Marilyn Manson

[muse-lyre candy]

I'll wager this is the event that gives him the kind of chronic pain that earns him the prescription to painkillers that eventually completely consumes him.

ok, this will prob piss some ppl off (though I'm not feeling the love for MM in this thread anyway; aside from the 'tough love' subtly expressed)
i was just saying the same thing about the whole stage accident -tongue in cheek- being a legit 'gateway' for prescription drug seeking..


it also works as a well documented legitimate reason for the necessity of being high on RX on the job, on whatever set he is acting/working on right now...

[Krazy]

I'm guessing the above posts were a bit tongue in cheek- but I'm sure MM doesn't need broken bones to get any type of scripts he wants. Guessing he's got some good hook ups.

[Shadaloo]

I had three separate people texting me about this today. I don't know what reaction they expected, but they got an exasperated sigh, which feels like the right response.

RIP stilts

[sonic_discord]

I'll wager this is the event that gives him the kind of chronic pain that earns him the prescription to painkillers that eventually completely consumes him.

ok, this will prob piss some ppl off (though I'm not feeling the love for MM in this thread anyway; aside from the 'tough love' subtly expressed)
i was just saying the same thing about the whole stage accident -tongue in cheek- being a legit 'gateway' for prescription drug seeking..

Something tells me a man of Marilyn Manson's celebrity status most likely wouldn't have a great deal of trouble acquiring prescription drugs, via legal means or otherwise, if he really wanted them. Although, the thought has crossed my mind as a possibility as well. Let's hope that's not the case. Despite all of my jabs against him lately, I honestly would like to see him conquer his demons and return with a renewed vengeance, creativity, and sense of purpose (in both recorded and live music).

[bobbie solo]

stolen comments from story on theprp.com:

"i don't like the props, but the props like me"

"goddamn your righteous stand"

[bobbie solo]

also, some superfan (sounds like the type that you guys always mention infest the official MM board or whatever) decided it was his job to white knight it up for MM in the comment section of theprp post re: the Pittsburgh ankle injury the night before this Hammerstein debacle. Some gems from him:

He just broke the world record for highest amount of downloads for his new single. He's been on 5 magazine covers and there's a rolling Stone cover in the near future after the release of this new album. His last album was nominated for 3 Grammy's, and 21 years in, after a long time of releasing not great stuff, his last album was among the highest sellers and I dare say he will reach record breaking perportions as well as it's the highest anticipated album of the year. He was a co star on sons of anarchy, is currently basking in the critics positive reviews of the newest movie he just started in "let me make you a martyr." He is also a current guest star on the TV show Salem, which also uses his song for the theme. If you aren't a fan that's your thing but don't call a fucking Superstar a washed up hack because he had a serious accident. He's the furthest thing from washed up. He's all anyone in music is talking about. He's steadily working as an actor in both TV and feature film and he's greater than you'll ever have dreams of being. Washed up hack, lol. Please. Dude is on the biggest upswing in his career. Do your research and don't judge people cause they fall down.

I can see you are worthless to have a reasonable conversation with. You keep calling him a hack whilst he makes motion pictures and record breaking releases, living in his huge mansion kicking it with his best friend Johnny depp. You know all, sir. I apologize. Continue calling millionaire artists hacks. I'm sure it's getting you far in life. I'm sorry for disturbing your work, sir. Thank you for being so fucking pleasant you piece of idiodic nonsense know nothing. Enjoy being one of the assholes that ruin shit for other people. I'm sure you're prosperous and have all in the room I the world to talk shit on Platinum level rock stars

