Tool

[theruiner]

It's annoying to see people start to bash fans of the newer material and the newer material itself instead of just walking away.

Why would we walk away from a band we love just because we're not crazy about their newer stuff? I always have faith that the next one will be better. I hated 10,000 Days with a passion, but I've still got my fingers crossed they'll get their mojo back on the next one. And if the next one sucks, I'll probably still be rooting for them to get their shit together for the one after that. Not to mention still wanting to see them live. Not to mention how much I love just about everything prior to 10,000 Days. You don't have to like everything a band does to be a fan.

[Ryan]

Why would we walk away from a band we love just because we're not crazy about their newer stuff? I always have faith that the next one will be better. I hated 10,000 Days with a passion, but I've still got my fingers crossed they'll get their mojo back on the next one. And if the next one sucks, I'll probably still be rooting for them to get their shit together for the one after that. Not to mention still wanting to see them live. Not to mention how much I love just about everything prior to 10,000 Days. You don't have to like everything a band does to be a fan.

10,000 Days was a disappointment because we were expecting the Next Big Thing after Lateralus. What we got was the first single sounding like Schism (Vicarious); album art that was essentially a direct replication of Lateralus-era stuff (Alex Grey, etc), and the title was unappealing given every previous record was a single word and mysterious in nature. It fucked up the whole continuity; whereas each previous album got better and better, 10,000 Days just sat there, uninspired, compared to previous, better days, and didn't improve. It was more a Lateralus II, but shittier. The conversations could go on endlessly.

[BenAkenobi]

...the title was unappealing given every previous record was a single word and mysterious in nature...

[Amaro]

10,000 Days, while very good right down to the music mechanics, chronologically speaking it lacked a true identity that the others before it had so convincingly. While 10,000 Days flows fine, it was essentially a plateau to my ears, having walked this band's path that lead up to it. It always sounded like a mix of past directions, and by now that's really obvious. I don't think they were too lazy...it just happened the way that it did. Different time and place.

It's actually quite exciting to think about where it's gonna go now...an extremely different situation from any other band I'm into...even if it ends up in a way I'd not prefer.

[theruiner]

^^You nailed it. That analogy is perfect. I just felt like they were treading the exact same path musically, and after changing things up with each album, I didn't expect "better" than their past efforts, but I did expect something different. And considering the songs weren't nearly as interesting or enjoyable as any of their previous albums, the fact that it was pretty much in the same vein made it even worse- I already heard this stuff before and much, much better. You're giving me watered down, bland versions of stuff you've already done. Like I said, they don't necessarily have to top their last efforts, but they should at least do something different. Even if it wasn't good, at least you could say they tried. There are a lot of bands that just keep releasing the same album over and over again. They never grow and they never branch out and they never evolve. Those bands suck. Tool was always better than that.

Anyway, that being said, I'm still excited for the new album.

[Ryan]

Agreed x2.

[Harry Seaward]

^^You nailed it. That analogy is perfect. I just felt like they were treading the exact same path musically, and after changing things up with each album, I didn't expect "better" than their past efforts, but I did expect something different. And considering the songs weren't nearly as interesting or enjoyable as any of their previous albums, the fact that it was pretty much in the same vein made it even worse- I already heard this stuff before and much, much better. You're giving me watered down, bland versions of stuff you've already done. Like I said, they don't necessarily have to top their last efforts, but they should at least do something different. Even if it wasn't good, at least you could say they tried. There are a lot of bands that just keep releasing the same album over and over again. They never grow and they never branch out and they never evolve. Those bands suck. Tool was always better than that.

Anyway, that being said, I'm still excited for the new album.

If 10,000 Days is watered-down and bland, could you point me toward the 'better' versions of Jambi, The Pot, Lost Keys/Rosetta Stoned, and Intension/Right In Two?

I don't understand how you guys think that album isn't different. It might not be as angry or introspective (which, to be fair, has always seemed like a big part of Tool) as previous endeavors, but I wouldn't say it was 'the same path.' I think part of the problem with the dislike for that album is expectations. For someone who didn't get into Tool until late in the game (like myself), that record fits perfectly into the evolution of their sound. And not only their sound, their entire mindset behind the music. I see their discography as a coherent, tangible evolution from angry young men to extrospective 'elders'. Opiate was just brimming with anger, Undertow was recognition of the issues, Aenima was a cleansing, Lateralus was a time to try and fix the issues, and 10,000 Days gives time to focus on the world after fixing themselves. This is just my interpretation of course, just trying to explain why I think the last record fits perfectly to me.

