Sigil 03_: An omen EP_

[theimage13]

Way to exclude fans and miss out on revenue.

Something tells me that offering a download costs a lot less than pressing a CD, printing artwork for it, and shipping them all over the country. Honestly though, that's only a guess. But if I'm guessing right, why does that translate into lost revenue?

That said, I'm still sad about the news. Yeah, I'll probably go ahead and buy the download anyway, but I really like holding the actual album in my hands and checking out any artwork/lyrics that come with it when I give it that first listen. No record player on tour, so no physical copy for me.

really? i mean - what use could you have for the CD? the music you can get digitally (and even burn on a CD if you want to play it in your car or something) and if you want some physical product - well, the vinyl is a perfect option, the packaging is larger, more detailed and more beautiful.

What use? How about being able to put it in a CD player without having to keep a stash of blank discs that deteriorate over time? How about being 100% sure that you're listening to the album exactly the way it was meant to be heard, and not wondering if your burner screwed you over by putting gaps where there shouldn't be (or not putting gaps where there should be)? How about something to listen to in your car if you have a CD deck and don't like the sound of FM transmitters, or don't like traveling with an easily lost/stolen $200-$300 MP3 player?

Vinyl is the perfect option? Please. The majority of consumers don't even own a way to listen to vinyl, and of those who do, many own pretty crappy players. Packaging is larger? Great, that means the more albums I buy, the more storage space I have to dedicate to them. And when it comes time to move? I've helped vinyl collectors move - even they agree that it's a pretty shitty thin to deal with.

I realize that many people are done with CDs...but there's still a place for them in the market.

[somewhat_]

I believe the decision was made because they didn't believe the costs of pressing the CD's was justified when they will be releasing the LP (which will include at least a couple of tracks from the EP) on CD a few months down the road. I'm guessing that maybe they are throwing what they believe to be a couple of the stronger tracks from the LP and a few of the tracks that didn't fit conceptually (or sonically, or whatever? - what you might call leftovers from the LP) on to the EP.

[Horican]

I realize that many people are done with CDs...but there's still a place for them in the market.

I agree. Obviously there is still a place for them on the market, CDs are still the most popular physical way to get music, but if you are a collector (resist the obvious joke!) you're much more likely to collect vinyl then CD, because the first is seen as more of a collectible and less of a product.

it seems to me as if this EP is not the "main thing" but a stopgap before the actual album, therefore HTDA aren't in this to sell shitloads of copies of this EP, the EP isn't made for mass consumption, it's meant to spread awareness about the band and their music before they drop their big important record (which i guess will get a wide physical release on all imaginable formats). therefore - having a physical release smaller in scale and more geared toward collectors is actually good for this release.

[snaapz]

No CD? No problem! (In all seriousness this is preferable)

THEN

[FernandoDante]

really? i mean - what use could you have for the CD? the music you can get digitally (and even burn on a CD if you want to play it in your car or something) and if you want some physical product - well, the vinyl is a perfect option, the packaging is larger, more detailed and more beautiful. basically, i think the only reason that vinyl+digital hasn't (yet) become the standard for music fans today is because vinyl is relatively expansive, when compared with CDs. but now, when you can download most music for very little money or for nothing at all, when you actually love something enough to want it physically in your hands it's fair to spend some extra $ and get something with more value that feels truer to the art and to the music then a small CD case.BTW, I'm guessing that the full album will also come on CD.

I don't have a turntable, and vinyls are ridiculously more expensive (4x the price of the CD) in lots of parts of the world. I don't intend on starting a record collection now, so I'm either gladly paying for a CD, or not paying. Some people like CDs, and that's ok.

[Deadpool]

So, I was thinking... with An Omen getting an official release on a big-shot label, that makes it more likely to leak, yeah? I'm just trying to take inventory, so correct me if I'm wrong: Ghosts I-IV didn't leak, The Slip didn't leak, How To Destroy Angels EP didn't leak. What about The Social Network and Dragon Tattoo? We obviously had samplers for both of those, and they were put out on big labels(?), but I don't remember a specific leak.