We know where you Fucking live has received the most downloads on it's first day out of any song ever. So, that record he just broke like a week ago. Look it up Mr PRP community. You guys are fags. Seriously. Learn how to have a conversation without being an indignant (yet ignorant) ass. He did just break a record. That's what I'm talking about, you fucking ass. Learn how to be a person instead of a problem. So you all just sit there and laugh all you want you ignorant, rude, fucked up smear on society. You know how everyone says "Americans really suck ass" these days? It's 100% you and your attitude ruining this world. You assholes come in here arguing with someone who has been a solid Manson fan since 1996. I'm in the music biz and pride myself on the knowledge I have in the entertainment industry. All I did was correct an ignorant, rude comment with some facts showing that the comment made was not correct. I'm a fan who follows, listens and watches to learn more about society. And I have done it for years with MM. So instead of the indignant fucked up remarks, how's about you stop challenging everything in the fucking world and just accept that some people know more than you about certain things. Seriously. Fix yourself. You suck hard.

http://www.theprp.com/2017/09/30/new...-broken-ankle/

[ManBurning]

Man you guys really hate this dude.

doesn't look like it's just us that don't think too fondly of him these days... His ex band mates aren't exactly being very sympathetic either.

crushed by the @TPCS logo. ironic.

https://www.facebook.com/zimzumofficial/

For those that haven't really followed Zim "TPCS" stands for "The pop culture suicides" which was his band after he left Manson. Their logo is basically the 2 guns pointing down.

I guess he was close enough for my black magic to work This is why old wasted people shouldn’t fumble around in the dark.
If he had broken his ankle he wouldn’t be walking around like this, that is probably just more of his hyperbole. I recall the same excuse being used to cancel a Los Angeles show when all it was was a slightly sprained ankle.
And anyways if you’re going to climb the scaffolding, shouldn’t you be doing that during “my monkey”?
Well if it weren’t for the guns, the truss would have actually hit him pretty hard.
Well he is pretty famous for turning his wasted mistakes into serendipitous publicity events.
The converse is also true: he often turns publicity events into wasted mistakes.
The guns (I assume) were carved out of foam, which is really typical like Ozzy’s demons. And the truss maybe is aluminum. When you’re shipping things around the country you want them to be as light as possible and need as few crew hands as possible to move and set up.
I’m only 16 miles away [from the venue]. And as the crow flies (or the voodoo works) it’s even shorter than that…
I forgive him, but I hope he suffers.

https://www.alternativenation.net/ba...pe-he-suffers/

[ManBurning]

All the photos accompanying mainstream media articles about the accident seem to show Manson’s stage makeup now has him painting most of his neck black. Maybe there’s more to it, some style or symbolism thing I’m not quite getting, but all I could think was, “Well, that’s one rather unsubtle way to camouflage an extra chin or two.”

Maybe he's just super inspired by 21-pilots... I always wondered why the singer painted his neck black. Maybe that's the cool new fad?

[muse-lyre candy]

...I honestly would like to see him conquer his demons and return with a renewed vengeance, creativity, and sense of purpose (in both recorded and live music).

i would like to see this happen as well. i used to hold MM up there as one of the more brilliant artists about a cpl decades ago. his (new at the time) style of freakish brilliantly sold, his lyrics bold and in your face, his vocals-the range-amazing and amazingly unmatched in his music genre, and such a well read and educated speaker. this was a musician that demanded respect and how it followed. not really sure where his head has been for the last decade or so... something has taken up prime real estate in that head of his and has overstayed its welcome long enough. yes indeed i hope his musical genius he finds again, dusting and polishing that shit off and bringing it back to the stage, to his music, where it belongs....

[october_midnight]

“Well, that’s one rather unsubtle way to camouflage an extra chin or two.”

That's it. There's nothing more to it.

