How do you interpret The Fragile?

[eversonpoe]

I'm also a chronic "album-listener" in that I have difficulty in just listening to a song here or there on an album (or even using shuffle at all) meaning I always tend to start at the beginning of anything and listen as far as I can until I need to stop. Then, depending on the amount of time that has gone by, I'll either start again from where I left off, or if the imaginary, undefinable time limit has run out, I'll start it over (having a little internal battle with myself) beginning the cycle anew.

The only exception of course being when I have the need to slam-dance out some stress to "The Big Comedown" after a long day of work.

ditto! (maybe not the big comedown part )

[henryeatscereal]

Funny story:
When i bought "The Fragile" for the first time a long time ago i used to own a multi disc stereo (you could store up to 5 discs at the time, pretty groundbreaking stuff, lol)

Anyhoo when i was about to listen to the album: i stored the two discs in my stereo, but i took them out so quickly i didn't noticed that i placed the "RIGHT" disc in tray 1 and "LEFT" in tray 2.
When i started to read the lyrics i knew i wasn't listening to "Somewhat Damaged", yet i heard the whole album this way! (First RIGHT then LEFT...).

I still don't know if my judgment was changed because it was my first time listening The Fragile, but i like it more in this order ...even to this day!!!

In a way the disc makes more "sense" to me this way... (Interpretations aside, just like it more as a listening experience...)

[Halo Infinity]

I have often wondered if there was a chance that perhaps the Left and the Right could've also been a reference to the traits of left and right sides of the brain, and how they can go wrong, and get turned against him. I've always seen the Left as the first part of The Fragile too. I guess you can say that listening to Left side first has also helped do that to me.

As a sequel to The Downward Spiral, if it was about him finally cracking under pressure, then perhaps, as The Fragile says, it continues with him being broken up in two. I wonder if that was to also tie in with Now I'm Nothing, seeing how Now I'm Nothing happened as the Broken era was about to arrive. And if Broken really does have some connection, he was broken, and breaking further into a "downward spiral". And all that he could do, is break himself "in two", hence the two discs. Gave Up also suggests a suicide attempt way before The Downward Spiral and Hurt too. And when thinking about it, it really makes the title Hesitation Marks far more interesting, along with In Two being an actual song title from it. And as The Fragile being the lowest point, it would have to be the aftermath of all the destruction beforehand.

And as Trent said, wasn't The Fragile supposed to be about him trying to move on and picking up the pieces? And speaking of that, I find it interesting that he mentioned "having to pick up the pieces" and "not as much fun by himself" in The Perfect Drug. Fast-forward to Somewhat Damaged, and he's all alone, left to pick up the pieces and figure it all out all over again. It's also like Piggy all over again, but much worse. (As far as getting betrayed and abandoned being expressed in a song goes.)

And now I'm also wondering if Everything can also be taken that way. He feels complete, but still wants to ruin it. It isn't meant to last but it's for right now. For all he aspires he's really a liar, and he's running out of things left to do... all after surviving everything.

I went a whole lot longer than I expected myself to go on, and I in no way, shape, or form, am trying to say that's what they all mean. This is all pure speculation. And of course, I could be dead wrong too. I only got this from listening to NIN far too many times.

@Sesquipedalism - And yes, this is definitely an awesome topic indeed. I certainly give you mad props for it via thumbs up.

Oh yeah, and I also noticed that The Fragile seems to deal with more loss and despair than self-loathing and anger. Which could make sense in a way, because if it continued from The Downward Spiral, Hurt would have to be him realizing the power of loss. The Fragile would be his further plunge into a sense of loss, combined with some of the bitterness, anger, apprehension, depression and other burdens he has carried along with him.

[frothy_ham]

Something I never really noticed before until this thread got me in a ponderin' mood.

What purpose does the definite article of "The" serve by being in front of "Fragile" in the record's title as opposed to its absence in regards to "Broken"? With "Broken" it's easy of course to ascertain that the title is self-descriptive and singular. Here we have the broken down and enraged words of one man, thrashing out against the world (and Steve Gottlieb).

