NIN: The Greatest Hits

[Kyle]

I tried to make a b-sides/rare songs collection, but I gave up because the line is pretty fluid with NIN. And there's the NIN/Trent Reznor difference as well. And do I include original songs from the remix albums, or the half-remix/half-new songs like 10 Miles High? What about some of the soundtrack work, what about the new songs on Still? In fact, the problems begin already at the beginning, with Purest Feeling and Maybe Just Once, are they NIN?

Purest Feeling and Maybe Just Once are definitely NIN, they're just unreleased NIN so they won't be there.

Still is NIN, TGWTDT and TSN are not.

10 Miles High isn't half remix, that's an original song.

[cashpiles (closed)]

Greatest Hits compilations usually include one or two new songs. So that would be wicked if that was the case with this one.

Hesitation Marks comes out this year so I don't see why that'd be worthwhile to do.

It would still be awesome to have 2 new songs on the Greatest Hits... Who wouldn't want 2 new songs? It would also give long-time fans a reason to possibly buy it.

[Space Suicide]

It would still be awesome to have 2 new songs on the Greatest Hits... Who wouldn't want 2 new songs? It would also give long-time fans a reason to possibly buy it.

It'd either consist of two not worthy songs that were going to be on Hesitation Marks or two new recordings made up on the fly for it. I've never been a fan of Greatest Hits compilations that do nothing but catalog singles then add one or two new tracks for people like us to buy it.

[Amaro]

It'd either consist of two not worthy songs that were going to be on Hesitation Marks or a two new recordings made up on the fly for it. I've never been a fan of Great Hits compilations that do nothing but catalog singles then add one or two new tracks for people like us to buy it.

Trent doing tracks on the fly sometimes means gold, so count me that much interested, since I'm already a mega fan.

[Space Suicide]

Trent doing tracks on the fly sometimes means gold, so count me that much interested, since I'm already a mega fan.

I'm not saying I wouldn't mind it (as any new music is good music) but coming out so soon after Hesitation Marks I highly doubt we'd expect any new things on a GH album.

[Canuckle]

Crackpot Idea Below:

Release Two individual records, making a set called 'Eras' (ala Halos; corny, I know).

First disc (Eras 1) is everything from PHM to The Fragile-era. Mix of singles, remixes, 'deep-cuts', instrumentals; all weaved together to flow like a NIN album (aggressive opener; beef in the middle; little offcentre near the end and quiet finish) with segues from TR if required. No chronological order (please).

Second disc (Eras 2) is everything from ah-With the Teeth-ah to the Soundtrack work. Same format as the first, also allowing him to release new content if he wants.


The reason I suggest this odd format is there are two large demographics that encompass casual NIN fans, and they are split with TRs early 2000s absence from the scene (i.e., pre-With Teeth and With Teeth and onward). Each disc appeals to a certain group, while both should be sonically composed well-enough to also appeal to a die-hard fan as a set. The last reason I like this sort of format is that it can allow his work for the next decade to be called 'Eras 3'. Thus making sure the greatest hits collection is a continuous set and not a one off; just to have a second made 10 years from now but with newer material. Those who have collected the first 2 can then just grab the third to complete the set.

[millhouse]

Since Satellite and Everything were both recorded for the two new contractually-obligated tracks for the Interscope Greatest Hits record, where does this leave the record now?

When it was initially mentioned, I assumed it might be a case of throwing Non-Entity and Not So Pretty Now on a physical release, as they're both from the WT sessions/era and are paid for by Interscope, but then TR recorded the above two tracks.

Question is, with those two now Hesitation Marks tracks, does anyone know if Trent still owes Interscope a compilation record, or if the Columbia contract (which we initially assumed was just HTDA, until the announcement of Hesitation Marks) ended up "buying out" the Interscope obligation?

[sheepdean]

He still owes them a record, the HTDA signing wasn't part of the NIN contract, he'll still probably give new songs to the greatest hits, maybe not those though. It's due 2014, iirc.

[butter_hole]

It's still due to come out in 2014.

[goingincirclez]

Would be kinda funny if Satellite gets released as a single - it has every vibe to be successful. So then it becomes a "hit", and justly inducted to the GH compilation, completing the circle of life.

Oh, and Everything follows it there anyway as Trent's very special Fist Fuck to all the haters.