[elevenism]

I have a question. I haven't been big into Marilyn Manson since Smells Like Children. I have liked a lot of the singles but I've never even heard the Triptych.
Meanwhile, you guys think that those albums are some of the greatest of all time. You were apparently hardcore devotees at one point and likely still enjoy those records.
So here is my question: why do you level such meanness at him? Because he decided to make different kinds of records that you didn't like as much as the others? It happens. See David Bowie. Or because he's a drug addict? I've nearly died from drugs and alcohol over and over and struggled with recovery. So watching someone else suffer doesn't elicit ridicule from me, it elicits empathy.
so I can understand not enjoying some of the records or laffing a bit at his intoxication, but reading this thread for the past week or so, a lot of YOU motherfuckers seem to HATE this dude. And you spew this hate and in the same breath, talk about the genius of earlier albums. things fall apart.
I hope I'm not being presumptuous here and please don't take this as an indictment. I'm not trying to break your balls.
This is a serious question.

[Shadaloo]

I don't hate him; I pity him and I'm disappointed in him because he was capable of so much better. This guy stared addiction in the face in the form of Gidget Gein, made a whole concept album about being an ubermench, about shedding your weakness and becoming a better person for it, and somewhere along the line just said "Eh, whatever" to everything he talked up and became a wetbrained alcoholic caricature of his former self doing it for a paycheck.

He should never have resurrected the name after Lest We Forget. He's said that he's tired of the 'character' of Marilyn Manson and so he just goes out and pretends to be him in the form of this 'hardass rock star'...like a character from a movie, written poorly by someone with a bad comprehension of the point of the original.

And I really wish he wouldn't.

[elevenism]

THAT I understand @Shadaloo .
But when I see things online like "manson should kill himself" etc, I'm a little confused.

[bobbie solo]

plenty of artists you used to adore become worse over time. That is common. It's alot more frustrating when they become embarrassing to the degree that Manson has. Add in the direct A to B relationship between the person this board exists and Manson, and how Trent has become one of the most universally respected artists by almost all fans & his peers, whereas Manson has gone down the exact opposite path. Hence the disgust.

[elevenism]

Good God I'm listening to ACSS for the first time and HOLY SHIT it's incredible. Thanks for the tip @halo infinty . ALso, @kleiner352 I absolutely understand what you mean about evolving past the spooky kids phase I so loved.
I really can't for the life of me remember exactly why I didn't keep up although I know I had a hard time when I was a kid with the blasphemy MM leveled at my Lord and Savior...Trent Reznor.

But now I wish I WOULD have kept up. I think I'm going to be exploring and digging this for a WHILE.

[henryeatscereal]

I don't hate him either, i pity him too...

The guy was one of the biggest rockstars from the 90's; he had everything: Brains, Charisma, Good records.

Then he blew it all away, he got into a fight with Reznor (one of his biggets mistakes), drugs, alcohol, bad records and mostly a terrible attitude showed that this guy lost all his charm.

But i don't desire him bad, i actually was happy when "The Pale Emperor" came out, because it was a good record (Thanks to Tyler Bates mostly), i wanted him to see him shine again because i consider him one of the last true rockstars of our time.

God knows this guy does have talent, but needs all the help he can get...

[Swykk]

I don’t think I’m being mean. I want him to get help but I do think @Leviathant is right and he will just sink deeper into dependency.

It sucks.

[Helpmeiaminhell (is now in hell)]

I always dug his music but thought the whole shock rock image thing was stupid. It was like GWAR or something. I always felt the music was strong enough to stand on its own without the MM "image" and shock rock nonsense. If he used his name Brian Warner and wore t shirts and cargo shorts onstage, that band would have been just as big (without half the bullshit they had to deal with)...As for the drugs. Whats odd is how a dude who is clearly intelligent still hasnt gotten it through his head to cut the drug shit out once and for all. I can only imagine what goes on in his mansion in the Hollywood Hills when he and his buddy Johnny Depp are alone and indulging in their demons, trying to relive the glory days of their youth.

