I still see what you mean though, but the exceptions sometimes still exist as unbelievable as they might seem to be. (Since most actual Christians wouldn't be comfortable with some of NIN's messages as it wouldn't match their lifestyle.) There's also a chance that they could also be able to appreciate NIN the way we do outside of religious and political contexts. I've also been able to enjoy songs even when it came to messages I didn't believe in or agree with either.

    Oh, and then you have Christians that also abstain from all the types of entertainment I've mentioned. Some even go as far as avoiding all secular music. Of course, not all of them are the same, but it even goes to the point where some of them would make one wonder about how or why some of them would've gotten into any type of secular music at all in the first place. Christians that only listen to Christian music are still a thing even until now.

    I've always speculated that perhaps, unlike Marilyn Manson, it's nowhere near as obvious. With Nine Inch Nails, you have to dig a bit deeper to get that bigger picture. At least for me, it's easier to see how casual fans of NIN from the religious right can get into NIN with all of that unnoticed, while still getting over the profanity or songs like Terrible Lie and Heresy, or Closer and The Only Time.

    As I've mentioned in my Nine Inch Nails & Christian conservatives thread, it would be like coming across Ted Nugent fans that also happen to be Democrat and/or liberal/progressive/atheist/agnostic.

    And then, as mentioned, there could've been casual fans that have no idea about Trent Reznor's opinions on politics and religion.

    As for being against abortion, and this is nothing new, most Christians I know in real life, which are generally conservative as expected, both Adventist and Catholic are still very much thoroughly convinced that it's murder. I know the debates as to how and why it wouldn't be murder, but they still believe it's murder, and are often quick to say "Abortion is murder.", which would make it a sin to them, or just wrong, just from simply leaning right even from that ones that aren't necessarily Christians. On top of that, they already believe that fornication and promiscuity, like masturbation itself is a sin, that is lust and adultery, and that all sex is basically to be saved for heterosexual monogamous relationships under God's command, including procreation and starting a family altogether. In fact, starting a family is one of their main reasons for getting married. To them, that makes marriage to mean more than just being in love and having a loving relationship with somebody. (Which by default is also against same-sex marriage, once you also include their typical stance on that particular issue as well.)

    Anyway, this is clearly no surprise for me regarding Trent's views, but I obviously still see and still accept why it's one of those debates/arguments that'll never go away. I'm also very much pro-choice as well.

    @elevenism - To think that I almost forgot to mention you. You already know how much I love to see your take on these types of topics with NIN.
    Last edited by Halo Infinity; 08-27-2019 at 08:54 PM. Reason: I'm sorry. There were so many points I kept forgetting. I think I got them all for now.

  2. #32
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    All you need to know about the people complaining and saying they're no longer fans: they take the lyrics of Capital G to be something to aspire to.
    Someone fucking quoted it at me like "maybe YOU need to know the lyrics better!" when discussing Year Zero being an obvious tip off for Trent's political views.

    Some of the best people I've ever met are NIN fans. The majority of my good friends are.
    But god damn if some fans just have to prove that there are assholes in every group...

  3. #33
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    Nice. I wish there were more rap and hip-hop artists up there. They have huge fanbases, and they make some of the most vocal, in your face lyrics to begin with, so I am sad to see that they are mostly absent from this list.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halo Infinity View Post
    I would actually guess that perhaps some of them just like the sound of the music itself, nor do they mind certain songs and lyrics. It's kind of like how there are actually Christians and/or conservatives that don't mind watching R-rated films/TV shows or playing violent video games. And that from the looks of it, conservatives and Christians seem to outnumber liberals and atheists in real life, or at least depending where you go. I still see what you mean though, but the exceptions sometimes still exist as unbelievable as they might seem to be. (Since most actual Christians wouldn't be comfortable with some of NIN's messages as it wouldn't match their lifestyle.) There's also a chance that they could also be able to appreciate NIN the way we do outside of religious and political contexts. I've also been able to enjoy songs even when it came to messages I didn't believe in or agree with either.
    Yeah, I often get a lot of push-back from other Christians (not my immediate church family who seem to get it) on my taste in art and political views. I don't have a lot of conflicting feelings listening to Trent's lyrics as a Christian because I see them as an honest expression of the human condition. And whatever conflicting emotions I DO experience are good for me to have, because art should stir something like that up in you.

