Not The Actual Events

[wizfan]

Besides, Trent has always preferred releasing a delayed product of good quality, or even no product at all, than a shoddy product on time. Perfectionism, the plague of every artist...

[BRoswell]

As stated many times, I said it is my OPINION (see how I put it in bold so you can get it this time?).

No, you said:

And more to the point, the facts speak for themselves.

F-A-C-T-S, not opinion.

Look, it's fine if you think the album was rushed into production. You can have that opinion if you want, but if you're going to present it as fact, and say that "the facts" back up your claim, you damn well better have those facts on hand. Otherwise you're just making stuff up.

[nowimnothing]

Exactly. This is not an uncommon thing. It's annoying perhaps, but anyone who says it reflects negatively on the actual music is just looking to complain in my opinion.

Again learn to read. I said it affected the release, not the music itself.

I then ventured to say that it resulted in disappointment and frustration.

[nowimnothing]

No, you said:



F-A-C-T-S, not opinion.

Look, it's fine if you think the album was rushed into production. You can have that opinion if you want, but if you're going to present it as fact, and say that "the facts" back up your claim, you damn well better have those facts on hand. Otherwise you're just making stuff up.

Facts:

* 12 months to wait for a mere 21 minutes of music with recycled artwork

* Firebrand download fuck ups

* Shipping delays

* Lack of communication

See the facts? There they are.

And like I said at the beginning, if you use simple critical judgment it indicates a rushed release.

[BRoswell]

Again learn to read. I said it affected the release, not the music itself.

I then ventured to say that it resulted in disappointment and frustration.

In response to what I said about Trent and Atticus recording the album while working on score material:

What people say and what they actually do are generally two different things. But feel free to believe that TR wouldn't lie to suit his own agenda.

You said they lied about it. Also, you DID say that the release affected the music:

But it doesn't change the fact that this whole experience has detracted from the enjoyment of the new music.

Facts:

* 12 months to wait for a mere 21 minutes of music with recycled artwork

* Firebrand download fuck ups

* Shipping delays

* Lack of communication

See the facts? There they are.

And like I said at the beginning, if you use simple critical judgment it indicates a rushed release.

Trent promised us new music in 2016. He delivered new music in 2016. He never promised us a six disc album with a massive promotional campaign, just new music, and he delivered on that promise. Just because it's a short release doesn't make it any less valid (as the overall positive response to the album has shown). Also. just because he reused the artwork from Still in the official download doesn't indicate a rushed release, especially considering how many variants on the cover that have been released. It's clear that there's a method to his madness, but just because he hasn't come out and said exactly why he did that doesn't mean that it was done as a result of laziness.

Everything else on that list is the fault of the company that Trent and Atticus hired to get things done, and I haven't debated that one bit. They fucked up, they're apparently working on fixing things, end of story.

[Star]

So, is the physical component delayed for those, like me, who only purchased the download? No , need to wait to ship to me since I am not getting vinyl.

[nowimnothing]

In response to what I said about Trent and Atticus recording the album while working on score material:



You said they lied about it. Also, you DID say that the release affected the music:





Trent promised us new music in 2016. He delivered new music in 2016. He never promised us a six disc album with a massive promotional campaign, just new music, and he delivered on that promise. Just because it's a short release doesn't make it any less valid (as the overall positive response to the album has shown). Also. just because he reused the artwork from Still in the official download doesn't indicate a rushed release, especially considering how many variants on the cover that have been released. It's clear that there's a method to his madness, but just because he hasn't come out and said exactly why he did that doesn't mean that it was done as a result of laziness.

Everything else on that list is the fault of the company that Trent and Atticus hired to get things done, and I haven't debated that one bit. They fucked up, they're apparently working on fixing things, end of story.

In response to what I said about Trent and Atticus recording the album while working on score material:



You said they lied about it. Also, you DID say that the release affected the music:





Trent promised us new music in 2016. He delivered new music in 2016. He never promised us a six disc album with a massive promotional campaign, just new music, and he delivered on that promise. Just because it's a short release doesn't make it any less valid (as the overall positive response to the album has shown). Also. just because he reused the artwork from Still in the official download doesn't indicate a rushed release, especially considering how many variants on the cover that have been released. It's clear that there's a method to his madness, but just because he hasn't come out and said exactly why he did that doesn't mean that it was done as a result of laziness.