[renton44]

I am a Manson apologist, haha, I love the man and the band. I buy every record and go to as many shows in my area as I can when they tour. I still think Twiggy is by far one of the best musicians I have ever seen. That said, I understand the hate some here (and elsewhere) throw at Manson. There is a history with Reznor that same take very personal, and the Holy Trilogy (ACS, MA and HW) set the bar very very high. So, when you compare then to now, it is simply hard to just say "He got older... what do you expect?" and move on. You also have to consider, fans of NIN, have had tremendous luck with a talent like Trent who managed to get his life together and consistently put out great material almost nonstop for the last 10 years. We are comparing a Pony to a Unicorn here (even though it is more of a subconscious kind of thing) and I think that skews how people look at Manson over the last few years (and currently).

[NotoriousTIMP]

the NIN sub on reddit got SUPER pissed when I posted the article on Manson with the title " *giggles* " - Had no idea that sub was die-hard manson fans...

[ManBurning]

I don't think any of us really HATE him, but we hate what he has become. At one point this guy was the smartest man in the room. You listen to any intervew between 1996 and 2001 and he came off as crazy intelligent. He didn't slur, mumble, or need to resort to crack terrible jokes or poke and prod the person interviewing him for attention.

It's like watching your best friend become someone else due to the influence of drugs and alcohol. I actually have (had?) a friend who went down this path. Totally amazing guy, then one day he reached for the bottle and couldn't stop. Went to rehab for it, and met someone there who wasn't ready to quit, now he's back at it again, worse than ever. Any mutual (and non mutual) friends who have been around him say the same thing, he's not doing well. He's lost his mind.

That's what has happened to Manson. Like @Shadaloo said, I think he should have hung up the Marilyn Manson moniker after Lest We forget was done. That was the perfect time to close off the band. That is actually when Marilyn Manson the band officially died for me. The band was never the same after Twiggy left. Twiggy was the last remaining hope for that band, It was never the same after he left and even now that he's rejoined. If he wanted to still make music, he could have done it under a different name. I think anything after GAOG is not considered Marilyn Manson anyway. It's just him with a bunch of revolving studio musicians. He should have continued to make music the way he did, but he should have parted ways with his band before he was able to create any animosity between him and his ex bandmates.

Manson pushed everyone in his life away, Trent, Twiggy, John 5, all his previous bandmates. Almost pushed Tyler Bates away as well. I think the problem is, Marilyn Manson the "character" and Brian Warner the human being, have become the same person. There is no persona anymore. It's all a big mess now.
This is watching someone who was at the top of their game unfold and fall apart. It's not about hating him. But I think everyone here just feels bad for him, and he has become an easy target.

He needs help, and that's all there is too it. I wish more of his fans wouldn't be so blinded by the light. There are still hoards of MM followers that will praise every little thing he has done, the will stand by his side no matter what. It's because they are afraid to admit, he's not well... It's like being in an abusive relationship, you stick though it because you don't think you can get anyone better, you have invested so much time with this individual, that it hurts to be apart from them, even though deep down you know they are bad for your mental state, you can't give up on them. You hope that one day your dear lover will snap out of it again. Too many of his fans are not willing to accept their hero has disappointed them.

This is what separates Trent and Manson. Trent was there, and if he kept it up, I can guarantee you he wouldn't be making movie soundtracks and winning awards.
Trent got help in the exact time he needed. Trent's career got better because of it. Manson's is just getting worse. And I honestly don't think any of us would be surprised to see in the headlines "Marilyn Manson died" In fact, I'm surprised this guy has lasted as long as he has with how he treats his body. I generally feel bad for what he has become.

[tony.parente]

I agree, if Trent never got clean he'd be opening for slipknot and struggling to sell out 3000 capacity clubs like Manson is now.

[Helpmeiaminhell (is now in hell)]

I think he should have hung up the Marilyn Manson moniker after Lest We forget was done. That was the perfect time to close off the band. That is actually when Marilyn Manson the band officially died for me. The band was never the same after Twiggy left. Twiggy was the last remaining hope for that band, It was never the same after he left and even now that he's rejoined. If he wanted to still make music, he could have done it under a different name.

