Star Wars: The Last Jedi - SPOILERS

[Alexandros]

I think I'm reasonably happy with it. My first impression is that I found it more interesting than TFA, it definitely plays around with the core concepts of the mythos in a way that challenges the way you perceived Star Wars so far, which I can see how alienates many people. The humour felt a bit off at times but other times it was fine.

Cons: I agree with everyone that the casino subplot needs to die a horrible death, at least the way it was handled. I appreciate the general sentiment or message it wanted to get across, but the execution could have been handled much, MUCH better. The other problem I had with the film was that I got the feeling sometimes that we were missing a scene. Like, there was a transition or an event in the film which had me momentarily questioning how such and such got here all of a sudden etc.

Pros: Really like the dynamic between Kylo and Rey. Something interesting can be done with it, though Spoiler: they did stop just shy of going somewhere really interesting with it after Snoke's death. I liked the Force stuff, and the kind of trippy element that was added in certain Force related scenes. I thought Luke's part in the story was satisfying. And finally there are some very cool scenes that will stand out in all of the SW movies. From the top of my head: Spoiler: the throne room fight, the light speed ramming, the white/red contrast and how they played with it in the mineral planet. Also, Spoiler: (apparently) puppet Yoda!.

Curious to see how I will perceive it on a second viewing. And of course how it will tie to Episode IX.

[neorev]

A pretty cool little easter egg/foreshadowing connecting Rogue One to The Last Jedi...
https://nerdist.com/star-wars-the-la...pace-tracking/

[Dr Channard]

Spoiler: Luke milking the titties, the whole opening with Poe razzing whatshisname, Chewie losing his appetite. Couldn't do it.

Well, yeah, there was definitely some Spoiler: monkey business in TLJ.

After seeing it, Mark Hamill’s disagreement on the cynical character shift makes sense. Now 2/3 of the way through the new trilogy and the way they portray Luke in his later years, it makes me wonder if he didn’t take just a little too much force lightening to the head back in the emperor’s throne room at the end of ROTJ. Hamill still acted the hell out of it, but man, the character and some scenarios presented with him felt off.

[SM Rollinger]

I just cant get behind this one, fuck Disney. I miss the hell out of the prequel era (99-2013).

Luke Skywalker, the hero of the rebellion this aint. This is some fan fiction bullshit.

Fuck you Di$ney, fuck you right to hell.

[eversonpoe]

[imail724]

I miss the hell out of the prequel era (99-2013).

wat

[sonic_discord]

While I will admit that is a good point, it's a little different when there are EIGHT (count em) other preceding movies where it doesn't happen and it's suddenly introduced this late in the game. It kind of reminds me of that scene in the prequels when it's suddenly revealed that R2-D2 has rocket thrusters and can use them to fly. All I could think of is the dozens of times that would have come in handy in episodes IV-VI, but he NEVER USES THEM AGAIN (what's their excuse for that? They just broke at some point and Anakin, Obi-Wan, AND Luke were ALL too lazy to fix it??). Anyway, I personally wasn't bothered by it too much, but I get why it pissed people off or they thought it was lame.

[Wretchedest]

Fan fiction is every theory about Rey's parents. This movie disposed of coincidence as a tool, one of the series old crutches.

[M1ke]

This was one of the deleted scenes that Rian Johnson detailed, and said will be available amongst home video extras:

“And then on the island, there’s a massive sequence that we shot with Daisy and Mark, which is kind of an additional sort of trial/test that she goes through, that involves her and Mark, and then a big emotional scene between the two of them. I mean, it’s big stuff, it’s like actual real scenes.”

Sweet! I'll have to check that out when it's released!

[eversonpoe]

While I will admit that is a good point, it's a little different when there are EIGHT (count em) other preceding movies where it doesn't happen and it's suddenly introduced this late in the game. It kind of reminds me of that scene in the prequels when it's suddenly revealed that R2-D2 has rocket thrusters and can use them to fly. All I could think of is the dozens of times that would have come in handy in episodes IV-VI, but he NEVER USES THEM AGAIN (what's their excuse for that? They just broke at some point and Anakin, Obi-Wan, AND Luke were ALL too lazy to fix it??). Anyway, I personally wasn't bothered by it too much, but I get why it pissed people off or they thought it was lame.

yeah, it's ridiculous that he had those rocket thrusters in the prequels and not in the original trilogy, but the "explanation" is that they probably broke and, because no one else knew about them, they never got fixed. which is lazy and stupid.

new force powers being displayed is awesome because it means that we haven't (hadn't) seen everything that force-sensitive people are capable of...why is that a bad thing? there were new ships in this movie that we hadn't seen before, is that a breach of the established material, too? no, because things change. Spoiler: it's also entirely possible that, as the children of anakin skywalker, leia and luke have a way with the force that no one else does, given their deep connection to it. i can't for the life of me understand why people would be mad about that instead of excited about it. it's like there are so many people who just want an excuse to be pissed off at this movie, and that makes me sad.