[millhouse]

Ahh, I assumed that, much like when Billy Corgan signed to Warner for his solo album or Zwan (cannot remember which it was), and Smashing Pumpkins were stuck on Warner for Zeitgeist, Columbia had ended up signing Trent (as NIN were essentially defunct) with the exception of the two tracks for the obligated Interscope greatest hits, and then NIN just ended up on Columbia (much to everyone's pleasure it would seem - the label are certainly making a big deal about HM, Trent seems to be happy with the label, etc) by virtue that Trent was now on Columbia.

Hope that makes sense. I saw Ash play 1977 in full last night and I'm shaking off a hell of a hangover.

[trollmanen]

It actually makes sense that the date was pushed back to 2014 as that's the 25th anniversary of NIN.

[That other guy]

"With the greatest-hits project shelved until 2014, the resulting, all-new Hesitation Marks (those two early tracks included) is both sonically singular and thematically linked to a particular scarred and multi-million-selling predecessor in the Nine Inch Nails catalog. "For some reason, when I started working more on Hesitation Marks, I started thinking back romantically about who I was when I was writing The Downward Spiral," Reznor says."


http://www.spin.com/featured/trent-r...gn=spintwitter

[thefragile_jake]

I've already starting this in the other "Greatest Hits" thread but I'm very much looking forward to this based on what Trent could possibly do for the presentation and packaging.

[Wretchedest]

, and then NIN just ended up on Columbia (much to everyone's pleasure it would seem.

Dude, no! I am outspokenly bothered by Trent's presence on a major label, and I know that a few other people on this board are also put off by it as well. There are quite a few very good reasons for this.

[gorast]

Dude, no! I am outspokenly bothered by Trent's presence on a major label, and I know that a few other people on this board are also put off by it as well. There are quite a few very good reasons for this.

And what reasons would those be, hm?

[jesus]

I'm confused, if Trent used both tracks in Hesitation Marks , and those are now of Columbia, he needs to make another 2 new song?

[Ryan]

I'm confused, if Trent used both tracks in Hesitation Marks , and those are now of Columbia, he needs to make another 2 new song?

yes jesus

[ninsp]

Dude, no! I am outspokenly bothered by Trent's presence on a major label, and I know that a few other people on this board are also put off by it as well. There are quite a few very good reasons for this.

Maybe, just maybe, Trent is tired of marketing and wanted to just focus on the music...maybe he found a label that wouldn't fuck with his vision but do the marketing for him? Gain some new fans and sell a LOT of tickets in the process?

[jesus]

yes jesus

2 new SONGS!!! O_O

[Wretchedest]

And what reasons would those be, hm?

surely you've seen them if you've read deep enough into a new album thread since the Columbia deals began but to clarify here are a few (and not necessarily in this order for me)

1. Trent has a long and contentious and very public relationship with large record labels. Things were so intense that he personally set out to break the model by trying to see if he could do things differently without them through numerous distribution experiments (do I have to explain those?). Were those a failure? Did he just want more? Does he need more money to support his family? I'm not trying to judge, here, but I wonder what happened. It's definitely disheartening that he stopped pursuing these though.

2. Large Record Labels Suck and I would prefer not to give them my money.
a. Large record labels largely determine our understanding of musical boundaries and essentially shape public taste. By determining which bands to sign and distribute, and by having the spending power to put them on mainstream but passively consumed media outlets like the radio, large labels effectively shape what the public perceives as acceptable music. Essentially they have a very real and very intense oligarchy on an entire art form. Do they carefully select and sign creative, challenging, boundary pushing music, or do they pander and create redundant bullshit that panders to the lowest common denominator? Have you seen MTV? Payola power.
b. The above described oligarchy creates a david/goliath situation when it comes to small, home grown bands. Large labels can pick up a band when they're talent is up to 'standard' or they can basically construct and grow their own "talent." By contrast, small, independent labels aren't subservient to like radio hits and video plays and give artists an oppurtunity to get themselves out there and succeed on their own merits. It's totally possible and there doesn't have to be millions and millions of dollars involved.
c. Record labels exert creative control, which makes me question the creative integrity of the bands that live on them. Nine Inch Nails is a well established band, sure... so maybe Trent can do his writing without being bothered. But he had not in the past. How is this time different? when Nine Inch nails were out on their own, like with Ghosts, we can be sure that Trent was able to put that together on his own and do what he wanted. Ghosts turned out well, the Slip... not so much... but both were made on his own merits and I think we can be sure of it. Trent has mentioned that "Sattelite and "Everything" were made for a greatest hits album, and they are the poppiest and most accessible songs on this new album. One of them could be interchanged witha Justin Timberlake single and no one would notice. This from the same guy who made Ghosts 37. Who knows, but it bothers me.

