Sigil 04_: Welcome oblivion

[butter_hole]

Disjointed? I don't get that. I think the album is incredibly cohesive. It's more Mariqueen's boring vocals, the shitty lyrics and uninspired melodies - and the music I feel like I've already heard ten times before from Trent and Atticus. Remember, TR and AR have produced, to date:

Year Zero
parts of Niggy Tardust
Ghosts
The Slip
HTDA EP
The Social Network
TGWTDT
An Omen
WO

in just under 5 years. That's what, six, seven hours of music?

I really, really hope whatever he's doing with this new NIN stuff has nothing to do with Atticus, nothing to do with his home studio and sounds a little different than a drum machine and the Swarmatron, because after all this, I can barely tell it apart.

Not to say I haven't enjoyed 90% of it, not to say I haven't already purchased all of it. And yes, Mariqueen can fucking rock it sometimes, see: The Space In Between and Is Your Love Strong Enough?

But it's just CHRIST, Trent, try something new.

[Max Leo]

Personally I think if Pitchfork started to give rave 9.8 reviews to everything Trent was involved with, it would come across as insincere given how they plug him, people would just dismiss the review thinking it had been 'paid for' (although I haven't read it because it would just annoy me, compared to before 6/10 is positively glowing)

Exactly, they just can't give a high rated review to "Trent Reznor's side project". If this album had been released by an unknown hipster new band, Pitchfork would (or should) talk about its amazing production/sound or about how good the songs are, but sadly Trent couldn't have released this album hiding his own involvement because his style is extremely recognizable, HTDA's music, production and lyrics (even if Q wrote them) are too "reznorish" and everybody would know immediately that Reznor and "his people" (Ross, Sheridan, Q) were behind this album, otherwise Pitchfork's rating would (or should) be higher.

[Leviathant]

I really, really hope whatever he's doing with this new NIN stuff has nothing to do with Atticus, nothing to do with his home studio and sounds a little different than a drum machine and the Swarmatron, because after all this, I can barely tell it apart.

I'm curious, can you point out which songs on the HTDA LP sound like which songs on anything released in the past decade? I'll give you that one of the tracks has elements from, what, Vessel? And I think there might be a sound from one of tracks on TGWTDT in the beginning of one of the HTDA songs. But aside from sharing an instrument (I mean, face it, there's guitars on every NIN album, and they're not difficult to tell apart) can you list out which songs remind you of other songs? Which songs on the LP even feature swarmatron? I'm not trying to be snide, I'm honestly curious.

[imail724]

Disjointed? I don't get that. I think the album is incredibly cohesive. It's more Mariqueen's boring vocals, the shitty lyrics and uninspired melodies - and the music I feel like I've already heard ten times before from Trent and Atticus. Remember, TR and AR have produced, to date:

Year Zero
parts of Niggy Tardust
Ghosts
The Slip
HTDA EP
The Social Network
TGWTDT
An Omen
WO

in just under 5 years. That's what, six, seven hours of music?

I really, really hope whatever he's doing with this new NIN stuff has nothing to do with Atticus, nothing to do with his home studio and sounds a little different than a drum machine and the Swarmatron, because after all this, I can barely tell it apart.

Not to say I haven't enjoyed 90% of it, not to say I haven't already purchased all of it. And yes, Mariqueen can fucking rock it sometimes, see: The Space In Between and Is Your Love Strong Enough?

But it's just CHRIST, Trent, try something new.

You forgot With Teeth. I too would like to see what a new NIN album would sound like without Atticus, but it's not gonna happen. Not complaining either, I love Atticus's work with Trent and think Year Zero is right behind TDS and TF on my favorites list, but after all this time of the two of them working together I can't help but wonder what Trent might produce without Atticus nowadays.

[butter_hole]

I'm curious, can you point out which songs on the HTDA LP sound like which songs on anything released in the past decade? I'll give you that one of the tracks has elements from, what, Vessel? And I think there might be a sound from one of tracks on TGWTDT in the beginning of one of the HTDA songs. But aside from sharing an instrument (I mean, face it, there's guitars on every NIN album, and they're not difficult to tell apart) can you list out which songs remind you of other songs? Which songs on the LP even feature swarmatron? I'm not trying to be snide, I'm honestly curious.