[Maximilian]

I just cant get behind this one, fuck Disney. I miss the hell out of the prequel era (99-2013).

Luke Skywalker, the hero of the rebellion this aint. This is some fan fiction bullshit.

Fuck you Di$ney, fuck you right to hell.

I fully reject that this is where Luke Skywalker ends up and how he dies. I want to know what George Lucas had in mind before Disney bought him out.

[Conan The Barbarian]

This reminds me of Batman V Superman. Those who hated it were completely shitting on those who liked it and told their opinion was wrong

Now its people who loved jedi completely shitting on those who didnt like it.

Did you know if you didnt like the rose character, you’re racist?

Yea, that’s the type of shit being spread around on twitter. Fuck all this nonsense.

[Swykk]

Except that Batman vs Superman is horrible garbage.

Seriously though, I LOVE that TLJ’s theme is “Fuck what you think you know, out with the old, and let’s let the new blood take over and not repeat the past.” Spoiler: For fuck’s sake, Yoda shows up to practically tell Luke this very thing. Luke is old, tired, and beat down. He uses the last of his power to give the Resistance a chance and then passes happily as the sun rises. That’s a pretty good way to go, if you ask me.

[Dr Channard]

So, was Snoke a sith, or not? It seemed like earlier speculations was that he wasn’t, but from this movie he seemed to have the powers of the sith. He seemed to be following the sith rule of two. He seemed to be devoted verbatim to Palpatine’s vision of ruling an empire. And he was thoroughly driven to go way out of his way to destroy Luke (I’m guessing because Luke destroyed the sith in ROTJ?) who had already forfeited the game so to speak. Snoke felt like a sith to me.

Edit:

Seriously though, I LOVE that TLJ’s theme is “Fuck what you think you know, out with the old, and let’s let the new blood take over and not repeat the past.” Spoiler: For fuck’s sake, Yoda shows up to practically tell Luke this very thing. Luke is old, tired, and beat down. He uses the last of his power to give the Resistance a chance and then passes happily as the sun rises. That’s a pretty good way to go, if you ask me.

Interestingly, Spoiler: Kylo gave Rey a similar “about the past... let it all die” speech towards the end. Also interesting, he didn’t mean it any more than Yoda did.

[imail724]

While I will admit that is a good point, it's a little different when there are EIGHT (count em) other preceding movies where it doesn't happen and it's suddenly introduced this late in the game. It kind of reminds me of that scene in the prequels when it's suddenly revealed that R2-D2 has rocket thrusters and can use them to fly. All I could think of is the dozens of times that would have come in handy in episodes IV-VI, but he NEVER USES THEM AGAIN (what's their excuse for that? They just broke at some point and Anakin, Obi-Wan, AND Luke were ALL too lazy to fix it??). Anyway, I personally wasn't bothered by it too much, but I get why it pissed people off or they thought it was lame.

But isn't Luke supposed to be one of, if not the strongest Jedi/force user we've been introduced to? And last time we saw him he was still relatively new at it. It would make sense that in 30 some odd years he'd learn a new trick or two, no?

[Conan The Barbarian]

Except that Batman vs Superman is horrible garbage.

Seriously though, I LOVE that TLJ’s theme is “Fuck what you think you know, out with the old, and let’s let the new blood take over and not repeat the past.” Spoiler: For fuck’s sake, Yoda shows up to practically tell Luke this very thing. Luke is old, tired, and beat down. He uses the last of his power to give the Resistance a chance and then passes happily as the sun rises. That’s a pretty good way to go, if you ask me.

Point proven

[Jon]

So, was Snoke a sith, or not? It seemed like earlier speculations was that he wasn’t, but from this movie he seemed to have the powers of the sith. He seemed to be following the sith rule of two. He seemed to be devoted verbatim to Palpatine’s vision of ruling an empire. And he was thoroughly driven to go way out of his way to destroy Luke (I’m guessing because Luke destroyed the sith in ROTJ?) who had already forfeited the game so to speak. Snoke felt like a sith to me.

