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Thread: Sexual Asshatery in the News

  1. #31
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    Watching football and not exactly sober enough to comment on this. So just sharing the news instead.

    Tambor leaves Transparent amid sexual assault allegations

    Playing Maura Pfefferman on Transparent has been one of the greatest privileges and creative experiences of my life. What has become clear over the past weeks, however, is that this is no longer the job I signed up for four years ago. I’ve already made clear my deep regret if any action of mine was ever misinterpreted by anyone as being aggressive, but the idea that I would deliberately harass anyone is simply and utterly untrue. Given the politicized atmosphere that seems to have afflicted our set, I don’t see how I can return to Transparent.

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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post
    Let's all imagine Charlie Rose nude.
    i think i just threw up in my mouth

    -Louie

  4. #34
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    This is just endless now. I don't know who's next tomorrow. It could be anybody.

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    Gene Simmons, surprise surprise, tried to get someone to grab his penis. He also allegedly claimed that he had done that to other women before. What he allegedly said to the second woman does not surprise me at all. Simmons is a Trump supporter, so Fox News banning him pretty much solidifies this as legit.

    http://www.metalinjection.net/metal-...ual-harassment

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick_Nicholas View Post
    Gene Simmons, surprise surprise, tried to get someone to grab his penis. He also allegedly claimed that he had done that to other women before. What he allegedly said to the second woman does not surprise me at all. Simmons is a Trump supporter, so Fox News banning him pretty much solidifies this as legit.

    http://www.metalinjection.net/metal-...ual-harassment
    I work with a lot of people who have done KISS tours through the decades. I could fill an entire separate thread on the things I've heard about him from people who have worked either for him directly or had encounters with him while working with the band. It makes me sad that people like that EVER achieve success in the first place while decent people live in abject poverty. It really is depressing beyond words to me.

  7. #37
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    I was a GIANT Kiss fan in the 70s, and this is NO surprise at all. If you look up "misogynist dick" in the dictionary, Gene's picture is in there.

    I watched "Family Jewels" and even his long-suffering GF (now wife, I guess) Shannon Tweed LEFT him for his shit, and his KIDS were really pissed at him. He is NOTORIOUS for VOLUMES of photos of his female conquests, he has ZERO respect for women.

    Exhibit A is his NPR Terry Gross interview.

    Paul Stanley: "I can see Gene's ego from my house!"

    Gene is like a perpetual 7th Grader with a boner and a wig.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-20-2017 at 09:32 PM.

  8. #38
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    Wow, I'm totally surprised..... LMAO..... who didn't see this coming? Of course I knew all of his shenanigans with women was going to finally catch up with him. He is the poster-child of misogyny. Shit, I'd bet you if someone did a sex tape with his daughter. He'd find a way to make money off of that. He is an immoral piece of shit.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post
    That said, "famous people" is still too narrow, IMO. A lot of the politicians who will probably be implicated are people you have never heard of. I sure didnt know who the fuck Ron Moore was before the allegations.

    edit: ROY Moore. Not fucking RDM. god
    I still think the title needs to include “sexual harassment,” although I admit it’s legal nitpicking (but still an important legal distinction).

  10. #40
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    a little perspective AL frankin accused by three women asked to resign Trump accused by 16 women
    -Louie

  11. #41
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    And Trump has threatened to SUE all of them, hence why we aren’t hearing from them, anymore (and Trump isn’t suing them, probably because depositions would make things worse).

    A Senator hasn’t resigned in over 100 years.

    Senator John McCain was one of the Keating Five and he didn’t resign.

    It pisses me off that these assholes keep doing whatever they want, but I’m not sure what the “punishment” should be.

    Resigning usually means that NOTHING happens to them.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-20-2017 at 11:18 PM.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louie_Cypher View Post
    a little perspective AL frankin accused by three women asked to resign Trump accused by 16 women
    -Louie
    They should both resign.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by botley View Post
    They should both resign.
    Bill Clinton should have resigned, too, after he was convicted of perjury (let alone the multiple accusations of sexual harassment and sexual assaults and affairs all the way back to Gennifer Flowers during the ‘92 campaign).

    He did lose his law license forever, though.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-20-2017 at 11:14 PM.

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    Dear god. Charlie fucking rose?