I wasn't saying everything from YZ to present sounds the same, just that it's beginning to sound like he's too comfortable. I'd take this over waiting five years for an album, and his workflow is clearly better, but is it producing stale, mostly-filler I've-heard-this-before tracks? I'd say yes, in some cases.

I don't have the album handy nor have I properly learned all the track names but I'll get back to you... There's definitely Swarmatron on a bunch of tracks. And yes, that was a huge generalization. I'm just saying, for a guy who's all about digital manipulation and using technology as a tool and not a crutch, it shouldn't be so obvious that it's him making the music.

But maybe I'll change my mind.

(My main problem is Mariqueen.)

[BRoswell]

Zzzzzz...

Huh? Oh. Sorry. Dozed off there for a second.

[Shnoorum]

I think HTDA have actually taken over as my favourite band. Mariqueen, Atticus, Trent and Rob in one band is just the greatest thing around since kittens were invented in my opinion. Mariqueen seems to be the member that gets the most slack around here which I suppose is understandable seeing as this is a NIN board and all but I think shes incredible. I mean no disrespect to Trent at all here but I just couldn't imagine him singing any of her parts at all. Her voice makes the album methinks.

On a different note, this is a longshot since I've had a look round and so no mention of this at all but has anyone heard the bonus tracks yet? I know the vinyl was delayed but I seem to remember reading somewhere that they've shipped a very small batch out. I'm bloody well dying to hear them

[gorast]

I think HTDA have actually taken over as my favourite band. Mariqueen, Atticus, Trent and Rob in one band is just the greatest thing around since kittens were invented in my opinion. Mariqueen seems to be the member that gets the most slack around here which I suppose is understandable seeing as this is a NIN board and all but I think shes incredible. I mean no disrespect to Trent at all here but I just couldn't imagine him singing any of her parts at all. Her voice makes the album methinks.

On a different note, this is a longshot since I've had a look round and so no mention of this at all but has anyone heard the bonus tracks yet? I know the vinyl was delayed but I seem to remember reading somewhere that they've shipped a very small batch out. I'm bloody well dying to hear them

I highly doubt any of them shipped out if the vinyl was recalled before any of them were prepared for shipping. We only have to wait two more weeks; judging from how Rob treated the bonus tracks, they're probably not anything special whatsoever.

[Shnoorum]

I highly doubt any of them shipped out if the vinyl was recalled before any of them were prepared for shipping. We only have to wait two more weeks; judging from how Rob treated the bonus tracks, they're probably not anything special whatsoever.

Bah! 2 weeks sucks! I did question as to why they'd leave them out and put them only on the vinyl version but I can't imagine them being crap. Maybe not as good as the others but theres no way of knowing untill we hear them. I am very much interested in doing so

[sheepdean]

I think HTDA have actually taken over as my favourite band. Mariqueen, Atticus, Trent and Rob in one band is just the greatest thing around since kittens were invented in my opinion. Mariqueen seems to be the member that gets the most slack around here which I suppose is understandable seeing as this is a NIN board and all but I think shes incredible. I mean no disrespect to Trent at all here but I just couldn't imagine him singing any of her parts at all. Her voice makes the album methinks.

I like you.
And I would agree, she has a great voice (if anyone has any bootleg recordings of when she sang live & played for I Will Never Be The Same, I'd love them). A lot of people seem to look for the fact they sound like or not like NIN, as though that means anything about the music. But hey, no one's opinion on music is wrong or right. so as long as we like something I guess.

On a different note, this is a longshot since I've had a look round and so no mention of this at all but has anyone heard the bonus tracks yet? I know the vinyl was delayed but I seem to remember reading somewhere that they've shipped a very small batch out. I'm bloody well dying to hear them

Pretty sure once the tracks are out there, there'll be posts all over ETS.