No, according to Andy Serkis:

"He’s definitely not a Sith, but he’s certainly at the darker end of the Force. Without giving too much away, that begins to unfold a little in this one."

[Conan The Barbarian]

No, according to Andy Serkis:

"He’s definitely not a Sith, but he’s certainly at the darker end of the Force. Without giving too much away, that begins to unfold a little in this one."

He didn’t give anything away as there wasn’t anything to give away.

[Deadpool]

Kind of shocked but also kind of delighted by the somewhat polarizing reaction to The Last Jedi. I loved it. FilmCritHulk's reaction perfectly sums up my feelings. Hope his thoughts resonate with you as well.

[Wretchedest]

I'm baffled that people were expecting Luke Skywalker to be some ultra badass God. Was that Kenobi was? No. Luke is Kenobi this time, aged past his prime and disenchanted by the mistakes of his past. I find that expectation super surprising, especially because I wasn't tuned into it actually.

[Swykk]

EXACTLY. Luke was kind of a whiny dreamer who grew into the hero role but was not ever 100% comfortable in it.

I facepalmed that “point proven” nonsense for this very reason. Zack Snyder CLEARLY has little understanding of the characters he was put in charge of and wrote a bad movie that tried to make everyone grim and badass. NOT EVERYONE IS GRIM AND BADASS. Rian Johnson doesn’t have the same issues. Not even close.

It’s not the same thing so no, your point is not proven.

[sonic_discord]

yeah, it's ridiculous that he had those rocket thrusters in the prequels and not in the original trilogy, but the "explanation" is that they probably broke and, because no one else knew about them, they never got fixed. which is lazy and stupid.

new force powers being displayed is awesome because it means that we haven't (hadn't) seen everything that force-sensitive people are capable of...why is that a bad thing? there were new ships in this movie that we hadn't seen before, is that a breach of the established material, too? no, because things change. Spoiler: it's also entirely possible that, as the children of anakin skywalker, leia and luke have a way with the force that no one else does, given their deep connection to it. i can't for the life of me understand why people would be mad about that instead of excited about it. it's like there are so many people who just want an excuse to be pissed off at this movie, and that makes me sad.

You make good points, and just to clarify, I liked the movie. I have a few gripes, but overall, I really enjoyed it. I'm just saying I can understand why some aren't happy.

[Jon]

EXACTLY. Luke was kind of a whiny dreamer who grew into the hero role but was not ever 100% comfortable in it.

I facepalmed that “point proven” nonsense for this very reason. Zack Snyder CLEARLY has little understanding of the characters he was put in charge of and wrote a bad movie that tried to make everyone grim and badass. NOT EVERYONE IS GRIM AND BADASS. Rian Johnson doesn’t have the same issues. Not even close.

It’s not the same thing so no, your point is not proven.

I'm not supporting coming in to a thread and being a douche, but I'm pretty sure the "point proven" was in response to you saying "Batman vs. Superman is horrible garbage" and then trying to explain why. It wasn't about specifics, it was because you started doing exactly what Conan was talking about.

[HurtinMinorKey]

CLEARLY has little understanding of the characters he was put in charge of

For me this is the fatal flaw is so many extensions of previous work. It's what made Zahn's first trilogy so damn goo: he seemed to have a perfect understanding of the best that came before and what could come after. Ironically, the prequels felt like GL had forgotten the stories he supposedly told with the OG trilogy.

One of the more egregious cinematic examples I can think of is when Dumbledore basically attacks Harry in the Goblet of Fire. I was baffled that apparently neither the director, script writer, or actor knew the books well enough to know that Dumbledore would never rough up Harry like he did, and that it was a jarring departure from the defining elements of the character.

[Swykk]

I'm not supporting coming in to a thread and being a douche, but I'm pretty sure the "point proven" was in response to you saying "Batman vs. Superman is horrible garbage" and then trying to explain why. It wasn't about specifics, it was because you started doing exactly what Conan was talking about.

If that is true, I apologize but it seemed like he was equating the two movies (he was. He’s since edited his post and that is clear now) in the reactions they received which would be different circumstances in that Johnson is a better director with more respect as well as a much better understanding of the world he’s working within.

[mfte]

Fans petition to have TLJ removed from the franchise.

https://globalnews.ca/news/3924696/star-wars-fans-petition-the-last-jedi/

[neorev]

Fans petition to have TLJ removed from the franchise.

https://globalnews.ca/news/3924696/star-wars-fans-petition-the-last-jedi/

Wow, their vaginas hurts much? Sadly the internet gives a voice to the biggest of whiners.