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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    The idea that men can't control themselves is why lots of Islam and Orthodox Judaism and Christianity require women to cover themselves, dress modestly, cover their hair, etc., to not "tempt" men. So what's that saying about men? Rhetorically, of course. I'd like to think that men are capable of more than that, aren't just a bunch of stupid walking dangerous impulsive hormones and the women (or girls and boys) gotta hide.
    This is the very root of rape culture. That men cannot control themselves so rapes happen. Not sure why but I feel compelled to point that out.

  16. #46
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    ^The thing about that is that I've sometimes seen people argue that this shit is "natural," and that assertion usually comes packaged with the logical fallacy that everything which is supposedly "natural" is automatically moral or at the very least something that needs to accepted as an unchanging fact of life.

    If there's one thing that concerns me about the whole me too movement and all this post Weinstein stuff, it's that this will inadvertently flip things back to being "just how things are." I mean, if it's like 70% of men do this shit (not just rape, but stuff like Franken), then I almost wonder if it'll become a strength in numbers thing. "Look, what are we supposed to do, ostracize one third of our entire society? This is obviously just how most men are, and yeah it's not nice, but what can anyone do about it, ya know?" If one year from now we've seen like 300 celebrities and politicians lose their careers, I worry that it'll stop being shocking or controversial because we have become desensitized and overwhelmed by it all, and therefor end up feeling like there's nothing to do, no way to change something so widespread and ingrained.

    Which is NOT to say that I'm against this stuff coming out, I'm all for it. I'm just speculating because, honestly, I don't have a lot of faith or trust in American culture to draw the correct conclusions and respond in a good way. I'm trying to remain positive and optimistic about all this, and I'm enjoying it all, but I also wouldn't be terribly shocked if the eventual outcome of this moment ends up being depressing as fuck.

  17. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by elevenism View Post
    Dear god. Charlie fucking rose?
    Ugh. This one hurts.
    Last edited by mfte; 11-21-2017 at 12:54 PM.

  18. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post
    Let's all imagine Charlie Rose nude.
    My brain is already fried from the idea of Harvey Weinstein nude.

  19. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweeterthan View Post
    This is the very root of rape culture. That men cannot control themselves so rapes happen. Not sure why but I feel compelled to point that out.
    Not just rapes, pretty much anything involving control and power. This isn't *really* just about sex. If they needed sex, they could pay for a high-priced call girl. It's about their position of power, and their ability to make women squirm, and assuming that their power is attractive, and assuming that they can get away with anything, because they are in a position of power; many of them have very little (actual) respect for women. This is a demeaning act, not a sexual one.

    Charlie Rose, "I thought it was consensual." (bullshit)

    Dude ... if they are WORKING with you, it can NEVER BE consensual, it's the WORK PLACE. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. Work is not a bar or a place to pick up women. IT'S WORK. Just stop. This isn't even a good EXCUSE, since that excuse is also UNETHICAL AND ILLEGAL. IT'S WORK. NOOOO.

    If anything comes out of this, it will be all of these women standing up -- en masse -- for themselves, making this kind of behaviour VERY RISKY for the harassers and abusers in the future.

    The Downward Spiral was pretty much written ALL ABOUT this power and seeking this power; we had a 50-page thread in here discussing "Reptile" and the power struggle, the hate/redemption factors and Eve/Serpent biblical references.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-21-2017 at 01:30 PM.

  20. #50
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    What really pisses me off right now are people comparing which is "worse" in all of this, and Dems saying that Roy Moore should be yanked ("because he's a pedo!") but Al Franken is okay ("at least he's not a pedo, that's not the same thing").

    They're BOTH WRONG. THEY'RE BOTH BAD.

    They both committed UNETHICAL AND ILLEGAL ACTS OF POWER OVER SOMEBODY ELSE.

    No "but this one is worse" ... where does that end?

    "At least Roy Moore didn't anally sodomize them with the bloody stump of a dismembered fetus!"

    Stop comparing unethical and illegal acts to support your own stance or your own tribe. It's a bunch of shit, it does NOBODY any good.

    "But he didn't assault me."

    WHO FUCKING CARES??!! He did harass and assault others!

    Bill Cosby was supported by Phylicia Rashad, too. That doesn't mean HE DIDN'T DO IT. She should have STFU.