However, perhaps the "The" of "The Fragile" expounds upon the concept that the album is not just about this singular entity, yet that it is indicative of multiple entities. This is most apparent in songs such as "WiTT" and the title track. It is perhaps a means to voice the words of an entire group of people...the so declared "fragile" of our society. Or perhaps as @Kris mentioned above, the plurality could be a reference to the left and right side of our protagonist's brain. Or even dissociative identity disorder.

[botley]

There was quite an interesting interpretation posted on the Hotline ages ago.

I don't think The Fragile can be interpreted as having an INTENDED linear order. After all, Reznor didn't even pick the final order for the CD, Bob Ezrin did (provider of "final continuity and flow" is how he's credited in the liner notes). This order was then spread out over six sequential sides in the vinyl edition, with the additional two songs placed in act three. I've started looking at the CD's track order as a left-brained/right-brained attempt to organize two views of the same scenario... but for me it was always "first left, then right" (which is how my brain works in real life, too). It's impossible for me to imagine the record opening with anything other than "Somewhat Damaged".

[Ryan]

I always found it interesting that both sides of the fragile (pretty much) end with "I can still feel you"

I didn't realize that until now.

[butter_hole]

I don't despise them. I have a smattering of Peppers in my iTunes library. How do they make it clear which comes first?

Good to hear. Maybe not obvious, just clear. There's the left to right, left = first in English back cover, the fact that it starts at 1 on the Jupiter disc when you buy the album on online stores, things like that.

Last night I listened to this version of the album:

I'm Looking Forward to Joining You, Finally
The Day The World Went Away
The Fragile
The Way Out is Through
La Mer
The Great Below
Into the Void
The Frail
The Wretched
We're in this Together
Ripe (With Decay)

I dug it. Album is so great you can create your own sequences and they almost always work, and as usual - as is the case with every double album - you cut it down to one and it becomes the bands best album.

[Akuratyde]

I'm always scared to start new threads, for fear of moderator Redundant/Stupid Thread Smackdown.

What a lovely forum you guys have here.

[hobochic]

Even after 14 years it's still an enigma.

The nature of the album is fragmented, and could also be seen as an incomplete puzzle. While 'The Wall' defines the traditional concept album in a linear narrative, The Fragile disintegrates its narrative and delivers plastic bags of ruined evidence with notes of incoherent scribblings, for you to make sense of.

And he even left a gift note:

"Tried so hard to make the pieces all fit
Smashed it apart
Just for the fuck of it" Enjoy! – T.R

[ninja77]

Even after 14 years it's still an enigma.

The nature of the album is fragmented, and could also be seen as an incomplete puzzle. While 'The Wall' defines the traditional concept album in a linear narrative, The Fragile disintegrates its narrative and delivers plastic bags of ruined evidence with notes of incoherent scribblings, for you to make sense of.

And he even left a gift card:

"Tried so hard to make the pieces all fit
Smashed it apart
Just for the fuck of it" Enjoy! – T.R

Brilliant analogy. I love this!

[neorev]

I really wish "10 Miles High" wasn't soley for the vinyl release and "And All That Could Have Been" deserved a place on the album since it's one of the best NIN tracks ever... imo

Wish I had a vinyl rip of "The Fragile" so I could hear "10 Miles High" and "New Flesh" in their places. Such a cocktease when "10 Miles High" is cut.
Is the vinyl version different from the "Things Falling Apart" mix?

[eversonpoe]

Is the vinyl version different from the "Things Falling Apart" mix?

indeed, it is!

[neorev]

indeed, it is!

Oh man, does anyone have a vinyl rip of The Fragile that I may be able to download?
I own it on CD and only ever heard that version of the album.
My sister had the album on vinyl... though didn't have a record player.
I remember always stealing it from her just so I can look at the art and packing.
The CD is nice and all, but the artwork is so much better on the vinyl when it's nice and big.
I need to pick up a record player and get into vinyl, I've always wanted to.
Just rebuying my faves are vinyl is a daunting task lol.
But my goal is to move over to vinyl in the near future.
If someone could maybe PM a vinyl rip of the album, I'd be totally grateful for the help.
When the reissue comes out, that's when I'm waiting to do the right thing and finally get it on vinyl.
It's like with the original CD version, you're getting an incomplete picture of the full album with tracks cut.