[xfocalinx]

Grabbed my copy yesterday, been on repeat all day. I REALLY am digging "And the Sky Began to Scream"

[screwdriver]

Our digestion cycles are just so much shorter. An epic album used to be an event. Now Green Day is cranking them out once a year and 10 "indie bands" each get their 15 minutes every day. The old way had its pluses and so does the new way, but it's certainly hard to gauge anything not on first listen, because then you've gotta move on. Even stuff I want to soak in, like this release, it's like ... Fuck, the sound city soundtrack is looking awesome, and new Bowie(!!!) is coming soon, and I still haven't gotten to Atoms for Peace yet, not to mention loving the new Local Natives and Tomahawk, and it's like - gah, I don't have enough time to listen to all this!

no real point to this except to say i sort of feel that writing this thing off already is premature but I totally understand where that's coming from - its a survival instinct in the era of too much music

[the duder]

Man...after listening to this for, like the 3rd time now, and not doing anything but LISTENING, it's clicking. Thinking about what Q and TR have said in interviews about it being inspired by technology/effects of technology and society, along with some themes of readings from my seminar course in the philosophy of technology this semester running rampant through my head - mainly the false assumption of technological neutrality and how society and technology interact - makes for this album to become very urgent and relevant. Definitely clicking.

[steelnails95]

I personally love it! yes I love the past NIN, but this is definately the best since Year Zero! Period!

[steelnails95]

If i was Trent I would say Fuck You, to the bitching ass fans and stop making anything. He puts out great music for his fans and if you dont like it, dont listen to it for fuck sakes!

[thevoid99]

I finally heard the record today, twice so far. I really like it. There's definitely some Depeche Mode elements in a few cuts along with some NIN. It's got a nice groove. I think it's really good.

[Leviathant]

I wasn't saying everything from YZ to present sounds the same, just that it's beginning to sound like he's too comfortable.

Well, I specifically quoted the part where you said

That's what, six, seven hours of music?
I really, really hope whatever he's doing with this new NIN stuff has nothing to do with Atticus, nothing to do with his home studio and sounds a little different than a drum machine and the Swarmatron, because after all this, I can barely tell it apart.

I'll throw you a bone and say, well maybe you didn't mean to say this, but you just said you can barely tell seven hours of music apart, and to me, that sounds a lot like "everything from YZ to present sounds the same"

I'd take this over waiting five years for an album, and his workflow is clearly better, but is it producing stale, mostly-filler I've-heard-this-before tracks? I'd say yes, in some cases.

Between Ghosts & The Social Network, I'll give you that. There was definitely existing music used and expanded on in TSN. There was that Ghosts bonus track that got turned into a track on The Slip. Naturally tracks on An Omen are also on Welcome Oblivion, but that was established before An Omen went on sale - and I'm one of those people who didn't really like An Omen, but really really like Welcome Oblivion.

So, what in Niggy Tardust had you heard before? How samey was Welcome Oblivion? The first second or two of Ice Age reminds me the slightest bit of Perihelion from The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo (or whatever that other album TR did with chimes, modular synths and prepared piano was). The title track does sound a bit like one of the samples is from Vessel.

Hey, and one of the remixes of I'm Afraid of Americans has the drums from The Big Comedown on it! The snare drum from Happiness in Slavery was in a bunch of remixes from that era as well. It's not just Trent who does this - listen to First Dark Ride by Coil, or the Toxic Mix of Asbestos Lead Asbestos by Meat Beat Manifesto. Assuming you've listened through the Closer to God and Further Down the Spiral remix EPs, those tracks should sound very familiar.

I don't have the album handy nor have I properly learned all the track names but I'll get back to you... There's definitely Swarmatron on a bunch of tracks. And yes, that was a huge generalization.

I understand, that's why I'm asking you for specifics, because it doesn't really ring true to me. And frankly, up until Welcome Oblivion, I have not really been flying the HTDA flag. I just have trouble finding tracks that sound alike, and you apparently can barely tell them apart.

I'm just saying, for a guy who's all about digital manipulation and using technology as a tool and not a crutch, it shouldn't be so obvious that it's him making the music.

(My main problem is Mariqueen.)

