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Thread: Trump 2017: Year Zero

  1. #2011
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    thanks for the update good to review and clarify history very rocky times in US history that are kind of glossed over civil rights Nixon, Vietnam china, red scare
    -Louie

  2. #2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    It's not a technicality; he wasn't impeached.
    I know he was not formally impeached. "Technicality" was probably not the proper word for what I'm trying to say, but honestly I'm frustratingly at a loss to summon up the right word. Nixon resigned of his own will because he knew he would be forced to resign if he didn't. No one wants to bear the shame of being the first person to ever be fired from a job that has so many contingencies and protections in place that it becomes nearly impossible to be fired.

    It would be satisfying if Trump were the first president ever to be told "you're fired."

  3. #2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinsai View Post
    I know he was not formally impeached. "Technicality" was probably not the proper word for what I'm trying to say, but honestly I'm frustratingly at a loss to summon up the right word. Nixon resigned of his own will because he knew he would be forced to resign if he didn't. No one wants to bear the shame of being the first person to ever be fired from a job that has so many contingencies and protections in place that it becomes nearly impossible to be fired.

    It would be satisfying if Trump were the first president ever to be told "you're fired."
    No, you aren't understanding the impeachment process. You don't just get "fired" for these kinds of charges; YOU GO TO PRISON.

    Nixon asserted his innocence even during his infamous "I am not a Crook" speech.

    But, he was facing IMPRISONMENT if found guilty during the Senate trial. It didn't get to a Senate trial, it didn't even get to the prerequisite House Vote on impeachment.

    He was pardoned of any and all POTENTIAL wrongdoing by President Ford.

    Bill Clinton was impeached, but the Senate committee did not find him guilty of perjury or obstruction of justice (CRIMINAL offenses) so he didn't go to prison and it in effect overruled the impeachment vote of the House, so Clinton served out the remainder of his term. But, Clinton was in fact facing PRISON for perjury and obstruction of justice charges. He did lose his law license, though.

    Many Nixon cabinet members and associates involved in Watergate DID GO TO PRISON.

    See WATERGATE SEVEN.

    The Watergate Seven has two meanings: (1) it refers to the five men caught June 17, 1972 burglarizing the Democratic National Committee’s headquarters in the Watergate Hotel and their two handlers, E. Howard Hunt and G. Gordon Liddy (two Nixon campaign aides), all of whom were tried before Judge John Sirica in January 1973; (2) it refers to the seven advisors and aides to United States President Richard M. Nixon who were indicted by a grand jury on March 1, 1974 for their role in the Watergate scandal. The grand jury also named Nixon an unindicted conspirator. The indictments marked the first time in U.S. history that a president was so named.
    INDICTED. For a CRIME.
    Last edited by allegro; Yesterday at 06:50 PM.

  4. #2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    No, you aren't understanding the impeachment process. You don't just get "fired" for these kinds of charges; YOU GO TO PRISON.
    It was a joke playing on The Apprentice. I thought it depended upon the nature of the impeachable offense. For instance, if the charge was treason, I would assume prison follows. But no, I didn't understand that it was a prerequisite part of the impeachment process.

  5. #2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinsai View Post
    It was a joke playing on The Apprentice. I thought it depended upon the nature of the impeachable offense. For instance, if the charge was treason, I would assume prison follows. But no, I didn't understand that it was a prerequisite part of the impeachment process.
    Grounds for impeachment is a crime committed.

    See this.

    Impeachment in the United States is an enumerated power of the legislature that allows formal charges to be brought against a civil officer of government for crimes alleged to have been committed. Most impeachments have concerned alleged crimes committed while in office, though there have been a few cases in which Congress has impeached and convicted officials partly for prior crimes. The actual trial on such charges, and subsequent removal of an official upon conviction, is separate from the act of impeachment itself. Impeachment proceedings have been initiated against several presidents of the United States. Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton are the only two presidents to have been successfully impeached by the House of Representatives, and both were later acquitted by the Senate. The impeachment process against Richard Nixon was technically unsuccessful, as Nixon resigned his office before the vote of the full House for impeachment, but successful in the broader sense of leading to Nixon's departure. To date, no U.S. President has been removed from office by impeachment and conviction.

    Impeachment is analogous to indictment in regular court proceedings; trial by the other house is analogous to the trial before judge and jury in regular courts. Typically, the lower house of the legislature impeaches the official and the upper house conducts the trial.

  6. #2016
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    you guys are gonna have a stroke.

    just pretend it isn't real. stop looking at it. you will feel better.

  7. #2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by elevenism View Post
    you guys are gonna have a stroke.

    just pretend it isn't real. stop looking at it. you will feel better.
    I'm thinking the opposite. It actually worries me that there have been less protests, and less activity in this thread. I worry that little examples like this are showing b/c beginning to treat all thus as normal, or at least that theyre getting complacent.