[goingincirclez]

OK, so in the spirit of full fair disclosure, I'll start my own interpretation by copying something I posted in the "Controversial Opinions" thread a few weeks ago:

"...Truth is I personally don't consider TF to be bloated at all. All the songs have a purpose, and the order is generally sensible. It's not meant to be a seamlessly flowing album. Consider the name: the sometimes clunky arrangement and hither-yon aesthetics really do underscore just how, ahem, fragile the whole thing really is.

But the key word there, is sometimes (clunky). Going back to my "ebb and flow of traffic" metaphor: sometimes you zip right through a familiar stretch and sometimes it takes too long for Who The Fuck Knows why. Same too with The Fragile: sometimes my mood just doesn't feel like a Starfucker, or With Decay, or even (ironically) Fragile. It doesn't happen often... but sometimes it does."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So with that said, my interpretation is based on the pervasive sense of struggle I perceive: The Fragile is a study of dichotomy: right vs. wrong in the past versus present; waged in the fog of war of id v. superego.

Put less arrogantly, if The Downward Spiral was terrifyingly straightforward and linear in its storytelling approach - it was also somewhat predictable, and manufactured as a deliberate exercise. The protagonist seeks self-destruction, and aggressively accomplishes that goal with nary a pause for reconsideration.

In contrast, The Fragile is a far more accurate and IMHO hauntingly prescient portrayal of how inconsistent and cyclical one's downfall can be, despite best efforts to the contrary. It IS a downfall, but a more passive and nuanced one: rather than being the architect of his destruction, our protagonist continually fights and resigns control over his own life. He alienates and endears assistance, he seeks solace and ventures to hell, he blares the horn of war and seeks escape by the sea. The entire album is a play of tying to bring these oscillating emotions and triggers into a balance that is best described by the album's title.

Consider the opener, the title of which is a downright humorous declaration after TDS: "Somewhat Damaged". Yeah - understate much? Our protagonist makes a series of nearly flat, distant factual statements about his rationale, yanked out by tortured strings and percussion. This reluctance continually fades beneath swelling rage until he is screaming at the end of the song. No longer injured and bruised as he was at the start, he is spewing vitriol squarely on target on by the end, daring all comers to defy.

By comparison, the very next song (The Day The World Went Away) is a much needed respite of reflection after the opening eruption. It almost reads like an apology: "I blew up and blamed you, but here's why I was in that place off the side and far away..."...

(...or perhaps it's a somber internal reflection: the "you" from SD and the "he" in TDTWWA are the same person).

After this bit of reckoning, comes a lullaby. In case "The Fragile" wasn't enough of a clue, right from the outset we are reminded our protagonist is also The Frail. This is a peaceful instrumental, but peace and comfort is fleeting and tension builds under the surface, until our protagonist's psyche once again swings dark and makes him one of The Wretched - with ever a compelling case (ask anyone who has ever been depressed - this song is the Demon's own playbook).

But if our protagonist is Fragile, he is also Defiant (if not bipolar): as if to immediately fight back, he cries out We're In This Together. Tellingly, we never quite know who the other half of "we" is, and it could be anyone. The song starts with a flat statement of apology: "I have become impossible" which acknowledges the previous demons. Tellingly, if the chorus is hopeful, it is shouted with such desperation that the protagonist's fears and anxiety are betrayed - he is attempting to reassure himself as much as the object of his affection.

Perhaps this reassurance is successful, as the title track immediately extracts his focus directly upon someone else. It's easy to forget your own troubles when you can see them in someone else - you have an outlet for your energies, your own pain is less acute, you feel useful and empowered and your own situational outlook skews positive, if only things can be sustained in that manner...

...he lays it all out in that song...