Also, I fucking love the art direction. Rob & Co. always impress, but this might be some of my favorite stuff yet. I think it's so cool that he's included in the promo shots - it's fascinating how the direction of the band has shifted: with the debut EP, it was clearly more about creating an identity separate from NIN (visually speaking w/ Mariqueen in the fore as frontwoman), but now it's more like "OK, Trent's the spokesperson, but we're a TEAM / BAND / COLLECTIVE." Pretty badass.

Just to confirm, we're getting the new EP the same day that Black Ops II hits stores, right? Well, that's pretty cool. New music extravaganza this Nov.! Fuck yeah. I wonder how many of the new songs will carry over to the LP........

On top of all this great release news, we have LIVE DATES to look forward to. That is ridiculously exciting. The fact that there is an all new live set-up and personell change seems like exactly the type of thing to get Trent re-energized for a tour. I love the idea of him being in the wings for a whole show (NIN + Saul Williams @ Voodoo comes to mind), with his full attention on making noise and keeping the music going. Can't wait to see how Mariqueen and Atticus change the live dynamic, too: unlike NIN, they're not hired guns - they've all been writing together in a studio for months. Should be interesting to see them stretch their legs and interact/perform in a live setting.

[FernandoDante]

Just proves that going independent doesn't work, you can reach your own fans but just doesn't bring enough exposure. I would like to point out though, I have nothing against the labels (apart from a select few) and I'm starting to get more and more pissed off with high ticket prices to see the bands, £100 for The Cure not so long ago if I remember correctly and £200 to see Reading and Leeds festival. NIN have always been fair with ticket prices (never more than £30) and still put on an amazing show, hopefully this won't change with HTDA!!!

This is a much more polite and elegant version of the things I was trying to say earlier in this thread.

[GoodSoldier333]

NIN have always been fair with ticket prices (never more than £30)

Not the case in those last two years of touring..

[Leviathant]

When the debut by Them Crooked Vultures came out, it was available on vinyl for about $2 more than a digital download - and the vinyl actually came with a download code, so you could have the album on MP3, too. (In a twist of irony, the MP3s you could download were recorded from playback of the vinyl edition of the album - worst of both worlds!) If it's the year 2012, nearly 2013, and you're posting to a message board from any kind of capable computer, there's really no excuse for you don't have a portable digital playback device that does not require physical media.

You can get a 4gb iPod for $25 shipped on eBay. That's how much The Fragile cost the month it debuted. That's how much one copy of the Deluxe Edition of the Downward Spiral costs.

This Christmas, do yourself a huge favor - get rid of your CD players, if you haven't already. The only CDs I have left are my NIN collection, mostly. They sit in a closet, collecting dust - not unlike my modest vinyl collection.

[Leviathant]

So, I was thinking... with An Omen getting an official release on a big-shot label, that makes it more likely to leak, yeah? I'm just trying to take inventory, so correct me if I'm wrong: Ghosts I-IV didn't leak, The Slip didn't leak, How To Destroy Angels EP didn't leak. What about The Social Network and Dragon Tattoo? We obviously had samplers for both of those, and they were put out on big labels(?), but I don't remember a specific leak.

When Trent was in full control of the entire chain, there were no leaks.

With Columbia being involved, we got the name and track listing of the EP well before it was announced. The Amazon pre-order page prematurely displayed the promo photo of the band before the official announcement. Since the EP is not being pressed to CD, one of the major avenues for leakage doesn't exist, but if there are promo CDs made, I think there will be a collector feeding frenzy on those.

I think that if there's a leak of the EP, it would be at most a day or two before release, and even then, that will be a crappy vinyl rip.

[sore_and_crucified]

Not the case in those last two years of touring..

I only paid around £30 to see the NIN/Jane's tour at the MEN in Manchester- 2009!

[richardp]

When Trent was in full control of the entire chain, there were no leaks.

With Columbia being involved, we got the name and track listing of the EP well before it was announced. The Amazon pre-order page prematurely displayed the promo photo of the band before the official announcement. Since the EP is not being pressed to CD, one of the major avenues for leakage doesn't exist, but if there are promo CDs made, I think there will be a collector feeding frenzy on those.