Everything else on that list is the fault of the company that Trent and Atticus hired to get things done, and I haven't debated that one bit. They fucked up, they're apparently working on fixing things, end of story.

Ever heard of context? I clearly stated it affects the *enjoyment* of the music, not the music itself. That is my opinion.

I didn't say they actually lied. What I was trying to get through to you is that they will say what suits them - and that it doesn't necessarily mean what they say is fact or truth. I was also trying to get you to understand believing what they say verbatim is neive.

A serious question for you? Is english your second language? Because you seem to have a lot of trouble understanding all of this. Or are you deliberately trying to be an asshat by taking what I say to the extreme and throwing it about out of context?

In any case, I believe I have made my OPINION quite clear. I have better things to do than constantly repeat myself because you keep missing the point.

If you really want to discuss this further, PM me so it doesn't keep filling up the thread with this mindless repetition.

[BRoswell]

I didn't say they actually lied. What I was trying to get through to you is that they will say what suits them - and that it doesn't necessarily mean what they say is fact or truth. I was also trying to get you to understand believing what they say verbatim is neive.

You may not have said it outright, but you sure as hell implied that they lied about it, and you did so with absolutely no evidence.

And I believe them because I have no reason NOT to believe them. Like I said: THEY made the album, YOU didn't, so when you imply that they might have rushed through the making of it, the burden of proof is on YOU, not them. Just because the company that they hired to release physical media fucked up doesn't mean they threw the album together at the last minute.

A serious question for you? Is english your second language? Because you seem to have a lot of trouble understanding all of this. Or are you deliberately trying to be an asshat by taking what I say to the extreme and throwing it about out of context?

I understood it just fine.

Also, you spelled "naive" wrong, so maybe you shouldn't be questioning my ability to grasp the English language.

In any case, I believe I have made my OPINION quite clear. I have better things to do than constantly repeat myself because you keep missing the point.

If you really want to discuss this further, PM me so it doesn't keep filling up the thread with this mindless repetition.

So no evidence then? Man, what a disappointment.

And with that, I am done here. Going to give the EP another spin actually. I hope it still sounds good without my physical component to cradle in my arms.

[nowimnothing]

You may not have said it outright, but you sure as hell implied that they lied about it, and you did so with absolutely no evidence.

And I believe them because I have no reason NOT to believe them. Like I said: THEY made the album, YOU didn't, so when you imply that they might have rushed through the making of it, the burden of proof is on YOU, not them. Just because the company that they hired to release physical media fucked up doesn't mean they threw the album together at the last minute.



I understood it just fine.

Also, you spelled "naive" wrong, so maybe you shouldn't be questioning my ability to grasp the English language.



So no evidence then? Man, what a disappointment.

For the second time. PM me if you want to continue your pointless argument. Otherwise, move on.

[tony.parente]

I think what happened is Trent Reznor Reznor'd himself in 2015 when he said new music was coming in 2016. I don't think that the music was rushed, I feel like he released what he wanted to release musically.

What I'm thinking WAS rushed may have been the physical portion of the roll out and the website update. I'm assuming he wrapped up production sometime in December and he didn't finalize the physical/website portions of the release. He knew he wasn't able to produce a physical product in 2016 so he announced NTAE, released the (poorly distributed) digital files a week later to buy him some time and then went to work finalizing the details of the physical portions of the release. Since he was held to his own 2016 release window he wasn't able to finalize 100% everything to do with the release and here we are, February 7th waiting for the mailing of the physical components that were to be shipped in week 1 of January 2017. Combine that with his tendency to overdo himself with the definitive editions of the entire catalog and we have the nin shit tornado of 2017.

[Helpmeiaminhell (is now in hell)]

I wouldn't be surprised if he intended on doing a full length album originally, then mark wahlberg and peter berg and dicaprio and fisher stevens called and that put the kibosh on a full length for 2016, so he scrambled and decided to make it a 5 song EP....I highly doubt he only recorded 5 songs for NIN in 2016...there must be others that either arent finished/hit the cutting room floor/or are part of a future release

[kel]

So, is the physical component delayed for those, like me, who only purchased the download?

yes. ten chars.