...and Just Like You (he) Imagined... (albeit with a cynical view given past history) it all comes crashing down into one of the most important moments in the album. The wailing synths, the tortured guitars, the crashing scizophrenic piano all give sonic illustration of a mind at war with its heart. What is the path? Is he truly Wretched, or merely Frail? Is he worthy of someone staying Together with him, or does he have to set selfishness aside and help someone else first? The movement in this song is truly epic and one of my all-time NIN standout tracks. Everything that preceeds this song is mashed up and left unresolved in a mysteriously quiet fade...

...after which he wakes up and realizes, shit, fuck, the problems are Even Deeper. And once again he is Damaged, with lyrics that leave little to interpretation, sung in a sweeping lament. Every time he is up.... bam, right back down. Having shouldered this beleaguered acceptance, a Pilgrimage away from hope begins, in no less than a call to arms, excising all that was comforting. The soldier chants are all those demons egging him on - and it's no coincidence that the coda from TDS is hidden in this track.

So, pilgrimage complete... remember just a few tracks ago we almost had love ballads? Well fuck that shit cuz No You Don't is gonna smack the taste outta your mouth with all the aggression that was coaxed out in Somewhat Damaged, and then some. Our protagonist has made it his mission to lash out and seek schadenfreude-tinted vengeance at anyone who hurt him - and, most tellingly, those who perceive themselves as better. Which is a common coping mechanism of an afflicted or addicted mind - he can't rise above his demons, he has given himself up to them... so he will drag as much of the world down to his level as well, because on some level he still needs to belong to justify his actions.

And then we get to La Mer. Even before Trent disclosed how / why / when he wrote this song, I knew what it was about, from the first moment I heard it.

Basically, there is always a reckoning. Back to the theme of Left vs Right, Right vs Wrong, and Dark vs Light... you can't suddenly decide to attack everyone around you, without facing the consequences. And those consequences have a funny way of revealing themselves to you in your quietest, most vulnerable moments. Bam. It's no accident that The Great Below follows with open arms. Thus far, throughout the act, our protagonist has revealed himself to be an imperfect and deeply flawed but generally decent human being - a sympathetic character. Given the violent and sudden oscillations played out in nearly every successive song, would you expect anything less than an attempted suicide after what he did in the songs before?

It's an entirely circuitous route, but it's oddly parallel to TDS. And yet the struggle isn't over...

(fuck, I talk too damn much. Is anyone even reading this or did I just elaboramble WAAAAAAAAAAAY the fuck off tangent in my own private party corner? Sigh. I guess I'll stop here and add my thoughts on the second half if anyone actually cares...)

[eversonpoe]

could you make that text non-italic? it's REALLY hard to read that much in italics.

[goingincirclez]

could you make that text non-italic? it's REALLY hard to read that much in italics.

Yeah, that was a copy/paste bug as I knew I'd get signed out while writing that... missive. Sorry. Should be fixed now.

[nowimnothing]

Off memory, Bob Ezrin was employed with the specific intention of putting the tracks in the best order for flow, continuity, and of course to deliver the concept.

If I recall correctly, TR was going to start the album with La Mer, and idea that was quickly scrapped by Ezrin.

Anyway - these are just old memories floating around my cognitive abyss.

[neorev]

I love "Somewhat Damaged"...
but I always felt "The Way Out Is Through" should have been the album opener (it at least opens the 2nd disc)
I'm curious what the extras are going to be in the supposed reissue
I remember hearing something about there being A LOT of tracks written and recorded during this era (some absurd amount that I can't recall)
Perhaps the extras are closer to "Still"-style material, more piano-based and atmospheric
But it would be interesting to see how they go with the reissue... they should definitely stick with the vinyl version for the CD as well
Are the extras gonna be tacked on at the end or perhaps incorporated into the album to give the full length experience of what "The Fragile" was suppose to be
Hoping they go all out because "The Downward Spiral" reissue was a bit of a letdown for me, think they could have went much further with it
I took all the alt mixes, remixes, and extra tracks from that era and made my own little expanded version...
by little, I mean 32 tracks not including the original album.
"The Downward Spiral" is one of the greatest albums of all frigging time (yeah I said it) and the reissue should have been treated that way... especially for the fans
I'm sorry if I went a little off-topic responding to the previous comment about flow and track orders.

