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Faceplams: Oh noez! The country's in danger! Where's my Life Alert bracelet??Originally Posted by r_k_f
Hierba Gatera
Oh noez! The country's in danger! Where's my Life Alert bracelet??
Last edited by Baphomette; 11-27-2014 at 02:21 AM.
Active Member
So is the police force in the US populated by Hudson from Aliens types - 'game over man', paranoid, trigger happy? It seems like there's no caution and every situation is assumed to be the worst possible scenario - but I guess these are just the stories that get international attention
Active Member
This protest just keeps getting more and more ridiculous. Protesters were piling their cars on the train tracks, seemingly hoping for a collision. I feel really fucking bad for the Brown family. Those people have fucked everything up royally for them.
If he was shot in the back, then there's really no excuse for it, I mean, unless he had a hostage, which he obviously didn't.
Last edited by Frozen Beach; 11-27-2014 at 02:32 AM.
Throbbing Member
More dumbasses
another dead black man
Also just want to mention my father ( a black man) and I have been talking about racism at length and he says he stopped counting at 40 times a long time ago in terms of how many times hes gotten pulled over for no reason and wasn't issued a ticket. He was just saying in his experience its normal for white cops to like to stop black people for no reason. I think many black people in America can identify with this trend.
Last edited by littlemonkey613; 11-27-2014 at 03:07 AM.
Bite me
It's not a "trend," it's always been that way.
Captain Rustleboots
Oh someone absolutely would. I'm on your side with this shooting, those cops should be charged with manslaughter at the least... but white kids are CRAZY. Has a black kid ever shot up a school or a movie theater? The cops may treat the white kid differently but if I saw a 12 year old waving a gun around at a park id call the cops immediately.
Bite me
the news report here in Chicago says that the 911 dispatcher didn't tell the cops that the caller suspected it might be a toy (it technically isn't a toy, it's a pellet gun and is regulated by gun laws in several states and municipalities*), and that when the cops arrived the kid was pointing the gun at the crowd and the cops.
isn't there proposed legislation in California wherein all pellet and BB guns have to be florescent? this is why.
*for instance, in Illinois, a pellet gun isn't excluded from the "Firearms" category:
"Firearm" means any device, by whatever name known, which is designed to expel a projectile or projectiles by the action of an explosion, expansion of gas or escape of gas; excluding, however:
any pneumatic gun, spring gun, paint ball gun, or B-B gun which expels a single globular projectile not exceeding .18 inch in diameter or which has a maximum muzzle velocity of less than 700 feet per second;
(1.1) any pneumatic gun, spring gun, paint ball gun, or B-B gun which expels breakable paint balls containing washable marking colors;
any device used exclusively for signaling or safety and required or recommended by the United States Coast Guard or the Interstate Commerce Commission;
any device used exclusively for the firing of stud cartridges, explosive rivets or similar industrial ammunition; and
an antique firearm (other than a machine-gun) which, although designed as a weapon, the Department of State Police finds by reason of the date of its manufacture, value, design, and other characteristics is primarily a collector's item and is not likely to be used as a weapon.
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 08:44 AM.
Active Member
I am a bit confused by this BB gun story.
I keep seeing these videos of people parading with their assault rifle to support the 2nd amendment. None of them gets shot.
Then, you have this kid playing around with a BB gun and it takes literally 3 minutes for him to get shot and killed by a cop. OK he was waiving the gun around but aren't cops assessing the situation anymore?
They literally drove right up to him and shot him. What happened keeping your distance and taking position behind your door and try talking with the suspect. They would have realized quickly that they were dealing with a freaking kid.
Am I being unreasonable here?
Bite me
From the news reports I've seen, it wasn't a BB gun, it was a pellet gun; in Illinois, that's considered firearm and you need a FOID card to purchase one. And, sadly, lots of kids shoot people every year using real handguns so it wasn't unreasonable for cops to think a kid was holding a real gun. I don't know why that kid was doing that, it's really sad that he was doing that. And maybe those cops should have hid behind a car and asked the kid to put down his weapon, but on the other hand the kid was waiving the gun at bystanders and if those cops thought that was a real gun (and it's reasonable to know why they think it was a real gun), their job is to protect the public. Here, look at this, 12-yr-old kid took a Ruger to school, killed a teacher, happens a lot.