He kinda did do that with Eat Me, Drink Me and well.....we all know how that turned out lol

[renton44]

I remember when I saw Manson on the 'Against All Gods Tour' (Lest we Forget Era) and thought "Yup, this is it. This is the end." Would have been the perfect ending to the band, and I am kind of glad to see I am not the only one who thought "...this is a good place to close out Marilyn Manson." Since that tour or basically the Eat Me Drink Me Era, he hasn't been the same. Went right into hardcore drinking and well, you have what we have today. I honestly thought he had turned a corner (a good one) with Born Villain and the Pale Emperor. He seemed energized and was really proud that the band had completed like 180 shows on the BV tour and was proud of the music he had created with Tyler Bates for TPE. Then after the first leg of that tour, things went downhill, fast. Super disappointing.

Honestly, it really is just we all want him to get back on track. We have replaced the 'the black sheep of the family' with a 'creepy uncle.'

[Halo Infinity]

Again I say, the most entertaining thread on ETS.

There is no equal..

And there's no reflection.

Good God I'm listening to ACSS for the first time and HOLY SHIT it's incredible. Thanks for the tip @halo infinty . ALso, @kleiner352 I absolutely understand what you mean about evolving past the spooky kids phase I so loved.
I really can't for the life of me remember exactly why I didn't keep up although I know I had a hard time when I was a kid with the blasphemy MM leveled at my Lord and Savior...Trent Reznor.

But now I wish I WOULD have kept up. I think I'm going to be exploring and digging this for a WHILE.

I'm glad you've actually enjoyed Antichrist Superstar this time around so far, and also hope that Holy Wood is real treat for you as well. In most cases, I don't recommend skipping Mechanical Animals, but it seems just right to give Holy Wood a listen after Antichrist Superstar.

MA was my first proper listen though, but after hearing ACSS and HW, I kept flipping between those two albums so much as a new fan in 2002. MA is still my most favorite MM album to this day though, with ACSS very close behind it.

As for his albums after The Golden Age of Grotesque, I think The High End of Low and The Pale Emperor are my most favorites, with Heaven Upside Down soon to become a part of that list. I will give it more time though, especially once it actually comes out as I'm also interested in the opinions after an album's time has come and gone, at a minimum of say 6 months to 1 year.

And as much as I still am a fan of Marilyn Manson, I too will also be willing and ready to admit that he needs all the help he can get. I can even admit there's a lot of things he'd be better off not doing (Which also includes messing with props like that, and can admit how that can be connected to not getting cleaned up.), even though I've always liked the idea of the whole Marilyn Manson thing still living on. I still try to be fair and objective on some level though, but can still admit that there's been flaws and blunders over the years. I'm even okay with MM jokes here and there from time to time, probably all thanks to being a Meathead reader with the NIN jokes.

Aside from seeing what I liked for myself, perhaps I also got desensitized a bit from also being a fan of Ministry and seeing what they have to put with too. Al Jourgensen probably did much worse from the looks of it. (Not justifying any of it either, as I could also see as to how that can lead to yet another loss.) But all in all, I hope he gets the help he needs to, but the ball's obviously in his court alone.

To me it's also not just about ruining the legacy of his career, but losing him altogether. That's also messed with me big time, so with that, I can also see how that can flip people's shit, but with me, it subjects me far more to sad, sinking, distraught and empty feelings as opposed to any type of angry and frustrated feelings.

[implanted_microchip]

ALso, @kleiner352 I absolutely understand what you mean about evolving past the spooky kids phase I so loved.
I really can't for the life of me remember exactly why I didn't keep up although I know I had a hard time when I was a kid with the blasphemy MM leveled at my Lord and Savior...Trent Reznor.

But now I wish I WOULD have kept up. I think I'm going to be exploring and digging this for a WHILE.