  8. #2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobbie solo View Post
    I'm thinking the opposite. It actually worries me that there have been less protests, and less activity in this thread. I worry that little examples like this are showing b/c beginning to treat all thus as normal, or at least that theyre getting complacent.
    I've said it before, but it can't hurt to repeat it, because we need to be aware of it: it's protest fatigue, and it's totally "part of the plan." Steve Bannon is an evil guy, but he's smart and he knows what he's doing.

  9. #2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louie_Cypher View Post
    trump selling out the internet http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...iww8u1mhuayvi& remember this people
    -Louie
    1 - trump didn't do anything yet. It was congress

    2 - these protections didn't even exist yet. Also, similar protections did exist under the FTC but the Net Neutrality push moved ISPs under the FCC due to the common carrier classification. GOP wants it back under FTC.

    3 - people freaking out about this should stop using Google services, Facebook, etc. because it's the exact same thing. Its selling targeted advertising. Yet, all the anti-GOP stuff is falsely telling people "they can sell your search history" and causing the country to panic.

    People believe this bullshit so much that over $200k has been put into various GoFunMe campaigns that promise to buy the Internet history of Congress and make it public. It doesn't work like that! https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...ne-elses.shtml

  10. #2020
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post

    People believe this bullshit so much that over $200k has been put into various GoFunMe campaigns that promise to buy the Internet history of Congress and make it public. It doesn't work like that! https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...ne-elses.shtml
    I think the intent behind the gofundme drive is hopefully scare some GOP congress to get paranoid and believe that this could come around to, at the very least, result in a career-damaging embarrassment and reconsider their decision. Regardless of whether or not the proposal realistically enables that, some of these people aren't so savvy when it comes to internets, so I think the drive might achieve the desired result.

  11. #2021
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    Trump 2017: Year Zero

    Quote Originally Posted by Jinsai View Post
    I think the intent behind the gofundme drive is hopefully scare some GOP congress to get paranoid and believe that this could come around to, at the very least, result in a career-damaging embarrassment and reconsider their decision. Regardless of whether or not the proposal realistically enables that, some of these people aren't so savvy when it comes to internets, so I think the drive might achieve the desired result.
    Totally disagree. That doesn't produce $200k (and rapidly growing) public donations, the endless fearmongering headlines and articles, and shitloads of people suddenly investing in VPNs.

    I'm even seeing people in the tech & privacy industry fall for the bullshit right now. There has been incredibly wrong rhetoric from the beginning on this.

  12. #2022
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    Trump 2017: Year Zero

    Plus, the people behind these campaigns don't strike me as understanding this. The guy who made Cards Against Humanity was making a tweet without any research. It was a "yeah that'd show em!" But he clearly has no idea.

    Read the full article. There are multiple examples of blatant fear mongering and tons of bad advice. You definitely don't give out advice for "protecting" against this if your goal is to play with Congress.
    Last edited by DigitalChaos; Today at 02:47 AM.

  13. #2023
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalChaos View Post
    Plus, the people behind these campaigns don't strike me as understanding this. The guy who made Cards Against Humanity was making a tweet without any research. It was a "yeah that'd show em!" But he clearly has no idea.
    I think the Cards Against Humanity guy felt it was a humorous joke... and since then, it's exploded the way things do in a viral way.

    A lot of people are broadcasting their ignorance, and that contributes to funding. A lot of it is a general "fuck you." A lot of it is misinformed slacktivism. A lot of it is what I'm talking about above. I considered donating for that reason, and from gauging my friends' couched responses to the drive, I know I'm not alone, even if I pretty much try to surround myself with people who I don't think are complete morons, and that might contribute to my own social media echo chamber...

    All the same, maybe I'm ok with surrounding myself excessively and exclusively with people I consider intellectuals, talented artists with a drive and message, and activists with whom I agree with. Given the state of current political discourse, and where I think this is going to go in general, it's a way to stay sane
    Last edited by Jinsai; Today at 04:40 AM.

  14. #2024
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    1. Google and Facebook don't have my Social Security Number (or the contents of my private email); Comcast and AT&T, however, for sure have the former and members of Congress are asserting that the ISPs can sell contents of email (causing this "hysteria").
    https://consumerist.com/2017/03/28/h...l-information/

    " ... the free market will prevent ISPs from going too far in exploiting customer data"
    HAAAAAAAAA HA HA HAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAA Oh you delusional whore.