I think that if there's a leak of the EP, it would be at most a day or two before release, and even then, that will be a crappy vinyl rip.

More than likely there won't be promo cd's made, and will just be watermarked live streams over the internet sent out to press.

[bgalbraith]

More than likely there won't be promo cd's made, and will just be watermarked live streams over the internet sent out to press.

Let's hope we don't have another KROQ debacle.

[FernandoDante]

When the debut by Them Crooked Vultures came out, it was available on vinyl for about $2 more than a digital download - and the vinyl actually came with a download code, so you could have the album on MP3, too. (In a twist of irony, the MP3s you could download were recorded from playback of the vinyl edition of the album - worst of both worlds!) If it's the year 2012, nearly 2013, and you're posting to a message board from any kind of capable computer, there's really no excuse for you don't have a portable digital playback device that does not require physical media. You can get a 4gb iPod for $25 shipped on eBay. That's how much The Fragile cost the month it debuted. That's how much one copy of the Deluxe Edition of the Downward Spiral costs.This Christmas, do yourself a huge favor - get rid of your CD players, if you haven't already. The only CDs I have left are my NIN collection, mostly. They sit in a closet, collecting dust - not unlike my modest vinyl collection.

The best sound equipment in my house (and in thousands other houses in third world countries) is connected to a CD player, and I have no intention of getting the adapters necessary to fit it the equipment to an iPod or a computer. Not "yet" anyway, and even if I do it next year, lots of people will only do it in 2014, 2015, or much later. Plus, people with huge CD collections still want a device dedicated exclusively to that - it makes the CDs feel more useful. Tangible media is nice to interact with, and it doesn't HAVE to be a vinyl. So, it's more complex than "just get rid of it". Lots of feelings of nostalgia and convenience are still happily associated with CDs.

[somewhat_]

This can be found on Columbia's website (under "press"):


Trent Reznor Announces Signing With Columbia Records for How To Destroy Angels Project

HOW TO DESTROY ANGELS ANNOUNCES AN OMEN EP

AN OMEN DUE NOVEMBER 13TH VIA COLUMBIA RECORDS

LP DUE IN SPRING 2013

How To Destroy Angels is a collective from Los Angeles composed of Mariqueen Maandig, Trent Reznor, Atticus Ross, and Rob Sheridan. An Omen EP will be their debut release on Columbia Records, available November 13th digitally and on 12” vinyl. You’ll begin to hear it and see it in the coming weeks.

Read Trent Reznor’s announcement here: on.fb.me/SfMNRE

[BenAkenobi]

before demanding CD release, let's wait and see – maybe their prime is going to be 24 bit surround format or something. maybe plain old stereo files will be free download and the vinyl is simply a medium for “bigger artwork” as was pointed out earlier. this way the DVD is a way to go, not CD lol

[R-Dot-Yung]

Umm, why are we getting crazy analyzing pictures like it's an ARG. Rob Sheridan just has a massive hard on for Glitch Art.

Also, I haven't listened to is your love strong enough in a while and I forgot how good it is. I think the quality of production on that record vs. the whole first EP is a night and day difference. Assuming that the new record follows the upward trajectory, I think this is going to be some seriously awesome stuff. I can't wait to hear that track live with that booming sub bass. Woo I am READY for this shit.

[WorzelG]

.....before they drop their big impotent record (which i guess will get a wide physical release on all imaginable formats)

One of the reasons I hate spell-checkers on computers!

Anyway, my thing about CDs is that I have an inherent mistrust of digital information, I like to have the CD so I know I can reimport the stuff - I'm always paranoid my computer will bust and I'll lose all the data. I should do back-ups really

[ImTheWiseJanitor]

One of the reasons I hate spell-checkers on computers!

Anyway, my thing about CDs is that I have an inherent mistrust of digital information, I like to have the CD so I know I can reimport the stuff - I'm always paranoid my computer will bust and I'll lose all the data. I should do back-ups really

I'm in the same boat. Luckily, nowadays a lot of digital retailers send you direct links to your downloads via e-mail, so you can re-download them without any trouble. But I definitely agree about preference to CDs over digital. I'm not too picky about omgmustbeperfectineveryway sound quality, either. It's the music on my iPod, not master files or anything.