Look, I'm not here to change your opinion. If you don't like something, you're probably not going to like it later. I've seen people complain about the lyrics about this album, listed under the "Dance" category on Amazon, as if it should have a sweeping plot arc and deep reflective philosophical meaning. Hey, forty six and two, it's about the evolution of DNA, man! If you don't like the lyrics or the singing, then it ain't your bag.

But I don't understand the "this music is nothing new" argument at all.

Also, while I'm at it -- the Pitchfork review is kind of shit. Dude gets "really obvious" lyrics wrong (a glottal stop does not always a 't' make), and suggesting replacing Mariqueen with Sleigh Bells or Kanye West is tantamount to trolling. Similarly, saying that Welcome Oblivion reprises just three songs off An Omen, calling Black Ops II part of Year Zero, and referring to the TV series as a film all seem to intentionally tickle the OCD that fans of Reznor's work are known for.

[butter_hole]

Christ, okay:

I think the album is incredibly cohesive. It's more Mariqueen's boring vocals, the shitty lyrics and uninspired melodies - and the music I feel like I've already heard ten times before from Trent and Atticus.

MQ's vocals in this are exactly what I expected, but that doesn't make them any less boring / vapid / uninspired / dull / etc. The lyrics are bad Reznor rip-offs and I'd wager that somewhere in her head she purposefully came up with NIN-style lyrics to please Trent, not that I have any idea about her prior work. THAT is my main problem with the album, to get that out of the way. I have nothing against her, I'm not jealous of her and Trent's undying love, I'm not some fanboy asshole, she just sounds out of place and they could have been a lot better.

I really, really hope whatever he's doing with this new NIN stuff has nothing to do with Atticus, nothing to do with his home studio and sounds a little different than a drum machine and the Swarmatron, because after all this, I can barely tell it apart.

I maintain what I said about hoping new NIN is completely separate to everything else, for example, doing away with programmed drums and having Ilan record everything, actually utilizing other musicians permanently etc. Even though I think there's about 10% chance of that actually happening. "I can barely tell it apart" = I misspoke. I'm at work, barely concentrating. Obviously I'm not talking about the tracks that have been literally recycled like the Social Network stuff from Ghosts. And I didn't mean just sound-wise. As a whole:

It's more that he's gone from work with NIN, with Atticus, styled by Rob (Year Zero - The Slip).

Then, he went to work with just Atticus, styled by Rob. (The Social Network).

Then he went and did an EP with Atticus for a different band. And Rob was a part of that. (HTDA EP)

Then he went and worked with Atticus again, styled by Rob. (TGWTDT)

Then he went back to Destroy Angels with Atticus, styled by Rob. And Rob made some glitchy art. When has Rob ever made glitchy, digital-decay art before? Oh right, all through Year Zero and The Social Network.

It's just very derivative, to me. The Wake-Up is just another Hyperpower! mixed with 999,999, for example. TR's fucking constantly appearing piano motif in Hallowed Ground. The apocalyptic themes. The Swarmatron (I'll get back to you on it's exact location but there are parts of Welcome Oblivion that sound like TSN note for note.)

I just feel like Trent needs to do something new, something different. Something with other people, for the first time in ten years.

Look, I'm totally talking out of my ass here. I have no idea what the fuck my point is. But that is damn cool about The Big Comedown drums being in the Bowie remix, I'll have to check that out.

[gorast]

I agree that Trent needs to break away from his usual collaborators for when he goes back into the studio with NIN. If NIN were a "real" band, then working with the same people (to a degree) makes sense; they're your bandmates. But Trent's always made clear that NIN is him and the revolving door - but for the past few studio albums it's been him, Atticus, and a much smaller revolving door. I think what Trent should do with NIN is push Atticus into the revolving door and bring in some other musicians - record with the new touring band, for instance.

And then, he's got HTDA for the usual suspects, for the collaborators he's comfortable with, familiar with. Obviously that makes HTDA sound like a complete side-project for Trent to fall back on when he's tired of innovating, but it's entirely possible for the band to innovate as well.

But whatever, Trent can do what he wants, he's a grown-up and shit.