I understand everyone has a different expectation and interpretation of the music, but I dislike seeing 10,000 Days blown off like nothing. I wish you guys would throw on some headphones in the dark, lay back, and give it a few more chances to click!

[october_midnight]

Well obviously your expectations were different if you haven't been following them for almost 20 years like the rest of some of us. It was a plateau album. Next.

[Harry Seaward]

Well obviously your expectations were different if you haven't been following them for almost 20 years like the rest of some of us. It was a plateau album. Next.

Yeah, and my point was that maybe you should try and listen to music with less expectations, you snarky fuck.

[henryeatscereal]

10,000 days is their "Blues record" according to them, still i want a different direction for the new one

[Magtig]

To put it simply, I'm sick of sprawling indulgent prog rock from Tool. 10k Days probably would have been much better if the best parts of it had been condensed to a 50 minute album. If they can't dig up a serious change in direction, and impose a few limits on themselves, I'm pretty much done. I've become less and less tolerant of their snarky attitudes towards being rock stars, and even less tolerant of the music, which doesn't seem to justify the condescending nature of that behavior. These guys are making (almost) two albums per decade that sound basically the same. To me that indicates that the burning passion necessary for making great music is not present; the work ethic is not present, and the interest is not present. They're bored with themselves.

[Leviathant]

One of these days I'll dig up and release my "8,000 Days" Phantom Edit. It's a much tighter album after cutting about 20% out of it.

[smokey_mcpot]

interesting^^

[Harry Seaward]

I also hear a lot of complaints about 10kDays being mostly filler. Which I always find funny, because it has less filler than Aenima, which seems to be everyone's favorite.

[botley]

Maybe you're feeling conflicted and bitter inside because you've realized it's only a rock and roll band. A virtuosic and unique one, but still — gimme a fucking break. Of course you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you expect any more than that.

[Harry Seaward]

Maybe you're feeling conflicted and bitter inside because you've realized it's only a rock and roll band. A virtuosic and unique one, but still — gimme a fucking break. Of course you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you expect any more than that.

Who is that directed towards?

[botley]

Who is that directed towards?

Everybody who's hating on a six-year-old rock LP like it's a Star Wars movie or something.

[Self.Destructive.Pattern]

To put it simply, I'm sick of sprawling indulgent prog rock from Tool. 10k Days probably would have been much better if the best parts of it had been condensed to a 50 minute album. If they can't dig up a serious change in direction, and impose a few limits on themselves, I'm pretty much done. I've become less and less tolerant of their snarky attitudes towards being rock stars, and even less tolerant of the music, which doesn't seem to justify the condescending nature of that behavior. These guys are making (almost) two albums per decade that sound basically the same. To me that indicates that the burning passion necessary for making great music is not present; the work ethic is not present, and the interest is not present. They're bored with themselves.

This this this. The attitudes towards fans and media got old and molded a long time ago. We get it Tool. But nothing jumped out at me at all when I first heard 10,000 days. It was pretty much like "Ok, this sounds good, it sounds like...Tool". It is accessible to the ears, but nothing that is going to make your eyes widen or make you do a double take at the speakers when you hear something off the charts.

10,000 days to me is very boring at times. The songs do not have much replay with the exception of "Intension" and "Right in Two" (which I think are the best tracks on the album), so that's why this album, (correction) every Tool album has collected a good form of dust phyically and digitally for me. I go back to Aenima the most I would say.

I'd rather have a new APC record, or Puscifer. To each their own.

[Harry Seaward]

No love for Rosetta Stoned? =(

[Self.Destructive.Pattern]

No love for Rosetta Stoned? =(

I do like it. What turns me off is the distorted vocals.. not for me. It reminds me on Brand New's latest album "Daisy". The song "Be Gone" could have been a nice little piece of music, but it is muddled by stupid broken up and distorted lyrics.

[Amaro]

No love for Rosetta Stoned? =(

Great piece...though H. did it 100x better.

lol

[seasonsinthesky]

^ that "H." comment is pretty lulzy, given how neither song is anything like the other xD

"Rosetta" is one of my favourite tracks on 10,000 Days. it took me a while to be able to stand the 3 different endings, but whatever, i'm over it!

the actual sleeper hit on that record is "Intension". why does no one like it? not enough bombast compared to everything else on it? it's one of my favourite Tool tracks, on level with "Disposition" and other such muted, balladic moments.

