Not The Actual Events

[allegro]

you can still understand the concept of a shadow self without knowing any of jungian theory, though.

Really? How? It is innate? I took a university-level Philosophy class and the only thing I can tell you about "shadow self" is = 0

Because we studied classical philosophers and a lot of Bertrand Russell. And Ludwig Wittgenstein.

I took a university-level Psychology class and we studied Freud, but no Jung.

But listening to something and assigning it meaning beyond the actual text, without any indication that the author does in fact have knowledge about the assignment of such meaning, is the listener/reader's intent; not the author's. Disregarding the author while interpreting their art is subjective interpretation.

[Lew]

Really? How? It is innate?

yes. i believe it is innate.
we all know we have thoughts and feelings that make us uncomfortable with ourselves and within ourselves.
that would be our shadow self/shadowy self/dark side/whatever you care to label it.
making peace with the ugly person inside is basically integrating it.
being aware of the ugly person inside is basically being aware of the shadow self.

[allegro]

yes. i believe it is innate.
we all know we have thoughts and feelings that make us uncomfortable with ourselves and within ourselves.
that would be our shadow self/shadowy self/dark side/whatever you care to label it.
making peace with the ugly person inside is basically integrating it.
being aware of the ugly person inside is basically being aware of the shadow self.

I don't mean the concept; I mean the NAME of it.

[Lew]

lol, and i am referring to the concept.
the concept, to me, is far more important than what any one school of thought calls it.
it is not like jung was the first or only person to examine the dark side of the human soul/heart/mind.

hmmm...i must be missing something here in interpreting your post.
i am still unsure, frankly.

[allegro]

The original topic was specifically Jungian. But yes "the dark side" is actually mostly a religion term, not a philosophical one.

[[parasite]]

people with borderline personality disorder are aware of their shadow self, it even takes them over, well it does me....


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[Kulerage]

Before you guys listened to the EP and saw the tracklist, how did you think the songs we're going to be like?
I thought Branches and Bones was actually going to be an aggressive loud song because being a instrumental-intro song would just be too predictable.
Dear World was going to be a catchy, fast-paced accessible angry song.
She's Gone Away would be a quiet and atmospheric track kinda like Something I Can Never Have.
The Idea of You was going to be fast-paced but maybe something like Zero Sum lyrics/mood wise.
Burning Bright was either going to be an extremely heavy and angry closer or an epic, quiet song like Right Where It Belongs.

I actually made a Meathead-esque post on the NIN forums a while ago about my predictions for how the next album was going to sound. I said a bunch of sarcastic stuff, but some of my predictions were actually kinda close. I said that one song was going to be an electronic song in the vein of Hesitation Marks (with a stupid number title) and well, Dear World. I said the last song was gonna be a cool rock thing and Burning Bright happened to be one. I also mentioned a LOUD AS SHIT HEAVY SONG which is The Idea Of You. Must say that this EP as a whole did not disappoint.

[allegro]

I do think it confronts many of the same notions as Jung's Shadow discussions do. And I don't think you have to go outside of the text to find that.

But that doesn't mean that is really what it "means" for everybody. "Not the Actual Events" doesn't HAVE to mean "something way more profound than the actual events, complete with a parallel universe and the Matrix depicting other forms per Plato, or events representing that we're are really space aliens" or whatever. It could mean, simply, as somebody already pointed out, "And all that could have been." Or, simply, "THESE THINGS DIDN'T HAPPEN." For a variety of reasons, these events didn't ever take place. Be it due to the influence of good vs. evil, drugs vs rehab, dark vs. light, philandering vs. a family, asshole vs. nice person, a change of plans, financial situation, age, etc.

The "meaning" of a word or a table cloth = its actual definition or actual purpose. It's not subjective, except within context re words.

The "meaning" of life = its personal or cultural significance, its subjective purpose, its symbolization.

If you make everything "significant," then nothing is insignificant and it implies that insignificance is a bad thing.

I have a BA in English Lit, as well, and I happen to put a lot of emphasis on author's intent, but this a hugely-debated issue among Lit Crit people. And you learn during research that no Lit Crit worth a shit doesn't use the text to support a thesis. And you quickly learn to weed out the people who read Milton's "Paradise Lost" as if it's a message from God, or that Adam and Eve were real people and Milton divined his words like Gospel. You get a lot more out of it from people who are STILL pissed off at Milton like he's a satanic deviant for making his Satan a protagonist with actual feelings (which is actually based on the text). I got to see Stanley Fish do a lecture about this at the University of Illinois at Chicago, btw, awesome.

[allegro]

people with borderline personality disorder are aware of their shadow self, it even takes them over, well it does me....

And religious people are always aware of the inner "sinner," the "Devil wants to fuck me in the back of his car," the bad angel and good angel, one sitting on each shoulder, always trying to hold back the Devil from tempting us into sin.

[ninjaw]

I always felt that there should be two thread "chat" and "updates", well it's too late now.

[Leviathant]

I always felt that there should be two thread "chat" and "updates", well it's too late now.

The "updates" thread is here.

[ninjaw]

The "updates" thread is here.

Did it mention why we removed one cover ? (it's not a question).

[Leviathant]

Did it mention why we removed one cover ? (it's not a question).

Hmm. Could you rephrase? I'm not sure I understand what you're saying.