I could keep going but it's already pretty long... any help?

Maybe, just maybe, Trent is tired of marketing and wanted to just focus on the music...maybe he found a label that wouldn't fuck with his vision but do the marketing for him? Gain some new fans and sell a LOT of tickets in the process?

I don't doubt this at all. Of course I'm sure it's a very well intentioned. But Nine Inch Nails is an insanely popular and successful band. They could literally do nothing and continue to get fans for decades. He'll sell tickets one way or another. If you haven't noticed NIN and HTDA tickets sell out typically in under 5 minutes. That has nothing to do with Columbia.

My point is he's making the big bucks either way and he doesn't need these people. Surely Columbia takes enough of a cut to mitigate any extra profits made?

[chroipahtz]

1. Trent has a long and contentious and very public relationship with large record labels. Things were so intense that he personally set out to break the model by trying to see if he could do things differently without them through numerous distribution experiments (do I have to explain those?). Were those a failure? Did he just want more? Does he need more money to support his family? I'm not trying to judge, here, but I wonder what happened. It's definitely disheartening that he stopped pursuing these though.

Trent just covered this in the Spin interview.

As for your second point, I can't say much about it because it just seems like paranoia. Judging by the few comments from Columbia execs (I think they were in the Spin article as well), they don't want to fuck with Trent's vision. If they did, I doubt Trent would have stayed on, don't you think?

[Wretchedest]

Trent just covered this in the Spin interview.

As for your second point, I can't say much about it because it just seems like paranoia. Judging by the few comments from Columbia execs (I think they were in the Spin article as well), they don't want to fuck with Trent's vision. If they did, I doubt Trent would have stayed on, don't you think?

I guess I could see how it would construed as paranoia, but that's just basically how social construction works. The music we are exposed to throughout our lives, especially early on, determines our perception and definition of it. I find the fact that this music is largely owned by just four companies a little bit concerning. This concept applies down the line from various forms of art to inlets of information like news outlets and social media. That's how we adapt and determine what we perceive to be acceptible. Unless we just come up with it on our own? With no outside influence at all?

[millhouse]

Dude, no! I am outspokenly bothered by Trent's presence on a major label

I was meaning the band and the label, not the fan base. ie: Columbia signed Reznor, and Reznor decides to resurrect NIN. Columbia happy. Reznor happy.

[gorast]

Columbia is not the entity it was in 1975, or 1985, or 1995. Trent has said, repeatedly, that the deal is a licensing deal, not a full contract, and the legal information for both HM's release and HTDA's releases indicate that (Nullco under exclusive license to Columbia). It's not a 360 deal, he's not locked into it, and it's not even long-term. It's a mutually beneficial deal - higher exposure for NIN, increased relevance for Columbia, more money for both of them.

Speaking of money, in Trent's case, I highly doubt that was the primary motivator. I'm sure the dude's doing just fine on the royalties from Interscope. And sure, he could coast on his existing fanbase, but what lame-ass band is content to just preach to the choir for the rest of their career? Why would you ever think Trent Reznor, of all people, would settle for that? He's said it in dozens of interviews since last year - attempting to do all the marketing research on his own drove him insane and damaged his enthusiasm for the music he was making.

And your spiel about Big Bad Labels? Sure, maybe in, like, 2003. That shit doesn't apply to music enthusiasts like you or me. But you know what? Radio still drags in new fans. And NIN did not have radio play in Florida during the Nullco years. I never heard Discipline or Echoplex on the radio even once in the past five years. But you know what? I've heard Came Back Haunted at least four times, and I barely listen to radio anymore. That's four opportunities to catch new ears, options that weren't available when Trent was trying out the indie gig.

The point is that the Big Bad Label does not exist any more. Labels still have a degree of power, but by no means do they have a stranglehold on the market. Smaller labels are growing in number and influence, the internet is becoming the dominant form of record consumption, streaming is becoming gigantic, and older artists like NIN are turning the tables on labels, turning them into glorified distributors of the music. You know who else has the exact same deal as NIN and HTDA? Earl Sweatshirt.

He's nineteen.

The Big Bad Label doesn't exist any more. And we're still discussing this a year after the fact? Christ.

[Wretchedest]

That shit doesn't apply to music enthusiasts like you or me. But you know what? Radio still drags in new fans. And NIN did not have radio play in Florida during the Nullco years. I never heard Discipline or Echoplex on the radio even once in the past five years. But you know what? I've heard Came Back Haunted at least four times, and I barely listen to radio anymore. That's four opportunities to catch new ears, options that weren't available when Trent was trying out the indie gig.