[Rudi]

So I've listened to this for about 2 days straight now, and I have to say that I like it. I thought the EP was disjointed and there wasn't much flow from one track to the next, but in the context of a full length release, it works. I've also gotten used to Mariqueen's voice being the lead vocal and Trent just doing backing parts. Actually I think her voice works better with this soundscape than Trent's would. It's nicer to hear a softer, feminine voice paried with the big bass-glitchy distortion. You put TR on lead for most of these tracks and it's YZ-lite. Standout tracks for me are Too late, all gone & Strings and attractors.

Someone already asked this once, but I'm asking myself the same question. If you put The sleep of reason produces monsters and Speaking in tongues on this album, where would they go? Right now I put The sleep... after Strings and attractors. It's a nice moody piece that leads into We fade away well. Speaking in tongues I put after The loop closes. SIT is a good ending track by itself, but that little bit that it lingers at the end works good with the intro to Hallowed ground.

Of course this might have to all be rethought when the vinyl tracks release.

[PhoenixML]

I put "The sleep..." after On the Wing, just like on the EP. Looking forward the 17-track playlist of Welcome Oblivion too.

[Vertigo]

I spent ages fathoming the indented format of the track listing in the album art, trying to figure out if there was a pattern which could explain the best location for the extra tracks from An Omen and the vinyl. I eventually gave up, slapped the Omen tracks after the same songs they follow on the EP, and went outside to pretend to myself that I'm interested in normal, 100% sane person activities.

[sheepdean]

I reserve judgement on Welcome!Omen's order until we have all 17 tracks.

Hey, digital copies of WO have EP1 too, so really we should be doing everything but IYLSE

[BenAkenobi]

I don't know what to think about flow of this album, on the 2010 EP i liked how the songs were not leading into each other, each song stood on its own. It was a strong point.
I thought "great, the album is going to be a collection of kick-ass songs without any useless back-story" and now they come up with yet another concept album.
Weren't they supposed to chill out, i ask myself? Am i again presented with the music i have to listen in the right mood and in proper order of the tracks?
First leaked tracklistings didn't have the intro track, did they? "The wake up", i mean. When i first read it, i thought "uh oh unfortunately this turns to corny side"
I shouldn't be bothered, i guess, but the fact that music is so disturbingly nice makes it uncomfortable. Why can't it be simply great music nstead of "part of a bigger picture"?
And i don't hate any part of it, don't get me wrong. It's probably just their thing, to re-evolve and re-invent. But I'm only a human being! Philosophic pop album, gimme a break.

[sheepdean]

Eh, 90% of albums are probably concept albums, people just don't talk about the fact they are.

[screwdriver]

"I can barely tell it apart" = I misspoke. I'm at work, barely concentrating.

This could be part of the problem.

It's just very derivative, to me.

ok

The Wake-Up is just another Hyperpower! mixed with 999,999, for example.

Don't forget Pinion. It's almost like the dude likes little sound design pieces.

TR's fucking constantly appearing piano motif in Hallowed Ground.

I mean... its a stylistic trick, like Metallica and a diminished fifth or Tool and going to the major III or Lana Del Ray and sounding sultry or Rammstein and doing the bass riff distorted with power chords in the chorus or ... I could go on. It only sounds "constantly appearing" if you've memorized his ouevre.

The Swarmatron (I'll get back to you on it's exact location but there are parts of Welcome Oblivion that sound like TSN note for note.)

I'm not hearing it, but I don't doubt you. But if it is, why does anyone care? The thing costs a billion dollars, I hope he gets some use out of it! I don't listen to, I dunno, Led Zeppelin albums and say "christ, there's that Gibson SG through Marshall Amps again! How boring!" It's an instrument that plays notes. Some of these notes will be the same.

I just feel like Trent needs to do something new, something different. Something with other people, for the first time in ten years.

I think we've got to the root of the problem. How do I put this... it's not Trent, it's you. You're placing these expectations that Trent is going to be able to blow your mind open the way he did when you first started listening to him, when you discovered this music that sounded so unlike other music. And that's not going to happen unless you unplug for a bit and go listen to other music for awhile.