    Like the woman working for Charlie Rose, and women came to her to complain .. did she DO anything? No, she said "that's just Charlie being Charlie." Now she says she failed those women. Yes, yes you did.

    For people who think that sexual harassment "isn't as bad" as sexual assault, no, that's the WRONG view of this shit. IT'S ALL BAD. And, many sexual harassers will move to the next step of sexual assault.

    It's like thinking "emotional abuse isn't NEARLY as bad as physical abuse." Except nobody who's experienced it or anyone who works with the victims agrees with that. IT'S ALL BAD.


    Hey, re the title of this thread: SEXUAL MISCONDUCT is actually an all-encompassing legal term.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-21-2017 at 01:43 PM.

  21. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post
    Well, there IS severity in crimes and usually the punishments try to match the crimes. So, there is some value in trying to discuss that.
    Only if there are criminal charges; this isn't a legal thread, we aren't discussing individual state laws and associated punishment, right?

    Law looks at ALL of these things as 'bad,' not as "well, it was robbery but at least it wasn't ARMED robbery." The Courthouse isn't divided into 'bad' and 'not so bad' crimes.

    And in the work place, sexual harassment or discrimination is often a violation of EEO rules or a violation of policy, and it would require a victim to file a civil suit for relief. Or, the company enforces its policies (not as common as people think) and does an investigation, etc. But, it's far more common for this behavior to be so intimidating (or a potential loss of revenue) that it's hidden, kept secret, swept under the rug.

    Look how many cases of sexual harassment were brought up against Roger Ailes and Bill O'Reilly, because there was a hostile work environment where the women weren't supported at all or just paid to shut up.

    Now, Fox News has established a Workplace Culture Panel.

    Yes, apologists applying their own criteria for the own benefit (progressives, conservatives, whatever) is just slanting the reality to match your own tribal views. This includes Republicans and President Trump, and Liberals and Al Franken.

    I've seen a LOT of Progressives saying that Franken needs to go.

    edit: Love the new thread title, btw!
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-21-2017 at 02:10 PM.

  22. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    Not just rapes, pretty much anything involving control and power. This isn't *really* just about sex. If they needed sex, they could pay for a high-priced call girl. It's about their position of power, and their ability to make women squirm, and assuming that their power is attractive, and assuming that they can get away with anything, because they are in a position of power; many of them have very little (actual) respect for women. This is a demeaning act, not a sexual one.

    Charlie Rose, "I thought it was consensual." (bullshit)

    Dude ... if they are WORKING with you, it can NEVER BE consensual, it's the WORK PLACE. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. Work is not a bar or a place to pick up women. IT'S WORK. Just stop. This isn't even a good EXCUSE, since that excuse is also UNETHICAL AND ILLEGAL. IT'S WORK. NOOOO.

    If anything comes out of this, it will be all of these women standing up -- en masse -- for themselves, making this kind of behaviour VERY RISKY for the harassers and abusers in the future.

    The Downward Spiral was pretty much written ALL ABOUT this power and seeking this power; we had a 50-page thread in here discussing "Reptile" and the power struggle, the hate/redemption factors and Eve/Serpent biblical references.
    you keep insisting itís mostly about power. They donít go for prostitutes because prostitutes are a sure thing... thereís no uncertainty. Itís like why some people get more excitement about cheating on their partners... itís novelty, and rule-breaking, and uncertainty... power COULD be involved... but I insist it isnít power as the main driver in a large portion of cases

  23. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by cashpiles View Post
    you keep insisting it’s mostly about power. They don’t go for prostitutes because prostitutes are a sure thing... there’s no uncertainty. It’s like why some people get more excitement about cheating on their partners... it’s novelty, and rule-breaking, and uncertainty... power COULD be involved... but I insist it isn’t power as the main driver in a large portion of cases
    The Law and experts disagree with you.

    The uncertainty is based on the power.

    It's why "rape" is now known as "sexual assault" in nearly all jurisdictions.

    They don't do this to people of equal or more power.

    Cheating on a partner is NOT the same thing as doing this shit at work or sexual assault. Adultery isn't even illegal, anymore; you don't even need to cite it as a cause of divorce in most counties and states.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-21-2017 at 02:55 PM.

  24. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    The Law and experts disagree with you.

    The uncertainty is based on the power.

    It's why "rape" is now known as "sexual assault" in nearly all jurisdictions.

    They don't do this to people of equal or more power.