[Vertigo]

(Seriously, only read the spoilers if you've seen the film.)

I'm baffled that people were expecting Luke Skywalker to be some ultra badass God. Was that Kenobi was? No. Luke is Kenobi this time, aged past his prime and disenchanted by the mistakes of his past. I find that expectation super surprising, especially because I wasn't tuned into it actually.

Well, he sort of was godlike towards the end of this film. Spoiler: He used a power we've never seen before, too powerful to actually survive apparently.

No, what doesn't sit right with me is his character. That he'd sit back and let some vestige of the Empire take root in the galaxy again, when fighting the Empire or dark side has been his core goal right through the series, from the first time we meet him. Spoiler: That he'd continue to sit on his island after Rey tells him that his hard work saving the galaxy is being undone. That he'd come to the brink of murdering one of his students, when he'd achieved such spiritual enlightenment that he wouldn't even kill THE FUCKING EMPEROR. That he'd admit defeat so easily, after rising above the fact that the second most evil man in the galaxy is his father. That he'd go entirely back-to-nature, when his affinity for machines was one of his defining character traits. That he wouldn't help his friends and family until the very last knockings, when he broke his training and risked everything for them back when he didn't know them nearly as well.

Some of this stuff goes back to Force Awakens, and honestly is a big part of why I didn't like that film either. The original trilogy is Luke's story. I didn't see any vestige of that Luke in this, or any pay-off for what he achieved. It feels disrespectful. Mark Hamill apparently feels similarly.

And really - Hamill has become so good over the years, yet is so under-exposed. They have access to such a valuable human resource in him and the character, and it felt that they wasted it. Spoiler: ...Given that this will probably be the only new trilogy film he'll have a major role in.

I felt similarly about Laura Dern, Gwendolyn Christie, Max von Sydow - such an incredible pool of talent to have access to, and largely squandered. They won't be around forever. Look at HR Giger in the Alien series - a core component in making the first film great, and a literally unique talent, but they never made proper use of him again, and now he's gone. Or Michael Crichton in the Jurassic Park series - his screenplay and oversight is arguably the main reason that original film stands so much taller than its sequels, but again, too late for that to happen again now.

So yeah, I really hate waste of a limited resource, and may have gotten a little off-topic. Excuse me, I'm going to go and have a bit of a sniffle.

[Space Suicide]

Wow, their vaginas hurts much? Sadly the internet gives a voice to the biggest of whiners.

People are losers. I hate organized fandoms.

[Dr Channard]

I'm baffled that people were expecting Luke Skywalker to be some ultra badass God. Was that Kenobi was? No. Luke is Kenobi this time, aged past his prime and disenchanted by the mistakes of his past. I find that expectation super surprising, especially because I wasn't tuned into it actually.

It’s not so much a problem that Luke can’t godmode everyone, that would be boring if he could. But it’s more so that he was supposed to represent A New Hope and usher in a Return of the Jedi, that was the big picture established for his character arc, but the narrative Abrams and Johnson paints says, “Nope! Luke sucks and the galaxy ended up even worse than before because of him.” With their new movies they undo the legacy of the O.T. (as well as the prequels) and it’s established characters simply for the purpose of resetting the universe back to empire vs. rebels and putting their own characters in to fill the roles.

Also, Kenobi was in hiding for a purpose that involved protecting young Luke and waiting for the right time to engage the empire and provide Luke with jedi training. Kenobi wasn’t on Tatooine waiting to die while wallowing in self-pity. He certainly didn’t abandon or resent the ways of the jedi. Obi-Wan would never have behaved like that and neither would the Luke that we were left with at the end of ROTJ.

No, what doesn't sit right with me is his character. That he'd sit back and let some vestige of the Empire take root in the galaxy again, when fighting the Empire or dark side has been his core goal right through the series, from the first time we meet him. Spoiler: That he'd continue to sit on his island after Rey tells him that his hard work saving the galaxy is being undone. That he'd come to the brink of murdering one of his students, when he'd achieved such spiritual enlightenment that he wouldn't even kill THE FUCKING EMPEROR. That he'd admit defeat so easily, after rising above the fact that the second most evil man in the galaxy is his father. That he'd go entirely back-to-nature, when his affinity for machines was one of his defining character traits. That he wouldn't help his friends and family until the very last knockings, when he broke his training and risked everything for them back when he didn't know them nearly as well.

This is where it sits for me as well.