Active Member
I know I'm repeating myself, but I don't buy into the idea that whoever is president is my president. Even if I voted for him or her, once they're elected I think of what they do as much bigger than for me to personalize it by saying they are or aren't "mine".
24.24.1.1397
I also want to interject that many people saying he isn't "their president" are saying it to mean he isn't a president with their (concerns, safety, what have you) in mind. That he's not the president of the people. Not that he literally is not the president of the country that they are a citizen in.
Active Member
That's obvious, but I guess I take issue with the idea that they're individualizing it instead of being concerned for everyone else, too. Maybe it isn't the intent, but it still rubs me a little wrong.
Active Member
The reason why I don't want to "let's see how it goes" and give him a chance is because I fundamentally disagree with a lot of things he promised to do! I do want him to fail... I don't want America to fail, but I do want this egomaniac asshole to fail at achieving what he set out to do. His version of a "great America" is not something I want to see.Originally Posted by allegro
And for protesting Trump's election: there are a lot of system failures there. Nobody -media, GOP, voters- held him accountable for his business conflicts. His relationships (debt, mostly) to foreign banks were not disclosed, there was no plan in place for him to distance himself from the Trump brand, etc... These are real issues of one's competency to hold the highest office.
I didn't like Bush, and I do believe now as believed back during his time that he destabilized the middle east and got us into a war that we'll never get out of. He really made the world a worse place... That said, I didn't HATE him, as a person. Trump, on the other hand, is a genuinely repulsive human being that I don't think I could shake hands with.
Bite me
You / we have no choice. We are stuck with him for 4 years.
The U.S. Code exempts the President from business conflicts*. The only possible problem is the Emoluments Clause.
This is weird fucking territory we're in, now. Presidents are usually lawyers. It throws us off when they're not. This guy isn't a politician. He's breaking all the rules, he insulted politicians in his inaugural speech. There is no system that requires or prevents this shit.
*See this and specifically this.
Last edited by allegro; 01-23-2017 at 01:07 AM.
Active Member
He has already shown his incompetence when it comes to how things work (which people see as charming and rebellious for some inexplicable reason), and we already know that his ego will not allow him to grow. Not as a person, and certainly not as president, so when people say "he's just starting" and "give him a chance", I laugh, because it implies that he's suddenly going to wake up one day and not be Donald Trump. People don't change when they get everything they wanted.
Last edited by BRoswell; 01-21-2017 at 01:14 AM.
Bite me
I don't think people mean "give him a chance" like his PERSONALITY is going to change; they are saying it ("they" including President Obama) because he just got into office and has to work with Congress to try to get some things done and some of the shit this guy wants is term limits, and negotiating Rx drug prices (which the Repugs just shot down as did some Dems), etc.
Stubby Member
I have no problem with protesting the inauguration of a man who lost the popular vote by almost three million votes. Big Daddy Donald is gonna put all the liberals in time-out for a few years, but that doesn't mean we can't go to the corner kicking and screaming along the way. Bipartisanship is dead and gone; there's no reason to play nice anymore and quietly give conservatives their day in the sun. Republicans won back the House, Senate, and White House by going as far right as possible, opposing anything and everything that liberals did. Remember when they initially opposed a bill that would give healthcare aid to 9/11 first responders? They had zero class, but won seat after seat by doing nothing more than shitting on the 'liberal agenda' any way that they could.
The 'wait and see' method serves no purpose. We draped an American over our eyes during Bush 43's run, and look where that got us. Legitimizing Trump in any way will only serve to help him get four more years.
Within minutes of being sworn in, official White House webpages concerning climate change, civil rights, and LGBT rights were taken down. Within an hour of being sworn in he signed an executive order that will require non-wealthy home owners to pay hundreds more every year in mortgage payments. In a few months hell try using taxpayer money to build a giant wall that is certain to run over-budget by millions, never be fully completed, and will not even benefit our national security. Theres also heavy whispers of defunding PBS and NPR, relieving an astonishing .05 of our national debt in the process.
It's pretty clear where we're heading, and it ain't up!
Last edited by Presideo; 01-21-2017 at 02:38 AM.
Active Member
Actions speak louder than words.
I may not be happy about this, but going out and throwing a fit and defenestrating random Starbucks windows is fucking stupid, it's immature, and it's not going to solve any problems
As much as I wanted anyone but him to win.........I just can't help it, I've always been the Devil's Advocate....I'm pretty much the poster boy for it.
Look, if he fucks up then i'll take back everything I said, but so far.....it's just day one.
Again, the Pariah is strong, but....let's just see how it goes...i could be very wrong.
I'm just kinda tired of hearing it,
Just seeing how hopeless you are is making me more depressed then him being president is.