[bobbie solo]

Hey @nowimnothing is pompous, purposefully combative for no reason & annoying me greatly. Let's ban him. Thanks.

[cheddamash]

So, is the physical component delayed for those, like me, who only purchased the download? No , need to wait to ship to me since I am not getting vinyl.

My understanding is that the physical component is delayed in general and those who made the mistake of buying all the new stuff together (how dare we) will have to wait until everything is ready to ship, which will be spring at the earliest. Some have stated they've contacted Firebrand to get them to ship the physical component separately. I and others have not been so lucky. I received a canned response saying no and, despite their being a specific ship time of January 2017, was told sorry for the confusion. To my knowledge Firebrand nor any NIN representation has commented on the delay.

[tremolo]

What people say and what they actually do are generally two different things. But feel free to believe that TR wouldn't lie to suit his own agenda.

And in case you haven't yet learned how to read, I actually provided a list of issues with this release. I didn't just cite the delay of the physical component as being a sole reason for my disappointment.

I honestly am beyond caring about the physical component in any case. How good can it be for $12 with an ep release and free international shipping.

I mean shit, TR can't possibly fuck things up can he? He is Mr Perfect right?

He is by no means perfect, and yes, the whole firebrand thing has been a huge fuckup, leaving us all in the air wondering what the fuck is going on.

But to say that all of this has somehow ruined the experience of the new EP is a bit of a stretch, seriously.

I got new music, I actually got it a day earlier than I was supposed to (I think the fuckup was with the Deviations donwload, not NTAE). And even if some people had trouble with the download... how fucking terrible it must have been to not being able to listen to the new music for a day since its release... maybe I am taking this lightly, it must have been devastating to read comments about the new music here and not being able to (legally) listen to it right away.

Some people even contacted firebrand to get a second download link because their files were not properly tagged... I mean what the fuck!? How dare they do this to the fans? I shouldn't have to take 5 seconds to tag the files correctly, I'd rather complain and wait a couple hours to a day to get a new download with the files properly tagged.

It's just an example of how seriously some people take this... to the point of getting frustrated and not being able to enjoy an incredible EP. I think there is a problem there, and it'd not TR's or Firebrand's.

[sore_and_crucified]

Everyone is entitled to receive a good service when we are paying for a product.

[Star]

My understanding is that the physical component is delayed in general and those who made the mistake of buying all the new stuff together (how dare we) will have to wait until everything is ready to ship, which will be spring at the earliest. Some have stated they've contacted Firebrand to get them to ship the physical component separately. I and others have not been so lucky. I received a canned response saying no and, despite their being a specific ship time of January 2017, was told sorry for the confusion. To my knowledge Firebrand nor any NIN representation has commented on the delay.

Okay, thank you. Not shocked, nothing with NIN is ever on time, the buzzword is always "soon" which could be today or ten years from now. At this point I don't care, I got the music I wanted so it gets here when it gets here, or not.

[theimage13]

So, is the physical component delayed for those, like me, who only purchased the download? No , need to wait to ship to me since I am not getting vinyl.

Message below is what I received from them after emailing a few days ago. It's the whole email, verbatim.

Apologies for the delay. The physical component of your order is now expected to ship in the next two weeks. We will notify you when it's being shipped. Thank you for your patience.

[theimage13]

Don't know if this opinion has come up somewhere in the 88 pages, but re: Burning Bright and live shows - I don't think it'll make it into the live setlist. The mix (particularly, the vocals being further back in the mix for much of it) and the overall tempo of it make it feel like it just wouldn't fit into a set. Which would be a shame, because it's a fantastic track. But every single time I listen to it, I try to picture it being worked into a live version and plugged into a show somewhere, and I just can't picture it.

Maybe I'll be surprised. But personally, I don't expect to ever see this one performed.

[Disassociative]

Don't know if this opinion has come up somewhere in the 88 pages, but re: Burning Bright and live shows - I don't think it'll make it into the live setlist. The mix (particularly, the vocals being further back in the mix for much of it) and the overall tempo of it make it feel like it just wouldn't fit into a set. Which would be a shame, because it's a fantastic track. But every single time I listen to it, I try to picture it being worked into a live version and plugged into a show somewhere, and I just can't picture it.