    Cheating on a partner is NOT the same thing as doing this shit at work or sexual assault. Adultery isn't even illegal, anymore; you don't even need to cite it as a cause of divorce in most counties and states.
    How is this power defined? Physical? Financial? Reputational?

  25. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by mfte View Post
    How is this power defined? Physical? Financial? Reputational?
    All of the above. Any of the above.

    Here's a good article: https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b00705db52c340

    See also this. http://www.sexualharassmenttraining....-Dynamics.html

    Sexual harassment really comes down to power. Whether it's Quid Pro Quo or Hostile Workplace Harassment, the perpetrator is exerting a form of power when they sexually harass. In Quid Pro Quo sexual harassment, the perpetrator is in a position of power at work and is exerting this power to get sexual favors in exchange for a workplace benefit. In Hostile workplace sexual harassment the perpetrator is deliberately making the workplace a hostile, uncomfortable environment for a coworker. This is also a power play. The perpetrator is saying I will do what I want whether it is disturbing you or not.

    Stopping Harassment is also about power. Both managers and management have the power to stop sexual harassment. The power in an organization lies with managers and supervisors who have been given power within the organizational structure, so that the organization can operate effectively. This power needs to be used for business productivity and not for personal gain. This positive power can come in the form of no tolerance sexual harassment policy and from the example of individual managers.

    A company's sexual harassment policy should be very specific and cover all aspects of sexual harassment. It should be signed by every employee and every employee should be thoroughly trained on appropriate behavior. They should know unequivocally what steps will will be taken if they engage in any type of sexual harassment.

    Managers and supervisors can exert power over Sexual Harassment by their example. They need to take the policy seriously and never joke about it or allow behavior to occur contrary to it. The manager is the most powerful force in stopping harassment.

    Whether it is Hostile Work Environment or Quid Pro Quo, harassment is about power. Make sure your organization is exerting its power for the good of the company and not for personal gain.
    Last edited by Cat Mom; 11-21-2017 at 04:05 PM.

  26. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    Charlie Rose, "I thought it was consensual." (bullshit)
    Yeah, this stupid excuse doesn't even hold up to the most basic scrutiny. He said...

    "I always felt that I was pursuing shared feelings, even though I now realize I was mistaken."
    Oh, you sincerely thought all of this was totally consensual and a-okay. So then what's up with this shit...

    when Rose learned she had confided to a mutual friend about his conduct, he fired her.
    Why fire someone just because she told her friend about a (supposedly) perfectly consensual, ethical, appropriate, relationship? If you're doing nothing wrong, you should have no reason to silence her, bully her, get rid of her, etc. That's the behavior of someone who is fully aware of his own wrong doing and is actively working to protect himself. His claim that he thought it was all consensual is pure bullshit.

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  28. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mantra View Post
    Why fire someone just because she told her friend about a (supposedly) perfectly consensual, ethical, appropriate, relationship? If you're doing nothing wrong, you should have no reason to silence her, bully her, get rid of her, etc. That's the behavior of someone who is fully aware of his own wrong doing and is actively working to protect himself. His claim that he thought it was all consensual is pure bullshit.
    he was doing something that clearly violated the policies of his employers (CBS and PBS), see this.

    VI. HARASSMENT-FREE WORKPLACE ENVIRONMENT
    CBS has a “zero tolerance” policy for sexual harassment or harassment based on race, color, sex, religion, national origin, ethnicity, age, marital status, sexual orientation, gender identity, gender expression, disability, veteran status, height, weight, genetic information, or any other basis proscribed by applicable law. Discriminatory treatment, including sexual harassment and harassment based on a person’s race, age, or other protected status, is strictly prohibited. Unlawful harassment may occur not only as a result of conduct by supervisors, but also due to conduct by directors and/or fellow employees, and, under some circumstances, conduct by customers, vendors, consultants, visitors, and independent contractors. Unlawful harassment can take place in the office or in work-related settings outside the workplace, such as during business trips, business meetings, and business-related social events. This Statement applies with equal force to conduct in all such settings.
    See page 11 of the above-linked document where the company's policies are clearly set out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by allegate View Post
    They really couldn't have picked a more ideal picture for that article. It's perfectly calibrated to elicit maximum revulsion in the reader.

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    So I guess he is Lotso.... oh boy...

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