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Faceplams: Not controversial. Fact.Originally Posted by HWB
Hairy Member
Not controversial. Fact.
Throbbing Member
"Broken" is actually my least favorite release, even though it seems to be a favorite among fans.
Don't get me wrong: I love the songs on there, just not in their originally released form. My hearing kind of sucks after years of working in loud environments when I was a kid, so a lot of those songs just sound kind of muddy to me. I love the instrumentals on "Broken" and basically only ever listen to it for those, but for songs like "Wish", "Gave Up" and "Suck" I always go to the live versions instead because they sound better to me that way.
Active Member
To be honest, none of the live "Broken" tracks sound as good as the album versions to me. They just lack the complexities of the album versions. Then again, I feel that way about most live versions of tracks from "Broken" through "The Fragile".
Memb, Member, The Membest
Do you feel that Trent and Co haven't perfected Wish and Gave Up throughout all these tours? You have to be kidding...
Captain Rustleboots
God break down the door doesn’t become listenable until 3:15 and the last minute is the best 60 seconds of the EP.
Throbbing Member
I love it all but that last bit we got a preview of as a snippet before the release is the single best moment of the track. Would have wanted a year zero type outro going wild with this one.
Active Member
What exactly makes the rest of it unlistenable?
Active Member
I'm in the same ballpark as @BRoswell . I find the harsh electronics of the album much more compelling than the band renditions.
They're still good songs. It's just personal preference.
Active Member
Perfected in what sense? They sound good, but again, they're missing the complexities that make me prefer the album versions. Plus, Trent & Co. have essentially been playing tracks like that the same way for over twenty years. I'd like to see them add/subtract elements from the live versions (or try something new with them) and see what happens.
Captain Rustleboots
Everything. It’s awful and makes the song Everything sound like the great below
Dis-member
Is this an endorsement of the last 60 seconds being amazing, or a back-handed compliment for Bad Witch?
JMO, but Bad Witch is probably NIN’s worst release. Spun it about 15 times and nothing wants me to go back for more. Not gonna try and force myself to like it- is what it is.
Captain Rustleboots
Bad witch isn’t good at all. Huge let down in every respect, however the last 60 I mentioned is legitimately 9/10
Dis-member
I felt better about myself not liking BW by checking out the iTunes rating. Any good, established act will have at least a 4.0 star rating there for almost anything that’s released. BW is hovering around 3.5.
Active Member
...by checking out the iTunes rating......the iTunes rating......iTunes...
Bwahahahaha!
Last edited by BRoswell; 08-19-2018 at 10:26 PM.
God is an American
plebTunes amirite
Dis-member
Yeah, cuz ETS should be the place to go to for a “Fair And Balanced” review of a NIN album.
EDIT: my point was a bad iTunes score usually means the album isn’t received particularly well by people. Great/good albums don’t usually see scores under a 4.0 there. Itsnot like it’s a one person review.
Last edited by Krazy; 08-19-2018 at 11:10 PM.
God is an American
Nobody is arguing we're unbiased, I'm just arguing that people who still use iTunes in 2018 are wrong.
Active Member
Half the people who leave "reviews" and ratings on iTunes can't even spell. "Dis album no gewd! Dis album baaaaad! Want my munny back!"
It's definitely the place to go if you want to see how our education systems have failed people over the years, but for critical analysis? Hell fucking no.
Last edited by BRoswell; 08-19-2018 at 11:17 PM.
Dis-member
Visiting the iTunes Store is somehow “wrong”? In what way?
i rarely buy anything off there, but bands and musicians and others still put their product up there. Someone is buying the stuff- probably out of convenience.
Dis-member
I looked at the overall rating, not going over every written review. Some are (kind of) articulate, many of them not so much. It’s the most poorly rated NIN album on ITunes. That was all I was getting at.
Active Member
It's also the newest, and it's been out for only two months. I'm sure if iTunes had been out when The Fragile was released, it too would have been the lowest rated album. Unless something is really bad or really good, user ratings fluctuate over time, hence why they're mostly unreliable in terms of determining quality.
God is an American
This does not in any way validate your opinion of the album, because those ratings are simply not a reliable indicator of anything at all, let alone mass market consensus. Something like Metacritic, which actually weighs people's preferences against certain controls before smacking them all into a gross median rating, is on the whole a more reliable indication of how each release has been received. The so-called Genius function on iTunes, for example, is a great example of a Netflix-style preferences algorithm, which is easily confused because the quantity of data collected is so huge and so crudely related to what you've actually sat through and given preference feedback upon.
This is a long-winded way of also saying: nothing that's challenging is considered good, at least not at first. Remember, Bad Witch has been out for less than two months. Overall ratings are likely to increase over time as people get comfortable living with it and adjust to the weird curveballs that such a challenging work throws them. Does the work get better over time when this happens? No, the rating gets more reflective of how people feel about challenging works in the long run. Not saying this will happen to you with Bad Witch, I'm saying you may continue to not like it even as other people get to like it and the rating goes up.
EDIT, or even more succinctly, What He Said ^^
Last edited by botley; 08-20-2018 at 06:14 AM.
Active Member
Think of how many films bombed at the box office and were savaged by critics only to become classics as time went on and people discovered them. Just because something comes out and it's not declared the most amazing thing ever right away doesn't mean that it's bad.
And speaking of films, I wouldn't trust the mouthbreathers on iTunes any more than I would trust the ones on IMDb.
Active Member
Potentially the rating may go up after the US tour because the run of Shit Mirror > Ahead of Ourselves > God Break Down the Door was amazing live and some of the best moments of the sets that were filled with classics (speaking of Meltdown and RAH in London personally). Seeing it live made me get the album (to be fair it only came out the day of Meltdown though)
Throbbing Member
Not So Pretty Now is an awesome song. Is that controversial? I don't see anyone ever bring it up so I'm gonna say it's controversial.
Last edited by nooneimportant; 08-20-2018 at 04:09 AM.
This Cannot Continue
I wouldn't say that was Controversial, Not So Pretty Now is one of my fav songs from the With Teeth era!
God is an American
It's pretty Controversial around these parts (routinely called one of the worst NIN songs back when it came out; personally I like it).
Throbbing Member
Does anyone else find it strange that a bunch of people who listen to NIN are arguing about whether or not the album is popular and well-rated?
What does it matter? If you want to listen to popular and well-rated then go stream some Ariana Grande. If you are interested in art then make up your own mind and quit worrying about what everyone else thinks.
God is an American
I think you've slightly misconstrued the last two pages of discussion.
Active Member
I've always thought Not So Pretty Now is a decent track, but there's no question in my mind that it's the weakest of the With Teeth era. Non-Entity is VASTLY superior and I'd be happy if they dusted that one off for the new tour.
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