If that *had* been a real gun, and that kid shot up a bunch of people, then you'd be in the gun thread bitching about how that kid got a real gun. In the State of Illinois, it is illegal for that kid to have that pellet gun.
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 11:20 AM.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
That isn't the case in Ohio.
Bite me
It doesn't matter, the cops had to make a split-second decision; their job isn't to serve a protect people with guns, even if those people are kids. The kid was aiming the gun at bystanders according to the 911 caller. This is tragic, sure. Absolutely. A kid died. But, what if that WAS a real gun? Hindsight is 20/20.
Here's the latest report.
Here, look, I wasn't kidding about this.
Have you ever HELD a real AR-15, before? It's incredibly lightweight. It looks and feels like a "toy." I couldn't believe it wasn't a toy.
I already told the story in this thread about MY OWN BROTHER and his friends being shot at by a Sheriff's Deputy, in the 70s, when my brother and his friends were around 12 and were shooting at each other with toy guns. The cop said he thought they were using "real guns." This was in Sterling Heights Michigan which back then was jokingly known as Sterile Whites. This isn't some new fucking phenomenon.
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 12:05 PM.
Active Member
I hope the dispatcher feels like crap.
Just heard the call made to 911. Caller literally said "it's probably fake" twice!
How can you not relay that information?
Active Member
What allegro said.
And for the Ohio situation where it may(?) be legal to open carry, NOBODY is open carrying a gun in their fucking hands. You keep things in a carry position (a holster, across your back, etc) unless you are ready to use it. You'd get shot doing that in any state.
Captain Rustleboots
They should have taken a little longer to assess the situation before they started shooting. Had they waited maybe 5 more seconds the kids life may have not been taken. Treat every situation as though the "gun" is loaded but you also have to treat a 12 year old child like a child.
Bite me
Why? Because a child won't kill you? The rookie cops were under the impression that they were on their way to a "gun run." What if that child had a real gun? And what if he'd shot it at the cops? Then we'd have maybe a dead cop with those "few more seconds?" Would that be okay, then, if the other cop shot the kid and killed him? So then we'd have a dead cop and a dead kid, and then everybody would feel better about this?
I don't love all cops, that's for sure, but that was a dangerous situation and not all children are warm and fuzzy. Hell, in Vietnam, they were trained killers with bombs and guns.
There are plenty of legitimate cases where cops absolutely 100% for no reason whatsoever abuse their authority. Like this case. But, this ain't one of those cases, in my opinion.
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 12:22 PM.
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
There are a bazillion "what ifs" that don't matter. What matters is a child is dead, and the cop acted in a very hasty manner. They gave him zero opportunity to comply with anything, and then lied about their story. They KNOW they fucked up.
And the "gangbanger" comments are just so fucking gross. Jesus.
Active Member
If we are going to play the what if game, maybe it would be worth pulling up the police training for situations like that? I'm PRETTY sure that once someone starts pointing a gun at people the situation has escalated beyond the point of attempting deescalation.
edit: example... they could have stayed at a distance while trying to talk with the perp over loudspeaker... but was there concern that bystanders were immediately in harms way? If so, cops might immediately engage the perp to take their attention off bystanders.
Last edited by DigitalChaos; 11-27-2014 at 12:24 PM.
Active Member
You mean about waiting until all evidence has been presented to a jury before coming to a conclusion? Else you might come to some very different conclusions than what really happened?
oh...
While I agree that cops frequently get off when they shouldn't, it's just ridiculous to try and judge guilt based on media coverage.
Bite me
They see that gangbanger shit on television and in games and movies and in videos, it's what kids emulate, it's not "gross," it's fucking reality. He had the gun IN HIS FUCKING WAISTBAND. Where do you think he got that idea? CHURCH?
edit: for the record, back when my brother and his friends were running after each other and shooting at each other, they were playing "Cops and Robbers" because that's what kids did back then. Not that any of the kids were actual robbers. Or cops. But they watched a lot of television, gang shows, Al Capone, Bonnie and Clyde, the Godfather, whatever, and they were pretending to be doing that. And if that's "gross," whatever. That's what boys do. Enter "Scarface," and the boys all started to hold the guns sideways and stuff the guns under the shirts. "Say hello to my little friend."
