Ofwgkta

[thefragile_jake]

Since I noticed there wasn't a thread for these guys, I figured I might as well start one. What's everyone's opinion on them? My history with the group goes back to the fall of 2010 when a friend showed me the Odd Future collective mixtape "Radical" and Tyler's first release "Bastard". I was kind of blown away by the incredibly minimal and almost off putting production by them all...especially with "Radical" with one song actually sampling a Liars track but it wasn't until I saw the video for Yonkers that I really started to pay attention and get into them even more. The video was so dark and the song, in my opinion, still holds up after several listens...I was extremely into "Goblin" when it was released but after several listens it's sustainability has grown tiresome I think. A record that was the victim of it's own hype in a way.

When I first heard them in 2010 and early 2011, they seemed dangerous and their sound musically was that of a provocateur. "Bastard" was especially evil sounding and along with Earl Sweatshirt's "EARL" mixtape, those some classic mixtapes in my opinion. Now they've got a show on Adult Swim, one of them in Frank Ocean is a star in his own right, they have an R&B trip hop group within their ranks in The Internet" and several other groups and members. I can understand why people would be turned off by the lyrics at times and although I'm not a fan of the newest Tyler track I'm still incredibly interested in what he has to say as well as Earl Sweatshirt's first record.

When I saw Odd Future last fall, I got the chance to hang out with Tyler for a bit and we talked about his newest record and basically told me it sounded like his influences but that he was even going to try and sing on a couple tracks. Guess we'll have to see.

[Kid Charlemagne]

I really like Tyler and Earl, I Love Frank, I'm neutral to the rest. Like you, I heard Bastard in 2010 and loved "French", then Goblin came out in 2011 and was pretty awesome. I'm a fan, but I dislike much of the younger fanbase that shows up (skater teens who have absolutely no idea what they're rebelling against). OF are a different breed of rappers or a collective. They're interesting and nobody can take that away from them. Whether or not you like them, you can't deny they're interesting. If I may be blunt though, Loiter Squad is a fucking awful show.

[thefragile_jake]

I agree wholeheartedly!

I really liked Mellowhype's first two releases but that "Numbers" record that came out last year made me disinterested in them. I think what made me so interested was exactly what you said, they came across like such a different breed or rappers and the fact that Tyler created his own beats at such a young age was inspiring. You hit the nail on the head when you talk about their younger fanbase, it's kind of strange and the shows I think have kind of catered to the skater teen audience now moreso than say a year or two years ago. Watching videos from their first couple shows were borderline riots and came across very dangerous. I saw them at Pitchfork in 2011 and that was the peak of their starting off point as Goblin had just came out and they seemed on top of their game. Now, the show I saw last fall was fine but at 25 years old I almost felt out of place with some of the people that were in line. I may not be into everything they do now 100% like I was at first but yes, you're right...they keep things interesting for the most part.

I really tried to like Loiter Squad and while some skits made me laugh at first, I gave up and haven't watched any since episode 3 or 4.

[gorast]

I really enjoy most of what the collective puts out. Wolf seems like it's going to be a completely different beast compared to Bastard and Goblin, which will be interesting to hear, and the two singles Earl's put out since November are top-notch. Frank's my all-time favorite - Channel Orange was a genuine masterpiece, and Nostalgia was still a very good mixtape.

I'm not all that fond of MellowHype; I don't know what it is, but it seems like Hodgy comes up with better shit when he's not working in the context of the duo. Mike G's flow is good, but he doesn't seem to do all that much. When Domo raps about things other than pot, he's not terrible.

I don't know if I'd ever go to a concert, though...too many skater douchebags for me.

[Kid Charlemagne]

I agree wholeheartedly!