    It doesn't matter if you are a Christian or something else or nothing at all: his lyrics are a sincere reflection of what human beings actually go through and the feelings they experience. Even in its ugliness it's beautiful to me, because it's truthful. It's a reminder to me to be gracious and kind to others because I KNOW that I've felt the exact same way at times and so has everyone else. Trent's work helps me value the humanity and dignity in everyone at all costs because we have the shared experience of suffering in one form or another.

    Religious adherents that follow a man/God who calls Himself the "truth" shouldn't have issues with a truthful, artistic expression of humanity. Because the Bible doesn't paint a rosy, 1950's version of human kind at all. The Bible contains TONS of violent and sexual themes. The entire focus of the Bible if you read it from start to finish is on the fallen human condition in contrast to God. People get lost in the short devotionals and fantastical Sunday school stories without considering the entire book as a whole and then turn around and use a text they don't even read in full to subjugate and abuse others.

    I don't see how a Christian could in good faith get angry with songs like Terrible Lie where it has lines like "Hey God, why are you doing this to me?" and "I want so much to believe" meanwhile they will recite Bible verses in church like "help my unbelief" and "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?". Like, it's okay if Biblical heroes say this stuff, but if a random musician says the exact same words in a more modern vernacular, it's suddenly a problem? How does that make sense?

    I think a lot of the reaction from Christians towards art is both a problem of bad theology as well as centuries long back-and-forth between the art community and cultural Christendom. I had to do a project on this years ago for school, and it's been really interesting (but tragic) to see how the church has at times fully embraced, encouraged and even helped fund/inspire great works of art, only to immediately turn around and demonize artists. You can see a really good example of what I'm talking about immediately after the Protestant reformation, where protestants saw the art, music and creative architecture of the Catholic church as an extension of idolatry and sought to destroy it all. It's not the only example of this either.

    Anyway, I want cultural Christendom to die quickly and thoroughly. In my opinion it's bad for Christians and downright dangerous for everyone else. The impact of Christendom on things like abortion rights (which, let's be clear here. Evangelicals did not give a damn about until the late 1900's and abortion has existed in one form or the other since the dawn of time) cannot be overstated.

    Woof, that rant was too long and sorta got away from me. And I would agree with you: a lot of people just don't think critically about the lyrics they are singing either in the car on the radio or in church on Sundays for that matter. Kind of reminds me of that Nirvana song "In Bloom". "He's the one who likes all our pretty songs/and he likes to sing along/and he likes to shoot his gun/but he don't know what it means."
    Last edited by eachpassingphase; 08-28-2019 at 10:28 AM. Reason: Edited because the caffeine hasn't kicked in and I can't spell

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by eachpassingphase View Post
    You, like everyone else in the world, are a political creature who exists within a political structure, even if you don't believe that you are or are purposely trying to avoid it. Within your own post you made several very political statements while decrying people who also make political statements.

    I'm pretty far left, but I hope you'll hear me when I say sincerely that I am not interested in telling you what to think as much as encouraging you to consider how you arrived at the political positions that you hold (because you indisputably hold political positions. You expressed them in black and white in your post). Consider how the positions you hold, even if they are positions of apathy or frustration may affect other people. Consider what the consequences may be for yourself and others if you are wrong or even just slightly off the mark. All of us have been at one point or another. Changing your mind after researching, thinking and listening is not a thing to be angry about or embarrassed about. It's just part of the human experience and it's normal.

    Other humans encouraging you to re-examine your views on the world, culture and politics is not slavery or oppression. It's encouraging you to a sort of freedom that nobody else can give you: the freedom to change your mind when you are presented with hard facts and shared experiences of others. That's sometimes awkward and even painful to do, but it's necessary. If you aren't willing to consistently examine yourself on the behalf of others, consider doing it for yourself. You don't have anything to lose by really dissecting what you believe and how you arrived at those beliefs. If nothing else, it will make you a more critical thinker and that's never a bad thing. Who knows? Maybe you will retain all of the same beliefs you did before a thorough self-examination. But probably not. You owe it to your fellow humans to examine your opinions regularly, and you certainly owe it to yourself.