I think you make plenty of good points and this is definitely one where we have to agree to disagree. Sure, trent is seeing more radio play. He's reaching more ears, etc. But that's what I'm taking issue with, a business move decidedly in the interest of just getting more radio play. tailoring your music and your distribution plan for radio play and accessibility. Fuck that. Fuck that all day. That was the whole problem in the first place. Plenty of bands are able to make a living and find success without this devotion to marketing research and pandering. Plenty of them, and they don't start with the kind of name that NIN has.

The point is that the Big Bad Label does not exist any more. Labels still have a degree of power, but by no means do they have a stranglehold on the market. Smaller labels are growing in number and influence, the internet is becoming the dominant form of record consumption, streaming is becoming gigantic, and older artists like NIN are turning the tables on labels, turning them into glorified distributors of the music. You know who else has the exact same deal as NIN and HTDA? Earl Sweatshirt.

Clearly they are still a thing. Clearly people are still watching the MTV VMAs in goddamn droves right now, how can you say they don't exist. There are fewer, because they are fucking eating each other and becoming bigger. They have less of a strangle hold because people that are paying for music are often paying for shit on smaller labels instead, sometimes actively. People are making choices that don't involve them. It doesn't make them any better, even if they're adaptable.

That streaming your talking about: also largely controlled by big business.

NIN WAS turning the tables on the labels, as you describe, but it seems the tables got turned back, and that's why we're here.

[millhouse]

Plenty of bands are able to make a living and find success without this devotion to marketing research and pandering. Plenty of them, and they don't start with the kind of name that NIN has.

And even more bands go bust because people eek out miserable amounts of cash from a project that takes exorbitant amounts of cash to continue/develop/tour/whatever.

You know what the problem with the VMAs/mass market music/big bad labels is?

There's an audience for it. People eat that shit up. If there wasn't an audience for it, then it wouldn't exist. Whether you like it or not, a shit tonne of people like a shit tonne of shitty music. Democracy at work.

I can be cynical and says "Fuck those stupid morons with their bad taste in music and their ignorance of the world!" but what's the point? I'd rather just go put on something I want to listen to.

[Khrz]

You know what the problem with the VMAs/mass market music/big bad labels is?

Whether you like it or not, a shit tonne of people like a shit tonne of shitty music. Democracy at work.

Which is also the biggest flaw of all the little kickstarter-like labels who release the top-voted albums from their subscribers.

[Wretchedest]

And even more bands go bust because people eek out miserable amounts of cash from a project that takes exorbitant amounts of cash to continue/develop/tour/whatever.

You know what the problem with the VMAs/mass market music/big bad labels is?

There's an audience for it. People eat that shit up. If there wasn't an audience for it, then it wouldn't exist. Whether you like it or not, a shit tonne of people like a shit tonne of shitty music. Democracy at work.

I can be cynical and says "Fuck those stupid morons with their bad taste in music and their ignorance of the world!" but what's the point? I'd rather just go put on something I want to listen to.

Ok, well taken. Lots of tiny bands struggle. But more than ever suceed.

And that audience for the VMAs/mass market/ big bad labels is created by those guys. They built the comfort zone and the social structure that feeds itself
If they were exposed to broader media, media education, media literacy from an early age.... would they still seek it out? Possibly. I think we battle that illiteracy with our wallets, our purchasing power, our voices, we can maybe create a broader landscape where those other, smaller acts can succeed more, and on their own merits.

Of course, to each their own, and I'll go listen to whatever I want but I think that cultural impact is important and I guess it's why I've gone this far in this thread...

[millhouse]

And that audience for the VMAs/mass market/ big bad labels is created by those guys. They built the comfort zone and the social structure that feeds itself
If they were exposed to broader media, media education, media literacy from an early age.... would they still seek it out? Possibly. I think we battle that illiteracy with our wallets, our purchasing power, our voices, we can maybe create a broader landscape where those other, smaller acts can succeed more, and on their own merits.

What movies do you what? What tv do you watch? Are you part of the problem with the big bad studios and the big bad networks?

Not being a dick, just querying. Why should music be any different, yknow?

The other side of the coin is what if we, as the minority, are just plain fucking wrong? What if NIN is absolute garbage (besides the "fuck you like an animal" song), and Miley Cyrus really is a musical genius, as are One Direction?

Ok, sarcasm aside, I feel sick writing that.