I really liked Mellowhype's first two releases but that "Numbers" record that came out last year made me disinterested in them. I think what made me so interested was exactly what you said, they came across like such a different breed or rappers and the fact that Tyler created his own beats at such a young age was inspiring. You hit the nail on the head when you talk about their younger fanbase, it's kind of strange and the shows I think have kind of catered to the skater teen audience now moreso than say a year or two years ago. Watching videos from their first couple shows were borderline riots and came across very dangerous. I saw them at Pitchfork in 2011 and that was the peak of their starting off point as Goblin had just came out and they seemed on top of their game. Now, the show I saw last fall was fine but at 25 years old I almost felt out of place with some of the people that were in line. I may not be into everything they do now 100% like I was at first but yes, you're right...they keep things interesting for the most part.

I really tried to like Loiter Squad and while some skits made me laugh at first, I gave up and haven't watched any since episode 3 or 4.

I saw Tyler last year and at 23, I was easily one of the oldest people there, I knew because I was one of like eight people I saw that had a wristband to enable us to buy alcohol. Like you, I'm not into them when I first started eating up all their material in 2011, but I always keep an eye on what on what they're up to. I think they're much more interesting than their mainstream counterparts (Weezy, Drake, 2 Chainz) or any of your "real" hip hop artists (Jedi Fucking Mind Tricks). Plus, the three covers released for Tyler's next LP are kind of awesome.

[thefragile_jake]

WOLF leaked!

[gorast]

Giving it a spin now, it already sounds way more mature than Goblin. No songs about killing (yet), really different subject matter. Dude's also a really talented producer, though that's already evident.

[thefragile_jake]

Yeah, it's extremely more mellow than his previous stuff I think so far.

I enjoyed the dark, "evil" vibe of Bastard and some of those Goblin tracks...but this is a different beast all together I think. It reminds me of a "channel ORANGE" hip hop record musically so far and some tracks have a BIG early Eminem influence. There's one song that has such a Stan vibe, but he completely makes it his own.

[thefragile_jake]

Okay "TrashWang" is pretty horrible though...

[gorast]

Trashwang isn't as bad as Tamale.

Just finished the album, I'd call it an improvement over Goblin. Tyler's lyrical content is shifting in a good direction, and it'll do a lot for the longevity of his career.

[thefragile_jake]

Really? I loved Tamale actually, it's super weird but it works within the context of the record. Moreso than TrashWang which has another case of that Bitch Suck Dick/"THE GANG'S ALL HERE" kind of throwaway....but that's just me.

And yeah, I think this record shows Tyler's moving in the right direction.

[thefragile_jake]

Earl Sweatshirt live at Coachella with Flying Lotus as his DJ.

Tyler, Domo & Vince Staples show up as well.

[gorast]

When is Earl going to release Doris? The two singles since 2012 have gotten me really excited for it.

[eversonpoe]

i think that anyone who uses the line "rape a pregnant bitch and tell my friends i had a threesome" is an asshole. i don't care if you're making art, that's just fucked up.

i won't deny that several members of odd future are good musicians/producers (especially frank ocean), but tyler, in particular, is an awful human being.

[gorast]

i think that anyone who uses the line "rape a pregnant bitch and tell my friends i had a threesome" is an asshole. i don't care if you're making art, that's just fucked up.

i won't deny that several members of odd future are good musicians/producers (especially frank ocean), but tyler, in particular, is an awful human being.

I think the thing with Tyler is that you have to be picky with what you listen to. There are several tracks on Goblin that I absolutely cannot listen to because some of the lyrics are just...well, you showed one of the primary examples.

His lyrics really have become much better with Wolf, more listenable and mature without compromising the songs. There are still moments on that album that make me uncomfortable, too, though. It just comes down to only listening to select tracks, even if it messes with the narratives of the albums.

The same applies for Earl, too - I love his flow and wordplay, but his debut album has some tracks that are super-juvenile and needlessly violent. I'm glad he seems to have moved past that with Chum and Whoa.

[eversonpoe]

I think the thing with Tyler is that you have to be picky with what you listen to. There are several tracks on Goblin that I absolutely cannot listen to because some of the lyrics are just...well, you showed one of the primary examples.

His lyrics really have become much better with Wolf, more listenable and mature without compromising the songs. There are still moments on that album that make me uncomfortable, too, though. It just comes down to only listening to select tracks, even if it messes with the narratives of the albums.