    As for the response you get from people on one end of the political spectrum that you don't belong to: I get it. It can be hard to have respect for people who are screaming at you or insulting you for not sharing their political views. But there are very high stakes for real-life human beings. It's very hard to not be passionate and even angry about some of these issues. Their anger with your views (or lack of stance at all) might be justified. You don't have anything to lose by considering that.

    Again, this isn't a condemnation of you or your post, nor telling you that you absolutely MUST hold one position or the other. It's just an encouragement to evaluate your thoughts, as we all should. I'm sure everybody here has some views on culture or politics that have morphed and changed over time. We should be regularly challenging each other to think about what we know to be true.

    Lastly, I want to push back against something you mentioned about all sides being the same. You seem upset at the idea of people telling you what to think, and I would like to point out that by accepting the "both sides are the same" mantra, you've already been told what to think and have swallowed it whole. That mindset in and of itself is a bit of propaganda that lots of politicians and corporate entities are spending billions of dollars selling to you. The "enlightened centrist" point of view is something that has been packaged and sold to you by people who have a very vested interest in you feeling that way. Political apathy and centrism is a political position that is just as valuable as political extremism to those in power.

    Just something to think about. I hope you didn't read this and hear snark in my comment to you, because there was none intended whatsoever.

    i wish i could be as articulate as you were in this post, very nicely put

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by eachpassingphase View Post
    Yeah, I often get a lot of push-back from other Christians (not my immediate church family who seem to get it) on my taste in art and political views. I don't have a lot of conflicting feelings listening to Trent's lyrics as a Christian because I see them as an honest expression of the human condition. And whatever conflicting emotions I DO experience are good for me to have, because art should stir something like that up in you.

    It doesn't matter if you are a Christian or something else or nothing at all: his lyrics are a sincere reflection of what human beings actually go through and the feelings they experience. Even in its ugliness it's beautiful to me, because it's truthful. It's a reminder to me to be gracious and kind to others because I KNOW that I've felt the exact same way at times and so has everyone else. Trent's work helps me value the humanity and dignity in everyone at all costs because we have the shared experience of suffering in one form or another.

    Religious adherents that follow a man/God who calls Himself the "truth" shouldn't have issues with a truthful, artistic expression of humanity. Because the Bible doesn't paint a rosy, 1950's version of human kind at all. The Bible contains TONS of violent and sexual themes. The entire focus of the Bible if you read it from start to finish is on the fallen human condition in contrast to God. People get lost in the short devotionals and fantastical Sunday school stories without considering the entire book as a whole and then turn around and use a text they don't even read in full to subjugate and abuse others.

    I don't see how a Christian could in good faith get angry with songs like Terrible Lie where it has lines like "Hey God, why are you doing this to me?" and "I want so much to believe" meanwhile they will recite Bible verses in church like "help my unbelief" and "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?". Like, it's okay if Biblical heroes say this stuff, but if a random musician says the exact same words in a more modern vernacular, it's suddenly a problem? How does that make sense?

    I think a lot of the reaction from Christians towards art is both a problem of bad theology as well as centuries long back-and-forth between the art community and cultural Christendom. I had to do a project on this years ago for school, and it's been really interesting (but tragic) to see how the church has at times fully embraced, encouraged and even helped fund/inspire great works of art, only to immediately turn around and demonize artists. You can see a really good example of what I'm talking about immediately after the Protestant reformation, where protestants saw the art, music and creative architecture of the Catholic church as an extension of idolatry and sought to destroy it all. It's not the only example of this either.

    Anyway, I want cultural Christendom to die quickly and thoroughly. In my opinion it's bad for Christians and downright dangerous for everyone else. The impact of Christendom on things like abortion rights (which, let's be clear here. Evangelicals did not give a damn about until the late 1900's and abortion has existed in one form or the other since the dawn of time) cannot be overstated.

    Woof, that rant was too long and sorta got away from me. And I would agree with you: a lot of people just don't think critically about the lyrics they are singing either in the car on the radio or in church on Sundays for that matter. Kind of reminds me of that Nirvana song "In Bloom". "He's the one who likes all our pretty songs/and he likes to sing along/and he likes to shoot his gun/but he don't know what it means."
    Yes, I sometimes have difficulty capturing how I'm able to find beauty within the perceived "ugliness" of NIN, and this post just about NAILS it. Pun fully intended.