ACSS is mindblowingly good, it's a pretty close to perfect approach to concept albums. Now imagine what Spooky Kids, Portrait and ACSS sounded like and leap over to this:



It's incredible. There was a time where MM as an artist and as a band were some of the most forward-thinking, genre-defying, musically mercurial people out there. Manson himself seemed to always have an incredibly sharp and clear vision and a sense of how to best realize it, and it paid off more often than it didn't. The album artwork fed into the lyrics that fed into the music and the costumes, the makeup, the outfits, the stage design all worked together to form statements larger than the individual parts.

People talk about how he got too caught up in image and that the band never needed it but I disagree -- the imagery was a major and core part of it all. He just got caught up in the surface levels of it instead of the depth and sense of unique purpose that they all had before. I can't think of ACSS and not think of the booklet with him growing from the cocoon or the Begotten-style videos or the podium and black and red suit and tie. I can't think of MA and not think of that amazing cover or the druggy booklet and the blue jewel case that made more art pop up when you took pages and put them beneath it. I can't hear Astonishing Panorama and not think of those awesome post-apocalyptic glam punk shots of him with the eyepatch. There was a larger purpose to it all and the band really combined visual, audio and written work to create something incredible. The richness, the detail, the attention to it, the clear care and craft put into every element still shows today and is a large part of why these albums hold up like they do and almost none of it is around anymore.

It's been extremely bittersweet listening to MA again lately because I don't feel like this guy has another album like it in him. I doubt there'll ever be a time where every element, from the liner notes to the videos to the lyrics to the music to the outfits to the band logo itself, are all as symbiotic and perfectly combined to create one full piece of art again. Part of my love for Trent's Physical Components has been that it's reminded me of how I felt digging into works like these when I was younger and catching up with the world on all of it -- having these pieces of art directly tying in and creating a vivid and palpable aesthetic, an imagery that feeds into the music, a concept that deepens and widens the sounds -- it's very refreshing to see it being done again by a major artist. It just baffles me that Marilyn Manson isn't doing anything close to that anymore. The guy used to be criticized by some as being too visual and now it's like it's all gone, he just focuses on generically "edgy" "spooky" lyrics and chin paint and calls it a day.

[elevenism]

I always dug his music but thought the whole shock rock image thing was stupid. It was like GWAR or something. I always felt the music was strong enough to stand on its own without the MM "image" and shock rock nonsense. If he used his name Brian Warner and wore t shirts and cargo shorts onstage, that band would have been just as big (without half the bullshit they had to deal with)...As for the drugs. Whats odd is how a dude who is clearly intelligent still hasnt gotten it through his head to cut the drug shit out once and for all. I can only imagine what goes on in his mansion in the Hollywood Hills when he and his buddy Johnny Depp are alone and indulging in their demons, trying to relive the glory days of their youth.

The drug shit ain't that easy to cut out. Trust me.

[renton44]

Good for a laugh and almost up there with the rib removal rumor..lol...

https://www.gossipcop.com/marilyn-ma...ccident-video/

[sonic_discord]

Good for a laugh and almost up there with the rib removal rumor..lol...

https://www.gossipcop.com/marilyn-ma...ccident-video/

"Mangled orbs??" Boy, I don't know guys, sounds pretty legit to me...

[Halo Infinity]

the NIN sub on reddit got SUPER pissed when I posted the article on Manson with the title " *giggles* " - Had no idea that sub was die-hard manson fans...

For some reason, I just found that rather amusing. (But probably shouldn't have.) Love him or hate him and all in between, Marilyn Manson truly is the punchline/gift that keeps on giving in the Nine Inch Nails fan-base/lore. I still can't deny that though.

And I don't just mean this on ETS, but it's hard for me to not smirk or laugh when bringing up Marilyn Manson among NIN fans. It almost feels like something I shouldn't really be saying. Like the time you learned a "bad word" as a kid and finding it hilarious to say/think of.

Perhaps it's also just the Internet fandom exposure in me talking.

In all seriousness though, I guess it was bound to happen, since the ratio between both fan-bases is still very much high. (And it also pretty much depends on which corner of the Internet you're on too, as revealed.)