Maybe I'll be surprised. But personally, I don't expect to ever see this one performed.

I agree, I'm not sure how it would work live at all. If they can pull it off I'll be extremely pleased and impressed. Maybe he'll do what he used to do in The Warning and yell/sing through a megaphone or something and give his voice a sort of distanced/distorted effect for the verses?

[theimage13]

I agree, I'm not sure how it would work live at all. If they can pull it off I'll be extremely pleased and impressed. Maybe he'll do what he used to do in The Warning and yell/sing through a megaphone or something and give his voice a sort of distanced/distorted effect for the verses?

The vocal effect would be easy enough to replicate - between that solution or plugins / outboard effects at FOH, you can get the sound. But the vocals don't feel front and center on the EP (which I would imagine was intentional), and it just feels like replicating that live would sound "off" in the context of the rest of a show. Maybe I'm just overthinking it.

[Disassociative]

The vocal effect would be easy enough to replicate - between that solution or plugins / outboard effects at FOH, you can get the sound. But the vocals don't feel front and center on the EP (which I would imagine was intentional), and it just feels like replicating that live would sound "off" in the context of the rest of a show. Maybe I'm just overthinking it.

I get what you mean, they sound very distant yet also a bit claustrophobic too which I think live would sort of just fall flat. Who know maybe they'll re-imagine it in some way for a live incarnation to make it a bit more concert friendly? It's not likely but you never know.

[buckaroo]

I wouldn't be surprised if he intended on doing a full length album originally, then mark wahlberg and peter berg and dicaprio and fisher stevens called and that put the kibosh on a full length for 2016, so he scrambled and decided to make it a 5 song EP....I highly doubt he only recorded 5 songs for NIN in 2016...there must be others that either arent finished/hit the cutting room floor/or are part of a future release

Not that this was referring to NTAE, but didn't he say something like they were working on 80 pieces of music that might be released in some form in the future. I sort of remember that from the beats interview, but I could be completely wrong as I only half listened to it once and don't want to listen to it again.

[wizfan]

Don't know if this opinion has come up somewhere in the 88 pages, but re: Burning Bright and live shows - I don't think it'll make it into the live setlist. The mix (particularly, the vocals being further back in the mix for much of it) and the overall tempo of it make it feel like it just wouldn't fit into a set. Which would be a shame, because it's a fantastic track. But every single time I listen to it, I try to picture it being worked into a live version and plugged into a show somewhere, and I just can't picture it.

Maybe I'll be surprised. But personally, I don't expect to ever see this one performed.

And, lyrically speaking, I feel it's way too "unfriendly" for a live performance, even by NIN standards.

[Disassociative]

And, lyrically speaking, I feel it's way too "unfriendly" for a live performance, even by NIN standards.

The verses anyway, personally I feel like the choruses along with the crowd (and Robin doing backing vocals if he's involved in NIN 2017) would sound pretty damn powerful

[sweeterthan]

No. BB (FOF) should close all nin sets from now on. Think about how different everything from PHM sounds live compared to the album. I'm positive a live translation of BB will be amazing.

(I've said it at least twice in the 80 pages)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Disassociative]

No. BB (FOF) should close all nin sets from now on. Think about how different everything from PHM sounds live compared to the album. I'm positive a live translation of BB will be amazing.

(I've said it at least twice in the 80 pages)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I really hope you're right - it's something I really want to hear.

It's hard for me to imagine now but I wonder what songs by NIN people have heard before a tour/show supporting the album it came from and think "how the shit are they going to pull this off live"

[implanted_microchip]

The fact that Burning Bright is so hard to imagine being done live is exactly why I want them to do it live. They made All the Love in the World work, I'm sure they could pull it off. Ideally with three people on guitar all at once to build up that wall of sound it has.

[streetman]

We now march toward March with no word on the physical component. Strange.

[streetman]

The fact that Burning Bright is so hard to imagine being done live is exactly why I want them to do it live. They made All the Love in the World work, I'm sure they could pull it off. Ideally with three people on guitar all at once to build up that wall of sound it has.

It would be amazing live. As well as Dear World, and Branches/Bones.