The same applies for Earl, too - I love his flow and wordplay, but his debut album has some tracks that are super-juvenile and needlessly violent. I'm glad he seems to have moved past that with Chum and Whoa.

that's kind of akin to saying, "i skip big man with a gun every time i listen to the downward spiral because it makes me uncomfortable," which i actually used to do when i was first getting into NIN 14 years ago. however, the major difference is that trent was telling a story with established characters, not glorifying violence and rape.

but it's also like saying, "i'm going to ignore the fact that this person is awful and makes me extremely uncomfortable 30% of the time because the other 70% of the time his music is good!" tyler just spews hatred and i don't really think there's much of a "narrative flow" to his albums.

also, the F word (not fuck) is something i got called LITERALLY every day i was in attendance during high school, simply because i was "weird," so hearing it makes me feel kinda sick.

eta: i hope you don't think i'm in any way attacking you or saying you're a bad person. i have never really talked to anyone about my feelings on tyler except my girlfriend when i've seen things on the internet about him being a douche, in which case my reaction is simply RAGE!!! so i'm enjoying having a more intellectual discussion rather than yelling at my computer and having my girlfriend ask me to calm down.

[thefragile_jake]

When is Earl going to release Doris? The two singles since 2012 have gotten me really excited for it.

Yeah, I haven't really seen a release date or anything at all but hopefully that comes out soon enough.

that's kind of akin to saying, "i skip big man with a gun every time i listen to the downward spiral because it makes me uncomfortable," which i actually used to do when i was first getting into NIN 14 years ago. however, the major difference is that trent was telling a story with established characters, not glorifying violence and rape.

but it's also like saying, "i'm going to ignore the fact that this person is awful and makes me extremely uncomfortable 30% of the time because the other 70% of the time his music is good!" tyler just spews hatred and i don't really think there's much of a "narrative flow" to his albums.

also, the F word (not fuck) is something i got called LITERALLY every day i was in attendance during high school, simply because i was "weird," so hearing it makes me feel kinda sick.

eta: i hope you don't think i'm in any way attacking you or saying you're a bad person. i have never really talked to anyone about my feelings on tyler except my girlfriend when i've seen things on the internet about him being a douche, in which case my reaction is simply RAGE!!! so i'm enjoying having a more intellectual discussion rather than yelling at my computer and having my girlfriend ask me to calm down.

I don't know, I suppose that's just your opinion on the guy for being awful for writing lyrics like that but I don't take what he says as serious as to judge him as actual person. If you've actually listened to his previous work in Bastard, you'd realize that it's just as much as telling a story about characters as it was with Trent Reznor. I look at some of his lyrics about rape and murder and see them as polarizing, raw pieces of disturbing art. Look at the rape scene in the film, Irreversibe....it's roughly a ten minute or so (I could be wrong, I do know it's shockingly long) still shot of a woman being raped in a subway and then almost beaten to death afterwards. I still see that as art even if it's horrifying to the senses. Now I'm not saying that Tyler's music is as almost poignant and creepily refined as that particular scene...but I still consider it within the same art vein.

Tyler, the Creator is/was a dark, evil character. Tyler Gregory Okonma is just a regular kid who's like 19 or 20 now. He can kind of be snot nosed punk, but then again...I was just as much at his age five years age.

...but yes, I basically agree with everything Final Destiny said.

[gorast]

that's kind of akin to saying, "i skip big man with a gun every time i listen to the downward spiral because it makes me uncomfortable," which i actually used to do when i was first getting into NIN 14 years ago. however, the major difference is that trent was telling a story with established characters, not glorifying violence and rape.

but it's also like saying, "i'm going to ignore the fact that this person is awful and makes me extremely uncomfortable 30% of the time because the other 70% of the time his music is good!" tyler just spews hatred and i don't really think there's much of a "narrative flow" to his albums.

also, the F word (not fuck) is something i got called LITERALLY every day i was in attendance during high school, simply because i was "weird," so hearing it makes me feel kinda sick.

eta: i hope you don't think i'm in any way attacking you or saying you're a bad person. i have never really talked to anyone about my feelings on tyler except my girlfriend when i've seen things on the internet about him being a douche, in which case my reaction is simply RAGE!!! so i'm enjoying having a more intellectual discussion rather than yelling at my computer and having my girlfriend ask me to calm down.