    I like to say that the truest label I could put on NIN, above "pseudo-industrial" or whatever labels people have thrown at it, is "electronic-based existential blues." I feel like TR can portray human pathos in a way that few others can, bar maybe Leonard Cohen or Tom Waits.

    I also really love your nuanced views on your own religion. We all have to take a step back and make sure that we're not too deeply entrenched in attitudes that sometimes come with the territory of whatever our individual belief systems are. Even for me, as a non-religious person, I have to consciously remind myself to not jump to conclusions about the religious folks around me and make sure I'm not assuming that they will have no understanding of or crossover with my beliefs and ideals.
    Last edited by piggy; 08-29-2019 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Forgot to quote the post I was referring to, etc.

  7. #37
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    Facebook is legit the most mean spirited site I've ever been to lol. What a pool of garbage that website is.
    Props to Trent and Atticuss for this.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyperpower View Post
    i wish i could be as articulate as you were in this post, very nicely put
    Hey, thank you. That made my day!

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    Trent has always been outspoken when it comes to politics, etc. His music is laced with it. As far as I'm concerned, he's on the right side of history on every issue and I find it baffling there are people who oppose his views while listening to his music. Seriously odd.

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    This seems like an echo chamber, thanfully.

    There is no such thing as being apolitical. Everything is political, especially art and performance. Barney the Dinosaur is political. The toilet paper mascot bears are political, everything. It can't be escaped.

    Pro-lifers are already fucking idiots, so it doesn't surprise me they came out of the woodwork on facebook to bitch

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    It's kind of funny how just about all of my friends (many of them NIN fans, fwiw) who spent the Bush/Obama years proclaiming their "apolitical" worldview wound up becoming ardent trump supporters. It's almost as if apolitical means anti-political more than it implies an absence of political viewpoints.

    NIN was very connected to the formation of my own politics. Helps that I got into the band during the Year Zero era, but I think the album that spoke most to me in this sense was The Downward Spiral. To follow up all that chaos, destruction, nihilism and absolute self-loating with a song like Hurt - "If I could start again, a million miles away, I would keep myself, I would find a way" - was overtly anti-fascist in its effect on me, now that I think about it. The protagonist in TDS has every reason to hate the himself and the world, to want to destroy it, to long for his own destruction- he rails against religion, capitalism, isolation, broken relationships, and all these forces that make him feel weak and powerless, bereft of any sense of hope... and yet after it's all too late, he longs to live, and regrets the waste and wreckage of his anger and hatred. NIN validated my anger, it helped me recognize I wasn't alone in my loneliness, but more than anything, Trent seemed to be asking "What are you gonna do about it?" NIN has always come across to me as extremely optimistic and empowering in message, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. The true revolutionary spirit in NIN isn't in the chaos or the anger of songs like Head Like a Hole or Heresy or what have you, but in those somber moments that look back after the storm has passed. It's in songs like Hurt, Over and Out, In This Twilight and Zero Sum. It's about not letting that anger define you. It's about finding whatever shred of light you can in the darkness of everything - which is very real - and not letting it get swallowed by nihilism and politics of destruction.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wretchedest View Post
    This seems like an echo chamber, thanfully.

    There is no such thing as being apolitical. Everything is political, especially art and performance. Barney the Dinosaur is political. The toilet paper mascot bears are political, everything. It can't be escaped.

    Pro-lifers are already fucking idiots, so it doesn't surprise me they came out of the woodwork on facebook to bitch
    I think when most people say "apolitical" what the really mean is "non-partisan."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wretchedest View Post
    The toilet paper mascot bears are NIGHTMARE MONSTERS FROM CTHULU'S REALM
    fixed that for you

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    Quote Originally Posted by streetman View Post
    Trent has always been outspoken when it comes to politics, etc. His music is laced with it. As far as I'm concerned, he's on the right side of history on every issue and I find it baffling there are people who oppose his views while listening to his music. Seriously odd.
    Everyone can appreciate the idea and themes presented within Year Zero without subscribing to a political party. Govt control and manipulation of the people is present in all parties

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    Quote Originally Posted by Helpmeiaminhell View Post
    I am as pro choice as anyone but when TR has been silent for 6 months and has not said a word about any sort of Fragile 20th anniversary special, nothing about Bird Box deluxe, nothing about new NIN or HDTA and makes zero social media posts on any forum and shows 0 interest in interacting with his fans via twitter/fb/ETS....But then breaks his silence by posting political stuff....Like dude, just fuckin release the 20th anniversary of The Fragile and the Bird Box deluxe. I could give a fuck about politics. Save that shit for Richard Patrick...*havent read the comments section yet. About to read it now. I am sure it is filled with enlightening feedback. L oh el*
    It's not up to you what Trent posts about. It's his fucking band. Don't like it? Don't read it. If you're wondering why he doesn't post more, it's because of comments like this.