But I'm just glad to have new music. Assuming there'll be some kind of deal where you get a digital copy of the album with purchase of the vinyl copy, I think I'll be satisfied without a CD copy. If not, hey, having the digital files is better than nothing.

Hey! After this drops, we'll have a whole album's worth of material! Maybe I should burn all the HTDA songs to a disc after the release to fool myself into thinking it's a full album.

Edit: By the way, who else can't stop hearing the words "we are going to be performing live" in their head? Seriously, I'm considering dropping any near-future purchases I was making to set aside money to make it to one of these shows - whichever one is closest, no matter the distance.

[carpenoctem]

I've sort of converted to digital this year. It's been a big relief, honestly. Buying digital music is instant, easy and cheaper. I've bought a few CDs this year - the new records from Animal Collective and Amanda Palmer, and the latter just because it came with the Kickstarter package I threw down $125 for - and I'm sure I'll continue to do so for the really special artists that are close to my heart. But that's just from an obsessive collector's point of view. For the rest, it's all digital for me now. I'm just so excited we're finally getting news, I don't care if it comes pressed between a half-eaten bologna sandwich (ESPECIALLY IF THE OTHER HALF WAS EATEN BY TRENT, OMG). Or, should we probably start checking bathrooms for spare USB sticks? Has anyone organized a group effort on this?

My prediction: EP will contain two songs from the forthcoming LP. They don't want to blow their wad too soon, but it is after all titled "An Omen." The four other tracks will be songs that didn't fit with the flow of the LP, and I think one of them will be an instrumental. As for the LP, who knows? Maybe twelve tracks?

[blassster]

One of the reasons I hate spell-checkers on computers!

Anyway, my thing about CDs is that I have an inherent mistrust of digital information, I like to have the CD so I know I can reimport the stuff - I'm always paranoid my computer will bust and I'll lose all the data. I should do back-ups really

I always dropbox the .zip downloads of digital albums I've bought. This way I don't have to contact the distribution channels to send me another download link (if they're willing) in case of issues on my side. Also, accessibility.


I didn't have a turntable and was in temporary living conditions during the first ep release, but I've got the new one on pre order. Gotta track down the old one sometime

[richardp]

I gave up CDs early last year and have since went entirely digital, and if I want a physical copy, I'll buy it on vinyl. And, just my opinion, but it's such a cop out when people say "not every one has a record player", because honestly, you can go to any second hand store and buy a system for pretty cheap. It's incredibly easy to get a record player. Plus it sounds better and is a more rewarding experience. Just my two cents. CDs are as dead of a format as cassettes and DVDs are.

[sheepdean]

I kinda hope there's nothing instrumental - TR/AR have given us almost 100 instrumental pieces over the past 4 years (99 in all, to my count), and I don't know how much Mariqueen can add to the mix to make it not sound like "oh, that would make a good Ghost/that would work well in that scene". Though, I'd quite like to hear an "instrumental" piece that uses Q's voice as an instrument, a la Pink Floyd's The Great Gig In The Sky.

[Horican]

I kinda hope there's nothing instrumental - TR/AR have given us almost 100 instrumental pieces over the past 4 years (99 in all, to my count), and I don't know how much Mariqueen can add to the mix to make it not sound like "oh, that would make a good Ghost/that would work well in that scene". Though, I'd quite like to hear an "instrumental" piece that uses Q's voice as an instrument, a la Pink Floyd's The Great Gig In The Sky.

FUCK
TR+AR written and released more then 6 hours of instrumental music in the past 4 years. (including The Slip, despite not being written with AR). that's quite a lot.

[thelastdisciple]

What use? How about being able to put it in a CD player without having to keep a stash of blank discs that deteriorate over time? How about being 100% sure that you're listening to the album exactly the way it was meant to be heard, and not wondering if your burner screwed you over by putting gaps where there shouldn't be (or not putting gaps where there should be)? How about something to listen to in your car if you have a CD deck and don't like the sound of FM transmitters, or don't like traveling with an easily lost/stolen $200-$300 MP3 player?