Oh no, no, it's very nice when two people can talk about a serious issue like this in a calm, respectable manner, particularly over the internet.

As thefragile_jake mentioned, Tyler's preferred album format is having an overarching narrative in each album, pushing these lyrics through characters instead of directly attaching himself to them. Art? Yeah. Flimsy reasoning for what he's doing? Oh, yes. Do I agree with Tyler's lyrics in these cases (particularly the F word)? No. Not at all.

It's a strange thing with music, when you've got a good rapper with good songs who also has a lot of really problematic songs, too. Sure, you can look at them as being for the sake of narrative, that Tyler the skater dork doesn't condone things like this, but it's still contributing to a wider issue of glorification of homophobia and misogyny in music.

And yeah, I suppose I am turning the other cheek to an extent in regards to Tyler's lyrics by only listening to the "lake" songs (that line in "Rusty" was pretty clever). I'm not going to say that that's what everyone should do, though.

I apologize if this post wasn't entirely cohesive, since it's hard to string together my thoughts properly with an issue like this.

Makes me wonder sometimes how low Frank had to be when he joined OF, though.

[gorast]

Hodgy Beats released Untitled EP 2 today: http://oddfuture.tumblr.com/post/519...-available-for (Soundcloud stream doesn't have the right track order)

It's pretty solid, sounds pretty much like the first one, except all of the songs are a decent length. I wonder if this is a promo release for something like EP 1 was.

Wow, and then Wicked and Goodbye happened. Holy shit. That was heavy as fuck.

[october_midnight]

Tyler reported to Australian Police.

I've gotta say, the guy's a piece of shit. At a certain point, the whole 'Mannnnn, you just don't get it, that's the point man. To be offensive.' or 'He's young.' defenses just don't cut it. I've met 19 year olds and 17 year olds that I just don't mind saying they're pieces of shit that should shut up. I get the whole trying to be shocking thing, but give me a break. Why do people like this? It's as basic as that. Why would you enjoy and cheer at someone doing something like this? Not a slag towards musical taste or whatever. A government says you're not welcome due to the misogyny and flagrant bullshit you've spouted, you've got to expect it. You're not welcome. Why not just do the show, sing your songs...and prove them wrong. Shit is pathetic.

[Minpin]

A government says you're not welcome due to the misogyny and flagrant bullshit you've spouted, you've got to expect it. You're not welcome. Why not just do the show, sing your songs...and prove them wrong. Shit is pathetic.

Our government didn't say anything. They granted him a visa, essentially welcoming him. I don't really know this music, not my thing, but I'd sooner have him in the country than that jerkoff politician making a fuss. At least this Tyler guys offensiveness is in the guise of 'provocative art', unlike fuck face Alex Hawke, who's offensiveness has a much greater propensity to cause damage.
Edit: had a little extra read and saw that Melbournes Lord Mayor Pigface has also shared his 'disgust', hahaha yeah sure the guy that sics his police on to bash some peacefully protesting hippies, doesn't like violent lyrics. Fuck off!

[gorast]

Par for the course with Tyler. I've largely stopped listening to his music in the past couple of months. Hodgy, Earl (especially his new tracks) and Mike G are just as good, and less obnoxious.

[thefragile_jake]

Par for the course with Tyler. I've largely stopped listening to his music in the past couple of months. Hodgy, Earl (especially his new tracks) and Mike G are just as good, and less obnoxious.

So have I. I think I've listened to Wolf maybe three times as a whole since it was released? It's enjoy ability has really faded since March that's for sure. While I still think he's a talented producer, I really hope his next couple of records start to move past the N.E.R.D influenced song structures he loves. It's not horrible but I think another record with this kind of stuff would put him too much into a box. Lyrically he seems to be moving past the subject matter that was once prevalent in Bastard and Goblin....which is fine, I actually didn't mind it as I looked at it more of a character and took it as "story telling"....but I know it's not for everyone.