    And for the record, aside from Bird Box, he never said anything about a 20th anniversary edition of The Fragile or new NIN/HTDA this year.

    EDIT: Fuck it. I've got more to say. Some of you guys need to realize that there are bigger things going on in this world than whether or not there's going to be a new Nine Inch Nails album this year, or whether or not Daddy Trent is going to fulfill your every wish that you've deluded yourself into thinking is going to come true just because you want it. It's incredibly irritating watching the fanbase scoff whenever Trent & Atticus put out new NIN music, then put on their sad puppy faces when they don't get what they want. Why should Trent & Atticus give in to a hostile fanbase anyway? Why shouldn't they just follow their own creative instincts and personal beliefs to the max and say to hell with whatever Joe Blow from Nowhere, Idaho thinks they should do, especially when Joe Blow from Nowhere, Idaho is going to complain anyway? It's utter bullshit the way fans act like spoiled brats. It's one thing to be disappointed when certain projects don't come to fruition. I get that behavior. It's another thing to take a simple post and make it all about themselves and endlessly whine about how unfair every single post is to them because it doesn't completely align with what they think the band should be doing. You're not special just because you like a band, and you don't get a say in what they do just because you bought some albums and merch.
    Last edited by BRoswell; 08-29-2019 at 11:11 PM.

  16. #46
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    Honestly I suspect if Trent got more and more outwardly political it would increase the odds of a blisteringly angry new NIN album or EP being conceived.

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    I've been kinda hoping for this, seeing how much the W administration riled him up. There's currently so much more fodder here and now.

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    Entertainment is one thing, removing people's freedoms and trying to shut the voices of reason is another, hopefully more people turn from faith to reason and critical thinking. Why not put ban of flying into space - to Moon, to Mars, etc - after all it's not how god intended, right? There are way more pressing issues surrounding us than legislating birth control... Humanity is weird.

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    Hey remember when Paul Ryan claimed to be really into Rage Against the Machine lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenAkenobi View Post
    Entertainment is one thing, removing people's freedoms and trying to shut the voices of reason is another, hopefully more people turn from faith to reason and critical thinking. Why not put ban of flying into space - to Moon, to Mars, etc - after all it's not how god intended, right? There are way more pressing issues surrounding us than legislating birth control... Humanity is weird.
    i know you're from russia so i don't know if you don't have a comprehensive understanding of the issue, but planned parenthood does a lot more than just birth control. they perform STD screenings, pap smears, and other potentially life-saving medical procedures for women. they also provide access to abortions for those who choose to have them, which should be up to those people themselves. and it is important, because approximately half the population needs access to reproductive healthcare, whether it be preventative or of any other nature.

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    I certainly don't devalue all of this, in fact it's a very natural thing to develop in a democratic society - healthcare and family care. Living in another country does give a perspective - I see that there's a lot of money going in unhealthy direction like warfare and luxury for people in power, that should be spent on humanitarian issues... But it's an endless topic, going for as long as society itself.
    All in all, the more famous people make their voice heard on political things, the better. As long as they don't call for bombings, that is.

    As for the comment about TR having a 7-digit paycheck from Disney corporation all for himself and not donating to charities and activism... How can you be sure? You apparently want a Twitter post every now and then saying Reznor and Ross gave (insert number) dollars to (insert charity) or what?

    ---edit---
    And that comment was removed, huh? Alrighty then, moving on...
    ---end of edit---
    Last edited by BenAkenobi; 08-31-2019 at 12:14 AM.

  22. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wretchedest View Post
    This seems like an echo chamber, thanfully.