[m15a]

Oh man, does anyone have a vinyl rip of The Fragile that I may be able to download?

i heard a rumor that piratebay has a torrent that's still going.

[neorev]

i heard a rumor that piratebay has a torrent that's still going.

Yeah I know... call me crazy... call me weird... call me stupid... but I do not torrent.

[Fred]

You should probably begin doing it, then; large HTTP downloads are becoming increasingly rare because torrenting the stuff is a lot more convenient for all involved. And the FBI has a nasty habit of shutting down the popular hosting sites, like MegaUpload.

That said, you could always use a P2P network like Soulseek, but that's a bit like visiting a disease-ridden prostitute. You may be getting more than what you came for.

[henryeatscereal]

I heard the whole album last night, first: RIGHT, then: LEFT (I also used headphones, i highly recommend it!)

After reading this thread i gotta say this album is even more intriguing to me than the first time i heard it back in 99':

As i posted early in this thread: i like to play "RIGHT" before of "LEFT" as a listening experience, yet after hearing the album yesterday i realized none of the discs necessarily come "before" the other.

Both tell the same story and reach the same conclusion, but with "different endings" yet the mood and the process is the "same" and the interesting point is that they both say near the end the phrase: "I can still feel you".
The main difference lies in "RIGHT" that ends with an instrumental piece, that in a way it's "quiet", but it's also inconclusive and almost disturbing... like "something" isn't resolved; so yes in a way: "Ripe (with Decay)" can lead to: "Somewhat damaged".

The end of "LEFT" is kinda like "Hurt" (repentance and introspection) yet the final sounds at the end of the song, don't necessarily lead for a conclusion of the album and could easily lead to "The Way out is Through"...

Bottom line: In my opinion the album is a "cycle", no disc comes "before" and "after"; you can trade the listening order from "Left" and "Right" or "Right" and "Left" and it'll still make sense ...yet the "ending" of the first combo is very "suspenseful" and the ending of the other combo is a bit more "conclusive".

After listening the album it reminded me to (Pink Floyd's) "The Wall" because the "end" of the album is exactly the "beginning" (At the end of the album Roger Waters says: "Is this were... *then the album ends and if you play it from the beginning again he says: "...we came in?")
So i guess it's no coincidence that Bob Ezrin was the one that selected the album order for The fragile...

[neorev]

That said, you could always use a P2P network like Soulseek, but that's a bit like visiting a disease-ridden prostitute. You may be getting more than what you came for.

Sorry, just had to quote this because I nearly spit up my drink all over my laptop lol. Soulseek, wow... brings back memories.

[neorev]

So this thread made me have to go back and listen to The Fragile again... and I'm starting with the "Right" side first and see how it feels.
I must say that I was never really a fan of the track "Into The Void," dunno why, just something about the track didn't do it for me all of this time.
But sitting here listening again, now I'm in love with the track... is that strange? Only took me well over a decade lol.
It's funny, starting with the "Right" side is making me appreciate tracks on here a lot more...
Maybe because after listening to the whole "Left" side first, you can become fatigued and more critical on tracks since you've been listening for so long.
Wonder if there's mental stigma against all the disc two's out there lol.
"The Mark Has Been Made," The Big Come Down," and "Underneath It All" were instant faves of mine from the "Right" side.
And yes, I love "Starfuckers, Inc." though kinda feels out of place with the overall narrative of the album and could have done better mixing it into the next track...
"Starfuckers, Inc." feels like what would have followed "The Perfect Drug" if he continued along the path of incorporating elements of electronica (drum n' bass, breakbeat, etc.)
But as much as it sticks out on the album, I think it's needed for the "Right" side because it's one of the peaks for this half.
For me, I always felt the "Right" side was a little more, how do you say it? downtempo? compared to the "Left" side, which I feel has many more peaks...
The "Right" side stays a lot more leveled off vibe-wise... except for the "Starfuckers, Inc." & "Complication" part of that side.
I will admit, and don't hate me for honesty, but "The Fragile" disappointed me when it first came out.
I think it's because it wasn't what I was expecting with the one off tracks that led to it...
between "The Downward Spiral" and "The Fragile," there was the Puff Daddy Remix, the collab with Josh Wink, and "The Perfect Drug" (one of fave NIN tracks).
So I guess I was expecting something more electronic... especially with "The Perfect Drug" incorporating elements of drum n' bass/breakbeat and working with someone like Josh Wink... So I guess I was expecting something a little more inspired by the American electronica craze of the mid to late 90's.
But "The Fragile" has grown on me over the years... though I do think there's some bloat. It's amongst the top half of my favorite NIN albums.