Active Member
Damn, I love how anyone around Trump (or the man himself) does something questionable, and people immidietly jump at their throat, even outdoing a whole drama class a'la meryl streep, then when this guy gets punched, the same people go "yeah, he is a racist, so what ya' gonna do? fucker got that coming!".
Republicans are loud and stupid, while Democrats are insufferable cunts. That's my grand conclusion. Politically, Democrats are much closer to me, but shit like #notmypresident, meryl streep, or "it's okay to hit that guy" would made me second guess my choice big time.
Active Member
Saying we should wait and see what happens sounds like the beginning of a beautifully abusive relationship. "Well, he hit me before, but maybe he won't do it again. Maybe he'll change." Yeah, sorry, but I don't have any interest in being a battered wife in this scenario. Like I said, guys like Trump don't change when all they've done is "win" their whole lives. But hey! It doesn't mean YOU guys can't keep wishing he becomes a different person. Just make sure to get some concealer for those bruises.
Last edited by BRoswell; 01-21-2017 at 03:04 AM.
Throbbing Member
This.
I feel the same about Milo Yabadabadoofuckwitopolis getting told to GTFO by everyone. Last time he spoke unimpeded at at university he dedicated a portion of his speech to stirring up hatred against a trans student of that university for some unknowably prickish reason. I'm not going to be shamed out of the joy I feel whenever he gets sent packing.
Stubby Member
A President receiving hyper-criticism from his detractors? That's never happened before.
You're not going to find many people that sympathize with a racist that has a 4chan meme from 9 years ago pinned to his blazer. I'm more appalled that a camera was shoved in his face than a fist shoved in his face.then when this guy gets punched, the same people go "yeah, he is a racist, so what ya' gonna do? fucker got that coming!".
Fixed. We now have a working Batman script!
Bite me
What's your other choice? Shoot him? Protests won't do shit except reinforce the Right's attitude about "snowflakes" since this protest is just a "we don't like him in case he does something" protest.
Protesting for modifying a WH website, whatever. He's a REPUBLICAN, for fuck's sake.
The FHA fees won't go "up." They were set to go down, but Ben Carson (new HUD guy wtf) said wait a minute.
The popular vote is a moot point, Clinton and the arrogant DNC neglected the Rust Belt and now we are stuck with Mr. Potter and his Corporate friends for 4 years.
Effective activism comes with protesting CONGRESS and making Trump stick to his promise re upholding Social Security and Medicare, replacing the ACA with something truly affordable and better, and making improvements to "The Swamp." Now that he's there, it's important to MAKE HIM DO HIS JOB, like Sanders and Warren have been stressing.
Active Member
But, but, that's real work and demands dedication and a huge attention span ! It actually requires to be interested in politics and stuff, you can't ask the people to do all that work...
Bite me
As a former abused wife, that's a load of fucking shit.Saying we should wait and see what happens sounds like the beginning of a beautifully abusive relationship. "Well, he hit me before, but maybe he won't do it again. Maybe he'll change." Yeah, sorry, but I don't have any interest in being a battered wife in this scenario. Like I said, guys like Trump don't change when all they've done is "win" their whole lives. But hey! It doesn't mean YOU guys can't keep wishing he becomes a different person. Just make sure to get some concealer for those bruises.
We are saying "wait and see" because (1) WE ARE ON DAY ONE, and (2) THE PRESIDENT ISN'T THE MAIN FUCKER WRITING THE LAWS.
The American voters not only voted in (via our legal and 200 plus-yr-old Electoral College system) a Republican President, but they also COMPLETELY GUTTED CONGRESS OF MOST DEMOCRATS. And even OBAMA said he thinks that was on him. The Republicans now have a Supermajority, are confirming every Trump nominee, because they are running Congress, they control our budget, and they pretty much run everything else. But everybody is focused on Bozo and what we can "do" about it, like maybe we can get a divorce. And Bozo made a speech yesterday saying he's not gonna put up with the assholes in Congress, 80% of whom are Republicans. But whining is somehow gonna make it all better.
I've signed at least 15 FUCKING PETITIONS in the last month. I WROTE MY SENATORS. TWICE. About SPECIFIC TOPICS like Medicare and Social Security and the ACA and womens' healthcare. Smashing out the windows of a fucking Starbucks won't help anything.
Last edited by allegro; 01-21-2017 at 06:55 AM.
Active Member
I saw a Trump supporter giving the bird to a whole line of protesters, taking his sweet time to make sure each one of them got the finger, and I thought "even that moron is better and more clever at expressing his thoughts on the current socio-political rift".
Bite me
Meanwhile, it's too difficult to sign petitions and send letters. Showing up at aimless protests is the hip thing to do because you can be on TV and post selfies. The Petitions are documented and require action, but they're no fun.