As far as the Tyler situation goes, as Final Destiny goes it's par for the course. All this stuff and negative opinions just add fuel to the fire I'd say.

I have yet to hear the new Hodgy stuff but man...when the heck is Earl's album coming out? He's coming to St. Louis in July and I'm considering going cause Chance the Rapper will be there too and his mixtape this year was solid.

[gorast]

So have I. I think I've listened to Wolf maybe three times as a whole since it was released? It's enjoy ability has really faded since March that's for sure. While I still think he's a talented producer, I really hope his next couple of records start to move past the N.E.R.D influenced song structures he loves. It's not horrible but I think another record with this kind of stuff would put him too much into a box. Lyrically he seems to be moving past the subject matter that was once prevalent in Bastard and Goblin....which is fine, I actually didn't mind it as I looked at it more of a character and took it as "story telling"....but I know it's not for everyone.

As far as the Tyler situation goes, as Final Destiny goes it's par for the course. All this stuff and negative opinions just add fuel to the fire I'd say.

I have yet to hear the new Hodgy stuff but man...when the heck is Earl's album coming out? He's coming to St. Louis in July and I'm considering going cause Chance the Rapper will be there too and his mixtape this year was solid.

He's been consistently implying that it's coming this year, but we're already halfway done and there's been no hints about a timeframe. Then again, Wolf was announced like a month before it came out, right?

[Presideo]

The hate Tyler gets by saying offensive shit gives me '00-era deja-vu from the time Eminem burst onto the scene. And his critics did a great job of holding his career down - he only sold a few million more albums and starred in a movie about his life after people sank their teeth into his vile lyrical hatred. It doesn't seem like Tyler went on some rant against women in general. He found out that there was a woman in the crowd who launched a social-media campaign against his career, and he specifically called her a cunt. That same woman likely paid to get into the concert and likely knew that she would receive negative attention from Tyler beforehand, which is pretty comical (personally, I would have used the term 'attention-whore' to describe her, not 'bitch' or 'cunt'.) Then, a conservative politician with nothing better to do decided to run with the story (because his constituents likely sent tons of letters and phone calls to his office, decrying Tyler as a menace to society who personally threatened them on stage...right? right?)

Musicians aren't role models for society, they're musicians. I recently learnt that John Lennon used to beat his first wife. After learning this fact, did I proceed to delete every Beatles album from my iPod and condemn him on social media sites? Nope - I never thought of him as being a man "above" any unsavory decisions in his life. I always considered him to be a great musician and nothing more.

[thefragile_jake]

He's been consistently implying that it's coming this year, but we're already halfway done and there's been no hints about a timeframe. Then again, Wolf was announced like a month before it came out, right?

It comes out next month!

I really liked "Whoa" and "Chum" but I thought that song with Mac Miller he did was not very good.
If anyone missed it, here it is..

http://pitchfork.com/news/50872-list...ft-mac-miller/

[gorast]

"I hope i lose you as a fan if you only fuck with me cause i rapped about raping girls when i was 15"

That moment when Earl seems like he's progressed more as a rapper than Tyler has.

But it's pretty awesome that Doris is just suddenly ready to be released. He should leave that pitched-down vocal shit to Tyler, though. Song's not too bad otherwise.

[thefragile_jake]

Yeah, I think on a second listen I just didn't care for Miller's verse the first time....even with the pitched down effect.

[gorast]

I'd just like to say that I'm really, really excited for Doris. All three singles have been great, and better yet, they make it quite clear that Earl has matured as a rapper. Just one more month.

[thefragile_jake]

I'd just like to say that I'm really, really excited for Doris. All three singles have been great, and better yet, they make it quite clear that Earl has matured as a rapper. Just one more month.

I agree man! Hive is an insanely great track and this next to Hesitation Marks, Doris is one of my most looked forward to releases this year. Surprised it hasn't leaked yet...but then again, we do have almost a whole month to go still.