[elevenism]

i may be totally fucking wrong about the intended meaning of this record. Who knows?

[sweeterthan]

Dear world has emerged as a favorite. I can't wait for the break down with those little synth hits.

So all of these songs are grouped in with my favorite nin songs.


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[cashpiles (closed)]

Where my physical component at? U a liar Trent? U a gat damn liar?!!

[tony.parente]

Where my physical component at? U a liar Trent? U a gat damn liar?!!

I got this about 2 hours ago:

Gnarlywood Customer Service(Firebrand Live)
Feb 17, 15:48 PST
Hi,
Just wanted to follow up with you. There was a production delay with the NIN Object and it has now just been received into the warehouse. We anticipate shipping of the object to commence early next week. We appreciate your patience and apologize for the delay.

[SM Rollinger]

just listening to this with headphones and its way better. especially dear world

[Destruct26]

[HWB]

It's been a while since I've been to this thread, let's see what we go-

http://38.media.tumblr.com/3341c9ef3...lh1io1_400.gif

[notsoprettynow]

no no i am not a fanboy no no

i just ordered the vinyl. 40 dollars (shipping to berlin)


i just listened to the ep now again and again and again. i lost interest in reznorism years ago. but "with teeth" was 90%ish awesome (i loved "sunspots" and "all the love in the world", "every day...", "only", "line begins to blur", "beside...", "... teeth", "right where..."), "the slip" was very nice ("demon seed" "head down", "echoplex"), but i didn't like the destructive political vibe of "year zero", "ghosts" was not as interesting as the instrumentals on "still", "hesitation marks" was very good (quite cool in parts: "running", "all time low", "i would for you"), but this one is simply really good indeed

another story: her name is s., she is 32 years old. i met her new year's eve 2014 i think. now we are neighbours. we exchanged music. "eraas", "tropic of cancer", "the kvb", "braids", "chelsea wolfe", "some ember" ... we share interests.
she wasn't that much into nin lately but she also thinks that NTAE is something vibrant. she also liked "autolux" since "future perfect". and she likes "pavement" as well. <3

thanks nin for getting to know beautiful people. nin never has been a shitty "rock"-band after all.
nin-fans are cool people. <3
the sad thing is: why didn't they vote for hillary?
s. couldnt vote in the u.s.. but she can vote for the european parliament. she moved freely from a south-eastern european country to berlin. legally. she studies in berlin. open borders among european countries! <3

[notsoprettynow]

(eraas: at heart - the kvb rmx)


more like this:
http://iwantedto.be/tapes.htm
https://soundcloud.com/kotzboy/best-...16-radio-corax
(best of incl. "esben and the witch", "glasser", "mueran humanos", "some ember", "thought forms" etc.)

[bobbie solo]

no no i am not a fanboy no no

i just ordered the vinyl. 40 dollars (shipping to berlin)


i just listened to the ep now again and again and again. i lost interest in reznorism years ago. but "with teeth" was 90%ish awesome (i loved "sunspots" and "all the love in the world", "every day...", "only", "line begins to blur", "beside...", "... teeth", "right where..."), "the slip" was very nice ("demon seed" "head down", "echoplex"), but i didn't like the destructive political vibe of "year zero", "ghosts" was not as interesting as the instrumentals on "still", "hesitation marks" was very good (quite cool in parts: "running", "all time low", "i would for you"), but this one is simply really good indeed

another story: her name is s., she is 32 years old. i met her new year's eve 2014 i think. now we are neighbours. we exchanged music. "eraas", "tropic of cancer", "the kvb", "braids", "chelsea wolfe", "some ember" ... we share interests.
she wasn't that much into nin lately but she also thinks that NTAE is something vibrant. she also liked "autolux" since "future perfect". and she likes "pavement" as well. <3

thanks nin for getting to know beautiful people. nin never has been a shitty "rock"-band after all.
nin-fans are cool people. <3
the sad thing is: why didn't they vote for hillary?
s. couldnt vote in the u.s.. but she can vote for the european parliament. she moved freely from a south-eastern european country to berlin. legally. she studies in berlin. open borders among european countries! <3

I love & appreciate the foreign posters whose English isn't perfect but are trying their darndest. It's endearing.

[bobbie solo]

fwiw I was being sincere there.

[witte]

omg, i think the weather is bad in france and mexico

[Khrz]

omg, i think the weather is bad in france and mexico

Well, insecure people tend to be triggered when they smell condescension

[xfocalinx]

I had a dream I found NTAE in a record store. I need help

[imail724]

just listening to this with headphones and its way better. especially dear world

Agreed. I listened to it a ton of times in a row when it came out on speakers or little workout headphones. Then a few weeks ago I got high, threw on my sennheisers and listened through it two times in a row. Great listening experience.

[Halo Infinity]

I had a dream I found NTAE in a record store. I need help

I wish. (As NTAE being in actual stores.) I also have yet to literally dream about that in my NIN dreams though. I suppose that it'll also only be a matter of time now that I read you saying that.

[kel]

i dunno.

anyway, there are a few really great, very amateur youtube reviews of ntae that have turned me into a couple vloggers who are really fun to follow. there's this guy from portland who goes on these tangents that are really thoughtful and even though i find it hard to relate to him i am genuinely glad this ep led me there. among other places.