You keep saying you want Trent to change, but objectively, why should you care? Your subconscious is saying it wants a change. You should listen to it.

[neorev]

It has nothing to do with having your mind blown, it's just this album sounds like the same regurgitated Year Zero meets movie soundtrack Trent. I find it funny how Trent bashes computers in making musicians release lazy sounding music while Trent releases a pretty dull and meandering album with horrible lyrics and terrible delivery. This album goes nowhere and is not gripping. The songs don't develop into much and is repetitive... its a lazy sounding album. If anyone needs to take the advice of computers making musicians lazy, it is Trent. I'm sorry but each song on this album sounds like something I already heard from Trent and company. This is a safe record. Would I like to have my mind blown? Sure, who wouldn't. But stop regurgitating the same sounds over and again. I honestly really don't even see the point of even calling this by a different name. It is Nine Inch Nails with a chick singing. Just say Mariqueen joined NIN and wouldn't even know the difference. I wanted to like this album, i really did. But I hated Year Zero and this album sonically is like YZ pt 2. I actually prefer The Slip over the two. But the last album from NIN that I can listen thru full was With Teeth. But I really don't see the need to even call this project by any other name. And I really don't dig the lyrics and vocals on this one, find it a bit cheesey sounding. And except for The Space Between, the videos haven't been exciting either. I know I'm gonna get shit for my opinion, but oh well... welcome to the internet. I know we are suppose to love everything and never have a negative opinion about the band we love. I also find it strange that Trent is bringing back NIN so soon, right after the release of his new project's debut album. At least wait til 2014 to focus on NIN again and use this year to give HTDA room to breathe. I mean, I'm all for new NIN shows... but your new project hasn't even played a show yet. Where's the Niggy Tardust/How To Destroy Angels/Nine Inch Nails tour?

[screwdriver]

It has nothing to do with having your mind blown, it's just this album sounds like the same regurgitated Year Zero meets movie soundtrack Trent. I find it funny how Trent bashes computers in making musicians release lazy sounding music while Trent releases a pretty dull and meandering album with horrible lyrics and terrible delivery. This album goes nowhere and is not gripping. The songs don't develop into much and is repetitive... its a lazy sounding album. If anyone needs to take the advice of computers making musicians lazy, it is Trent. I'm sorry but each song on this album sounds like something I already heard from Trent and company. This is a safe record. Would I like to have my mind blown? Sure, who wouldn't. But stop regurgitating the same sounds over and again.

Everybody keeps saying "Year Zero," but is that just because it has electronic beats? I honestly don't like Year Zero, like, at all. I think I listened to it a few times when it came out, tried to make myself like it, and it just never clicked. I've liked the songs live, but the album itself does nothing for me. This album, on the other hand, does.

(Also, if you say something sounds like an artist's previous album + another of artist's previous albums, that sounds to me like a stylistic development.)

I'm legitimately curious what the last record you really enjoyed was, I'd like to check it out.

[sheepdean]

it has nothing to do with having your mind blown, it's just this album sounds like the same regurgitated year zero meets movie soundtrack trent. I find it funny how trent bashes computers in making musicians release lazy sounding music while trent releases a pretty dull and meandering album with horrible lyrics and terrible delivery.

Foooooooooooooouuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Mmmmmmmmmmmmeeeeeeeeeeeeeemmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmbeeeeeee eeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrsssssssssssssssssss.

Where was everyone's moaning when COD theme came out? That sounded like a bad NIN cover version, but the lack of Q and Atticus meant everyone shut up because GOD FORBID Trent might make bad music and then not be able to blame the other ones!

[screwdriver]

Foooooooooooooouuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Mmmmmmmmmmmmeeeeeeeeeeeeeemmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmbeeeeeee eeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrsssssssssssssssssss.

Where was everyone's moaning when COD theme came out? That sounded like a bad NIN cover version, but the lack of Q and Atticus meant everyone shut up because GOD FORBID Trent might make bad music and then not be able to blame the other ones!

whoa, whoa, whoa... that COD theme was pretty alright, sir.