I still will never understand the cutting of "10 Miles High" and "New Flesh" from the CD version since the "Right" side is much shorter than the "Left."
I get it when it comes to vinyl and the different endings and beginnings of records, but there was enough room on CD to include them.
Plus to leave in the opening of "10 Miles High" was a huge cocktease, Mr. Reznor... I may never forgive you for that one...
nah, you delivered with "Hesitation Marks," so I forgive you... be sure to put "10 Miles High" in it's proper and respected place with the reissue and I'll be happy.

Something tells me we will get the reissue sometime in 2014, since it will be the 15 year anniversary... maybe release it around the "Greatest Hits."
I'm sure he wants to give "Hesitation Marks" and its tour some room to breathe before diving into the reissue.
How awesome would it be for him to tour for "The Fragile" reissue and perform the album in full? That would be immense.

Edit:
I have now reached the end of the "Right" side...
on to the "Left"
Damn you all in this forum for making me have to go back and listen to this whole album in full today...

[neorev]

And might I add...
"And All That Could Have Been" should be the entire album closer... not "Ripe (With Decay)."
The song title and lyrics themselves I feel are the perfect ending to the whole experience... but that's just me.
Such an amazing track to be left off the album. I wonder if there's anything else like this, besides the usual piano-based instrumentals on "Still," that was left off.

And does anyone know the words said quietly and quickly in the background of "The Wretched" around the 3:56 mark, just before the guitar solo kicks in?
I can definitely hear a voice, but it's so quiet and quite fast. I never really noticed it before.

[henryeatscereal]

And does anyone know the words said quietly and quickly in the background of "The Wretched" around the 3:56 mark, just before the guitar solo kicks in?
I can definitely hear a voice, but it's so quiet and quite fast. I never really noticed it before.

I was wondering that myself yesterday when i heard it... they are just before the guitars become louder so it's very difficult to understand...

I agree with you also in your comment about "And all that could have been" i think is more "conclusive" than Ripe/Great Below and "10 miles high" should have been included...

[Halo Infinity]

And does anyone know the words said quietly and quickly in the background of "The Wretched" around the 3:56 mark, just before the guitar solo kicks in? I can definitely hear a voice, but it's so quiet and quite fast. I never really noticed it before.

I think I remember that being an error that made its way into the song from some radio frequency, or something like that. They noticed the error and decided to keep it. I think it was actually used in Things Falling Apart too. And this is also assuming that my memory is serving me correctly. (It still sort of sounds like, "What you did was try to stop it." to me though.)

And well, the following people would obviously have to know. @Leviathant @sheepdean

[butter_hole]

I'm no expert but I feel like a recording console can't just "pick up" some radio frequency? Surely it must have been intentionally added in, or it was the end of a sample from a movie..

[Leviathant]

I'm no expert but I feel like a recording console can't just "pick up" some radio frequency? Surely it must have been intentionally added in, or it was the end of a sample from a movie..

I had a Danelectro Fabtone distortion pedal that in the right weather, very clearly picked up AM radio.
@Kris is right about the story behind the sound. That's what Keith Hillebrandt told me, and I don't really see any reason why he'd make that up.

[InvitingmeAway]

Yeah when 10 miles high goes into the buried part....like the direct opposite of The Downward Spiral title track.