(And they ask you for money. Gasp, why do these organizations need money when smashing Starbucks windows and whining online is free? I'm out over $250 to activist organizations so far, I guess I shoulda gone for the free Starbucks window plan. My ACLU card won't get me any Facebook hits.)
Last edited by allegro; 01-21-2017 at 06:56 AM.
Active Member
Well the problem with petitions is you can't brag on Facebook that the repressive regime maced you for using your right to #freespeech. And wearing a guy fawkes mask when signing them doesn't have quite the same thrill.
Throbbing Member
In the spirit of the Year Zero narrative part of this thread, one of the perspectives told (probably) from a dissident people went a little like this,
Doesnt matter what side people are on, theyre still people, and when a political figure purposefully antagonizes and churns up anger in swaths of the populace for extended stretches time, well sometimes some of those people decide to make some history of their own, right or wrong, good or bad.
Active Member
I'm pretty sure you're neither making history nor making a point by smashing a Starbucks or punching a dick.
I'm all for protests and action, I sympathize with these people's frustration and anger, but there's nothing constructive here. It's childish, and not even in a fun, creative way.
You want to make history? Make something, do something. Right now all I've seen is hooligans trying to stir shit up and totally failing to shock anyone.
€○●○€
I usually dont get into politics on the internet or especially the ninternet. Its a slippery slope and when reading short bursts of text things can easily get misunderstood. But i have to say how embarrassing yesterday was. You can protest without destroying your own community. I bet half those people didn't even vote. Am I worried about Trump? Yes, big time but I'm also worried that the far left is a few steps away from adopting a sort of, for lack of a better phrase "if I can't have you then no one will" adittude with running the country lately. Innocent people don't deserve to have their property destroyed. And for what exactly? It's not going to change a fucking thing. A lot of us are pissed but ruining other people's shit doesn't get him un-elected. Protest all you want if it helps you, in a non violent/destructive way. Yes we will have to suffer for however long this lasts, but it will end. My guess would be sooner than later.
Administrator
I'm not sure if this is true but yesterday when MSNBC was showing the protesters live, the reporter kept trying to distinguish between those who were protesting and those who were destroying things. He was saying there seemed to be a faction of protestors who had their faces covered and were wearing all black.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Throbbing Member
Sure, you and I agree 100%. This behavior is embarrassing, ridiculous and counterproductive. Unfortunately two people in a forum doesnt stop the mentality thats gaining traction out there. This is Trumps America now, he knows his campaign rhetoric championed this kind of behavior. Now we get to deal with the likeminded people who will actually do the things he verbally praised, let him own this.
Bite me
They referred to themselves as "anarchists," one journalist on CNN said obviously the people didn't want to talk with journalists but somebody did, I don't remember who, and the organized group of masked protesters said they were "anarchists" which is a separate form of protest.
But a woman who was a part of the peaceful protest group said it SCARED her, and she was bringing a large group of women to the Women's March on Washington today and now she is afraid, because these dorks will most assuredly be back and she felt it is dangerous to be around them. There were fires, and police and teargas. Meanwhile, now the Women's March has grown to include so many groups and causes, it has no real single focus. The best petitions and protests and campaigns have one single very specific focus, e.g. "Stop the War in Iraq" or "Legalize Gay Marriage" or "Save Planned Parenthood Funding."
Last edited by allegro; 01-21-2017 at 10:03 AM.
Throbbing Member
Peaceful protests are fine but I hope at every one of these marches there is a register to vote booth. None of this means anything unless the liberals and democrats start to organize and actually have a plan. It is time to quit whining about Trump and time to start doing something to stop him. The first step would be to take away his power in the 2018 mid term election overturn the senate and the congress, the same way the tea party did it to Obama in 2010. Then find a candidate who all the liberals can get behind for the 2020 election.
God is an American
Oh boy an anarchist punched a Nazi on my teevee
better blame the Left
BACKROLLS?!
An asshole got what was coming to him and a window got broken? How awful. Far worse than those people who won't be able to buy homes now and women's rights being threatened.
Active Member
More than one thing can be bad. You can't say that violence against someone is OK because of their beliefs only if you don't agree with them. (Well you CAN because you are, but that's not really my point.) This type of bullshit creates the "us versus them" mentality that needs to go away on all sides.
Active Member
I know many people who traveled to DC to join the women's march, and I feel like you're REALLY dismissive of them. Signing petitions and protesting are not mutually exclusive.
Protest does have results. It sets the tone, and sends a message to lawmakers that certain issues are important to a large chunk of the population.
Back in 2009-10, the Tea Party did a great job of continuously protesting and becoming a movement, at a time when -gasp- the democrats had a supermajority!
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