[Self.Destructive.Pattern]

^^^ I love Intension. That and "Right in Two" hit me pretty emotionally.

[theruiner]

Yeah, and my point was that maybe you should try and listen to music with less expectations, you snarky fuck.

Expectations had nothing to do with it. The album is just not very good. We're all just going to have to agree to disagree, because, at least for me, I don't see my opinion on that album changing. And that's fine. Some people like it, some people don't. I don't expect to change anyone's mind (though I do appreciate a good conversation about it).

[aggroculture]

10000 Days is fucking awesome, and I've been following Tool since 93. Rosetta Stoned is genius: I wish they'd extended it into a 20-minute EP. It's simply the best sci-fi heavy metal rock opera of all time. You want to remove those vocals give me a break.
Yes, the album title and artwork were pretty shit/predictable. But: Vicarious, Jambi, The Pot, Rosetta Stoned, and even Right In Two, which sounds like an APC reject with a bunch of proggery in the middle, are all great songs. I don't care much for Wings for Marie, but it's still superior to Isis' entire discography.
So yeah, I don't know what you guys are complaining about. Unlike a certain other band popular round these parts, Tool have have not dive-bombed, quality wise. Of course it's mellower, these guys are getting old. The new album will likely be mellower still.

[Harry Seaward]

Of course it's mellower, these guys are getting old. The new album will likely be mellower still.

Personally, I have no problem with that at all.

Agreed on all of your other points as well (except I do love the title track (both parts.))

[MrSlfDstruct]

One of the things I love about Tool is that, through the years they've made such different sounding stuff that there's always something to fit my mood. I'm surprised to see so much discord toward 10,000 Days, although I definitely see the Lateralus comparison, as it definitely wasn't as much of a leap in style as their past work has been.

I really liked 10,000 Days though, especially the slow burn that is Wings for Marie/10,000 Days. I really get into the lyrics toward the end of 10,000 Days,

You're the only one who can hold your head up high,
Shake your fist at the gates saying:
"I've come home now!
Fetch me the Spirit, the Son and the Father,
tell them their pillar of Faith has ascended.
It's time now,
my time now,
Give me my wings!"

I just love the attitude behind those lyrics It took me quite a few litens to the album before that really stood out to me, but I listen to both songs in anticipation of that part every time. Also love The Pot. I'm hoping for a departure for the next album though. I kinda wish they'd do something a little more like Undertow in that those are mostly quick, brutal punches to the face as opposed to the sprawling stuff that they've been leaning towards the last decade.

[Amaro]

^ that "H." comment is pretty lulzy, given how neither song is anything like the other xD

Lol I am just making a lil' fun because of the one Stoned riffage being similar to an area in H.

(I really think Rosetta Stoned is a fine piece.)

I don't look back to 10KD as being mellower than the rest...but maybe that's just it in I'm stale on my Tool these days.

[october_midnight]

Yeah, and my point was that maybe you should try and listen to music with less expectations, you snarky fuck.

Oh boo hoo. Just because I'm past the age of 'throwing on headphones in the dark and laying back' and just want to see a band I love do something worthwhile, it makes me a snarly fuck? Get back to the MM thread. Everything Magtig said is spot on, for a band that whips out a prolific output of TWO ALBUMS A DECADE, you'd think that they'd have the opportunity and/or passion to mix it up instead of just churning out what people expect. They're just another band, and like any other band, if I see shit like that happen, it irks me. That's why Manson held on for so long, it was always him, but he understood that he had to keep things interesting...now he's the EPITOME of a rock cliche. Every album is 'his comeback', he's 'found himself finally' yada yada yada...keep churning out the turds.

When I spin 10K Days, it's Vicarious, Jambi, The Pot, Right In Two annnnd done. Rosetta Stoned was *snorts* heh heh cooool the first few times...now it's annoying. I always go back to Lateralus, Undertow, and Aenima. All of the 'this album is their anger' and 'this album is their recognition of the anger' and blah blah. I'm sure when they recorded an album, it wasn't 'ok fellas, so this is the recognition of the anger of the last record'. They've boxed themselves in and if they don't get out it's going to just be 'another Tool album'.

[aggroculture]

Yeah...Tool should do what YOU want them to, those bastards.