Vinyl is the perfect option? Please. The majority of consumers don't even own a way to listen to vinyl, and of those who do, many own pretty crappy players. Packaging is larger? Great, that means the more albums I buy, the more storage space I have to dedicate to them. And when it comes time to move? I've helped vinyl collectors move - even they agree that it's a pretty shitty thin to deal with.

I realize that many people are done with CDs...but there's still a place for them in the market.

This!

CDs are definitely my happy medium. Digital is just lazy and intangible, you can get corrupted files or codec troubles, there's definitely no collector's value whatsoever and for the exact reasons you mentioned it's why i avoid "just burning a blank cd" most of the time... at least CDs are a bit more reliable in the way they're pressed that you're hearing an official quality, a lot more precise... yes there's fuck ups from time to time but it's a lot less common in comparison, also the little booklets or inserts that come with most CDs they're very convenient for artist signatures at a concert or event..you can easily fit something like that in your pocket and not have it all bent up if your careful whereas obviously with Digital you have nothing to show for it at all unless you have some wicked awesome photo printer that can reproduce shit like that in a similar quality.. and also carrying around a big Vinyl sleeve can be a bit obnoxious, it's more prone to being damaged.

Vinyl's just a bit more expensive for someone on a day to day budget and yes they definitely take up a helluva lot more space, i don't wish to fork out on a record player that's over $100 just yet and going second hand for this medium would be a bit shady and not guaranteeing of a good experience so no thanks.

How much you want to bet the vinyls for this EP will only be a limited run anyways...which means once they run out... stuck with shitty digital.

It's definitely disappointing that they're ditching the CD option for the EP, yes i realize it's an expensive endeavor to produce but hopefully there will be one for the LP.

[richardp]

going second hand for this medium would be a bit shady and not guaranteeing of a good experience so no thanks.

Not exactly. I got my system, an old Sony turntable, Sony receiver and two speaker cabinets at a yard sale for 50 bucks a few years ago. Took 'em home, cleaned em off a bit and it sounds amazing. 100 times better than if I were to play a cd through my blu-ray player.

[thelastdisciple]

Not exactly. I got my system, an old Sony turntable, Sony receiver and two speaker cabinets at a yard sale for 50 bucks a few years ago. Took 'em home, cleaned em off a bit and it sounds amazing. 100 times better than if I were to play a cd through my blu-ray player.

Lucky grab then, will just have to keep an eye out i suppose.

I can get a bit too pessimistic with used shit sometimes, i don't blame myself though because I've definitely had the experiences to back it up.

So when do you guys figure we'll be hearing the first single?

[jhulud]

People, people...vinyl, digital, CD, 8-track, Morse Code, Smoke Signals...who gives a rat's ass how it's really released...IT'S NEW HTDA MUSIC!!! Just get psyched and stoked and pumped about THAT! I know I am!!! F U C K Y E A H ! ! !

[FernandoDante]

I gave up CDs early last year and have since went entirely digital, and if I want a physical copy, I'll buy it on vinyl. And, just my opinion, but it's such a cop out when people say "not every one has a record player", because honestly, you can go to any second hand store and buy a system for pretty cheap. It's incredibly easy to get a record player. Plus it sounds better and is a more rewarding experience. Just my two cents. CDs are as dead of a format as cassettes and DVDs are.

Not everyone has a record player, and not everyone wants to start paying for a brand new musical collection in a format that's (much) more expensive and has some other downsides (space/fragility/cleaning up). It's not a cop out, it's financially inconvenient to start over. I think you were lucky in buying an old turntable that isn't shit. Every time I see one for sale, it's missing the needle. Also, DVDs are dead? I don't think I know more than two people who own Blu-Ray players around here - and neither of them are really sure what HD is, they just bought the expensive new thing at the store. DVD is still too massively available and accepted to be "dead". Of course us NIN fans have been used to HD and high-end stuff for a few years now, but IMO we're the minority.

[somewhat_]

So when do you guys figure we'll be hearing the first single?

I'm going to go with the next week or two.