    There is no such thing as being apolitical. Everything is political, especially art and performance. Barney the Dinosaur is political. The toilet paper mascot bears are political, everything. It can't be escaped.
    I actually feel the same exact way about religion, but I'm sure that's because the majority of my family and friends are also religious conservatives. This is what ultimately lead to my fascination on the combination of politics and religion and how it can affect us on both geopolitical and sociopolitical scales. I've witnessed more than evidence for that, especially in people's personal lives right in front of me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wretchedest View Post
    Pro-lifers are already fucking idiots, so it doesn't surprise me they came out of the woodwork on facebook to bitch
    Perhaps it's just the way you worded it, but I just thought you'd get a kick out of this bit by Bill Hicks.



    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroSum View Post
    It's kind of funny how just about all of my friends (many of them NIN fans, fwiw) who spent the Bush/Obama years proclaiming their "apolitical" worldview wound up becoming ardent trump supporters. It's almost as if apolitical means anti-political more than it implies an absence of political viewpoints.
    This is so true. There have been so many times when I've seen this from Adventists. At least Catholics don't downplay politics and are far more direct and crystal clear on their sociopolitical stances. Not all Adventists, but when they ever mentioned anything about being apolitical or non-partisan, it seemed to be heavily anti-political because to them, politics and irrelevant, inconsequential and just useless and worthless, while they claim that only religion and spirituality matters in regards to how their own personal lives and the lives of others surrounding them are affected. They dismissed politics as "worldly" and just irrelevant and useless in the grand scheme of spirituality and religion according to them.

    But when I see just how very much connected their religious views are with sociopolitical ideologies and parties, it's just incredibly and extremely undeniable that politics is always inevitable no matter how much they try to dodge politics. I'm no where near a hardcore political person, but hearing them dismiss the differences between Democrats/liberals and Republicans/conservatives also irritated me on some level, because while there might be some similarities and agreements can still exist between humans, there are also very undeniable distinctions between the two and many flavors beyond the two, just like how religion and spirituality have a plethora of flavors as well. And sure, while people can be the same on minuscule and colossal levels/matters, there's also just no such thing as "Everybody is 100% the same all the time." either, even outside of religion and politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroSum View Post
    NIN was very connected to the formation of my own politics. Helps that I got into the band during the Year Zero era, but I think the album that spoke most to me in this sense was The Downward Spiral. To follow up all that chaos, destruction, nihilism and absolute self-loating with a song like Hurt - "If I could start again, a million miles away, I would keep myself, I would find a way" - was overtly anti-fascist in its effect on me, now that I think about it. The protagonist in TDS has every reason to hate the himself and the world, to want to destroy it, to long for his own destruction- he rails against religion, capitalism, isolation, broken relationships, and all these forces that make him feel weak and powerless, bereft of any sense of hope... and yet after it's all too late, he longs to live, and regrets the waste and wreckage of his anger and hatred. NIN validated my anger, it helped me recognize I wasn't alone in my loneliness, but more than anything, Trent seemed to be asking "What are you gonna do about it?" NIN has always come across to me as extremely optimistic and empowering in message, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. The true revolutionary spirit in NIN isn't in the chaos or the anger of songs like Head Like a Hole or Heresy or what have you, but in those somber moments that look back after the storm has passed. It's in songs like Hurt, Over and Out, In This Twilight and Zero Sum. It's about not letting that anger define you. It's about finding whatever shred of light you can in the darkness of everything - which is very real - and not letting it get swallowed by nihilism and politics of destruction.
    I don't think I can add to this at all. I had the same exact thing in mind and you put it into words in the best way possible right now. It's definitely about trying to find his place and purpose in the world, and how the world has also affected him and while trying to figure out what to do about/with it.

    Come to think of it, I'm sure this is also what made me appreciate Nine Inch Nails for quite some time outside of my mental and emotional journeys with it, as I was already fascinated with the connection between religion and politics since 2004, and even without realizing it, even since 1997, it's just that I had no idea that those beliefs entered the political realm at the time until I first learned about this very abortion debate for the first time when I was just in middle school.

    With that being said, as of now my opinions and general thoughts and emotions regarding both religion and politics seem to have remained very much aligned with Nine Inch Nails, so there never has been any conflicts or surprises there, only questions, speculation and curiosity, but especially on this topic, there's just no doubt about it.

    And well, more general NIN appreciation me, so it's still a win-win altogether.
    Last edited by Halo Infinity; 09-01-2019 at 10:28 AM.

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