    2. Google and Facebook have an Opt Out privacy option; Comcast and AT&T allegedly will not.

    3. Why would anyone be afraid of somebody knowing and selling your search history? The supermarket knows your shopping history, Comcast and AT&T know your television habits, and they all sell that info. I refinanced my HELOC last month and I have received no less than TWENTY pieces of mail relating to bullshit mortgage scams because the County Recorder sold my name on a mailing list, and the DMV sells that info too. This is common, but none of it presents the risk of identity theft or is an invasion of privacy. Web search privacy doesn't exist, never has.

    5. These reports (source: members of Congress) indicating the ability to sell your address and SSN and email contents are what's disturbing people. It's not like citizens are jumping to their own made-up conclusions. The hand-wringing is not coming from the public, it's generated by the media and from members of Congress who oppose this action. It is certainly complicated. https://arstechnica.com/information-...o-stop-them/2/

    6. There is a bill that's floated around in the House Ways and Means Committee (introduced by a Republican) relating to the protection of Social Security Numbers. The use of SSNs should have never become so commonplace in the first place; it's nuts. SSNs shouldn't even be allowed online anywhere. Then you are commonly asked for the last 4 digits and those are the holy grail; the first 5 are code and are easy to figure out, the final 4 aren't.

    7. I guess even a VPN won't totally protect your privacy. https://www.google.com/amp/amp.usato...tory/99776682/.

    There's this, though: https://www.letsgetsafe.org

    Oh and in Illinois there's this: http://www.chicagotribune.com/busine...329-story.html
    Last edited by allegro; Today at 10:32 AM.

  15. #2025
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinsai View Post
    I've said it before, but it can't hurt to repeat it, because we need to be aware of it: it's protest fatigue, and it's totally "part of the plan." Steve Bannon is an evil guy, but he's smart and he knows what he's doing.
    Meh even the Freedom Caucus told Bannon to GTFO. SEE THIS.

    There are still protests all the time. You're just not seeing all of them covered by the media or in your info circles. But people are WAY too worked up, now, because they inundate themselves with political news all fucking day. 40 years ago, you maybe read the paper in the morning then watched one news program at night. And there was just as much turmoil, tons of protests, etc, but we didn't have 10 cable news networks and Twitter feeds and Facebook to inundate you with news 24 hours per day. The OVERSATURATION is what is leading to news burnout, anxiety, etc.
    Last edited by allegro; Today at 06:49 AM.

  16. #2026
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinsai View Post
    I think the intent behind the gofundme drive is hopefully scare some GOP congress to get paranoid and believe that this could come around to, at the very least, result in a career-damaging embarrassment and reconsider their decision. Regardless of whether or not the proposal realistically enables that, some of these people aren't so savvy when it comes to internets, so I think the drive might achieve the desired result.
    I think it's important to bring up just so people realize how little privacy they do have in the modern world a friend works in big data and targeted advertising Netflix is constantly working on algorithms to define your viewing habits to sell just wait until they can really scrape mobile data you'll walk down the street and get notifications to buy a hamburger because you're passing a mcD's
    don't want to live in this world no more,
    want to sail away to a distant shore,
    and live like an ape man
    -Louie

  17. #2027
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  18. #2028
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    here's a little of how much xfinity bribed made in political "contributions" for your browsing data
    http://resistancereport.com/class-wa...owser-history/
    -Louie

  19. #2029
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    i think if i was the fed's i would be looking in Ivanka and her husbands direction
    -Louie

  20. #2030
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louie_Cypher View Post
    i think if i was the fed's i would be looking in Ivanka and her husbands direction
    -Louie
    Nah. I think Ivanka is her Dad's security blanket. She's his favorite, according to family. He sometimes actually LISTENS to her. She's a crazed liberal compared to the rest of them. And The Donald has grown to rely on her husband, as well.

    Don is out of his element so he's surrounding himself with people who can figure shit out for him.

    I'm not being ageist, but I think Trump's age isn't helping, either. My Boss is Trump's age and I spend, HONEST TO GOD, the MAJORITY of my time, now, reminding my Boss of details, deadlines, pretty much EVERYTHING, and I'm constantly covering his ass because he now has the attention span of a rat and can no longer juggle multiple transactions. I started working for him 7 years ago, and it's been a steady decline in mental agility.

    My Boss also doesn't read entire emails; he'll read the first sentence and that's it. So he constantly looks like a dumbass, "how much is the purchase price in this transaction?" (me: Dude, read the client's email, it's IN the email.)

    Trump allegedly doesn't read much of anything, either. This is why he only watches cable news shows. That's why he gets so much shit so totally wrong.

    I suspect that Ivanka's job will be explaining shit to Dad, maybe with a PowerPoint presentation with bullet points.

    I seriously doubt that Trump is a "mastermind" of any of this Russia shit; I think he's just viewed as a flunky puppet who's too stupid to know that he's being manipulated.

    Last edited by allegro; Today at 12:32 PM.