The real question is WHY this boy would pull out a gun when cops arrived. It makes ZERO sense. They were uniformed cops. He knew they were. Did he think he was in a video game?
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 12:43 PM.
Bite me
Exactly. The people saying that there is some kind of time or opportunity when somebody, anybody, pulls out a gun from their waistband to negotiate or talk or whatever isn't being realistic. How about if somebody does that in front of you in the street? Pulls out a gun from their waistband. What are you gonna do? "Hey, let's chat! Is that a real gun? Are you going to shoot me? Do I have time to hide behind this car? Can I make a few phone calls, first? Hey, about 6 seconds have passed, right? I think by now, I'm probably dead in real life, right? Heh, Hey, is that Jesus over there? GRANDMA, IS THAT YOU?" (angels singing)
Last edited by allegro; 11-27-2014 at 12:34 PM.
Active Member
Who knows what kind of people surround him and influence him, but ignoring the influence of gang culture is silly. It certainly could have been family/friends promoting gang culture. It could have been from watching it on TV/movies. Hell, it could have been from absorbing it with video games. We frequently talk about how video games and military movies influence kids to walk around acting like Rambo.... but we can't talk about the influence of gang culture on kids? fuck that
Alt-Left Leaning Cunt
The "gang" shit just seems like EXTREMELY thinly veiled racist commentary.
Bite me
Nobody said he was IN a gang, or even KNOWS any gang members.
YOU are actually the one making that leap.
Hip-hop culture is full of gang culture and references. Listen to any Chief Keef lyrics, lately? No? Why not? Have you seen any Chief Keef videos? Why not?
Because you're RACIST? No, I'm not assuming that, but see it's easy to make that leap. Nobody is saying this kid was in a gang, anymore than anybody was saying that Mike Brown was gonna be a cop killer because his rap lyrics were typical lyrics you'd find in lots of hip-hop culture.
Captain Rustleboots
I honestly think about 70% of the blame goes towards the dispatchers not relaying the info that the gun was likely fake.
Bored
I have no idea how they train police officers. What I know about real life police procedure is what I've seen on news report. So my question may be really stupid but I'll ask it anyway:
What happened to the cops stopping their car at a relatively safe distance, opening their doors, hiding behind them while pointing their guns at the suspect while shouting "drop your weapon"?
Anyway, watching that video, I think it would have been simpler for the cops to just have run him down with their car given how close to him they stopped.
Active Member
Sure, if we are only talking about those employed with law enforcement services.
don't forget the parents letting their kid run around with the gun in public and thinking that going for a gun in your pants is the right way to interact with police.
Active Member
Sure, if it's coming from your racist uncle, but that's not the source here. You shouldn't ignore commentary just because it usually comes from an invalid source either. Gang culture is an issue and it absolutely impacts POC disproportionately. It is caused by a mix of poverty and the drug war. TV/Movies/Music will frequently romanticize it for many reasons. This teaches kids to idolize it. Even worse is that if you are in poverty, gang culture is even more attractive due to the power and money it seems to offer... it's something that seems impossible to achieve any other way. It's what makes you cool. It's what makes you successful. That's a message that is really hard to escape if you grow up in it.
It's also not hard to see gang culture outside of the race. Which one of these kids with guns do you think is more likely to commit a crime and romanticize gang culture, the white one or the black one?
http://i.imgur.com/Qwyiz1a.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/xqFgcRj.jpg
Captain Rustleboots
The 12 year old couldn't help he had shitty parents, he was just doing what was normal for him. It's our job as a society to do the best we can to help prevent things like this. There were many little things that led up to this, all which were preventable.
Active Member
To be honest the white kid looked more 'thuggish' to me in those pictures because of the face cover! In fact the black kid looked like he was doing some range practice at a camp and not even thuggish
Active Member
I picked more extreme examples just to make it easy. I also wanted something legitimate, not just a setup photo. That white kid was 13 in that picture and went around with a gang of teens robbing people at gunpoint looking like that.
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