  21. #2031
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    I wouldn't consider it ageist to say that we don't want an elderly megalomaniac who is genetically predisposed to dementia to be president, especially when he is the oldest person to ever be elected... it falls in line with the billion other issues when you see troubling evidence of senility.

    If Trump actually read stuff, he'd know how insane the words coming out of his mouth sound on paper:




  22. #2032
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    I dunno why he keeps referring to Wharton as if it's fucking MIT.

    It's not.

    Forbes doesn't even rank it in the Top 5 (it's their #7).

  23. #2033
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    Meanwhile, really, this is all pretty true and hilarious.

    I SINCERELY doubt that the guy has ever read the Bible. Seriously who the fuck has read the entire bible like it's epic fiction? The guy can't read a memo, I'll bet that he has never read the Bible. I doubt he's cracked open the Bible. I bet the closest he's gotten to a Bible is moving it around on a table.


  24. #2034
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    watching the intelligence committee on you tube on a former project I actually had dinner with Clinton watts I found him very intelligent and able to view "big picture" ideas and concepts and not "quick fix" solutions, understanding the idea of not changing a vote but influencing the vote
    -Louie

  25. #2035
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louie_Cypher View Post
    understanding the idea of not changing a vote but influencing the vote
    There's been accepted psychology about voting behavior for a long long time.

    The law, however, does not put much stock in "voting influence."

    The law does, however, put a lot of stock in another country ATTEMPTING to interfere with the voting process (even though our country does it in other countries all the time); the question isn't about the actual vote, but the MOTIVE behind those trying to influence the vote; power and money for personal gain, etc.

    The Citizens United SCOTUS decision pretty much sums up the inability to influence or buy votes. See this, for instance.

    Let’s just look at how much the big money interests were able to buy our elections this time around. In the Democratic primaries, the two main candidates were pretty evenly matched in terms of money and votes. Through June, when the primary contest was over, Federal Election Commission documents show that Hillary Clinton outraised Bernie Sanders by $274 million to $235 million. Tracking spending by outside groups is more difficult, but the Center for Responsive Politics gives Clinton the clear advantage here: through June 2016, outside groups spent $84 million to support her campaign—139 times what they spent on Sanders.

    Maybe money can buy votes in a Democratic primary, at least when the party apparatus is also on your side. But the Republican primaries were a different story. Again, there is not a huge disparity in direct contributions. Through June, Donald Trump raised $91 million, Ted Cruz had $92 million, Ben Carson raised $64 million, Marco Rubio had $46 million, and Jeb Bush $35 million. But again, the outside money—the spending anti-Citizens United people hate the most—tells a different story. Through June 2016, Bush had $121 million spent on his behalf, far more than any other candidate, despite his departure from the race in February. Cruz, Rubio, and Trump all had about half as much outside help, yet they all outperformed Bush.

    Take that measurement back to February, Bush’s last month in the race, and it makes the difference even starker. On February 20, CRP listed $118 million in outside money raised for Bush, compared with $42 million for Cruz, $31 million for Rubio, and less than $2 million for Trump. Lefties would tell us that this made Bush’s candidacy a slam dunk, but by the end of that month, Bush had three convention delegates for his $153 million in total funds raised. Trump had 82.
    Ignoring the huge demographic shift, where Union members voted for a friggin' Republican (in a HISTORY of Union members always voting for Democrats) is just not gonna move the Democratic party forward.
    Last edited by allegro; Today at 12:25 PM.

  26. #2036
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    allegro i always find your posts well thought out, well put and educational and informative two things i greatly admire, i think, or at least hope we are beginning to understand the term "hack", it no longer means breaking into computers, I try more now to define it, gaining access to information and using that information to ones personal gain, without getting into tldr: territory, the more we understand things the better we are able to defend them just my .02
    -Louie

  27. #2037
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    Quote Originally Posted by allegro View Post
    Meanwhile, really, this is all pretty true and hilarious.

    I SINCERELY doubt that the guy has ever read the Bible. Seriously who the fuck has read the entire bible like it's epic fiction? The guy can't read a memo, I'll bet that he has never read the Bible. I doubt he's cracked open the Bible. I bet the closest he's gotten to a Bible is moving i saw this as is and old physiological power move to show you are in control, I read something that stated when going into a conference room slightly rearrange the chair leaving yours for last just before you sit down, I've, never tried this, but do find it interesting
    -Louie

    i saw this as is an old physiological power move to show you are in control, I read something that stated when going into a conference room slightly rearrange the chair leaving yours for last just before you sit down, I've, never tried this, but do find it interesting
    -Louie
    Last edited by Louie_Cypher; Today at 01:26 PM. Reason: i got issues

  28. #2038
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    Oh man. I love Bush's character now that he's not POTUS. Though, it wouldn't have the same hilarity if he weren't a former POTUS.


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