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Thread: Alien: Covenant

  1. #211
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    Oh shit, does this mean that Disney will create animated version of Alien with princess aliens? I don't think that's a good idea.

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by thevoid99 View Post
    Oh shit, does this mean that Disney will create animated version of Alien with princess aliens? I don't think that's a good idea.
    Yeah but the unicorns bleed dark matter.

  3. #213
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    Is there a separate thread for the Alien franchise? Wanted to make sure before I started one for it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Self.Destructive.Pattern View Post
    Is there a separate thread for the Alien franchise? Wanted to make sure before I started one for it.
    I don't think so. I can only see threads for Covenant, Prometheus, the (sadly) defunct Neill Blomkamp Aliens sequel, and the video games Alien: Colonial Marines and Alien: Isolation. Have you got some news on the next movie?

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonic_discord View Post
    I don't think so. I can only see threads for Covenant, Prometheus, the (sadly) defunct Neill Blomkamp Aliens sequel, and the video games Alien: Colonial Marines and Alien: Isolation. Have you got some news on the next movie?
    Yeaa, that was all I found as well. Was hoping I was missing something. No new news, I recently watched the first Alien movie from front to back for the first time in years and I wanted to properly comment on it.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Self.Destructive.Pattern View Post
    Yeaa, that was all I found as well. Was hoping I was missing something. No new news, I recently watched the first Alien movie from front to back for the first time in years and I wanted to properly comment on it.
    I think this is as good a place as any, given the lack of a catch-all Alien thread (unless you feel like creating one). Let's hear your thoughts on Alien!

  7. #217
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    Why not make this thread the catch all Alien franchise thread?

    But yeah, ramble on! I'm soon writing a piece on Alien and the sexual connotations in it for a little Sci Fi Festival over here. Guess there will also be a keynote which I'll hold. Phew... excited.

  8. #218
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    I think whatever comes after Alien: Covenant should not be a movie but a 10-episode Netflix series

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by aggroculture View Post
    I think whatever comes after Alien: Covenant should not be a movie but a 10-episode Netflix series
    This is probably the only way to resurrect the franchise into something worthwhile.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mfte View Post
    This is probably the only way to resurrect the franchise into something worthwhile.
    Perhaps, but Disney owns it now, so it'll probably be a musical or something and Ripley will be the new princess.


  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by katara View Post
    Perhaps, but Disney owns it now, so it'll probably be a musical or something and Ripley will be the new princess.
    you say that like it's a bad thing. i'd watch the fuck out of that movie.

  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlb View Post
    Why not make this thread the catch all Alien franchise thread?

    But yeah, ramble on! I'm soon writing a piece on Alien and the sexual connotations in it for a little Sci Fi Festival over here. Guess there will also be a keynote which I'll hold. Phew... excited.
    Yeaa, was going to make a separate thread, but changing the title of this thread should suffice if possible so it isn't misleading.

    After 20 years, I decided to watch this from beginning to end along with the rest of the trilogy. Unfortunately when I was younger, they spoon fed Resurrection all over the place so that was burned into my brain for so long when I would think about the franchise as a whole. Man... I cannot believe I went this long without watching these movies for so, so long. The opening credits alone made me feel like I was enclosed or even right there on the Nostromo myself when the camera starts stationary on a wall and slowly moves us along through the corridors of the ship. I happened to watch the DC this time around really enjoyed it. I need to go back to the theatrical release and watch this again since every Alien fan I ask says I should start with those and then the DC cuts for both films... how does everyone else feel about these versions compared to each other?? To add, the dinner scene when Kane (Holy shit look at John Hurt) was so freaking cringe knowing a little Xenomorph baby is just chilling in there waiting to burst out... fuck, that scene had me going man.

    Of course the film suffers from the conventional "We need to check this beacon from a remote planet we know absolutely nothing about...we have to follow protocol." but this is a flaw that can easily be ignored from what follows. I forgot on how much we do not see the Xenomorph and it was done so effectively with the technology they had back in 79' with the practical effects looking silly at some points, but still holds up in many other ways as far as classic films are concerned; the inspiration that followed them which in my opinion gives you much more respect for them in their entirety. Being reacquainted with this film as opened my eyes to all of the other horror or sci-fi films that have come out years after this which I was already very aware of; it has helped me put a little bit more perspective on why and how certain movies do what they do now.

    My problem with this franchise was how I approached it. I have seen every film, but not in order at all. I watched the first two when I was about 10, and then caught the rest either on television (This hurts to say) or in the background somewhere at a relatives house. Now, with seeing the first film again... comparing this to Prometheus and even Covenant, it makes so much more sense as to why there was so much backlash from Prometheus. I read that the ship from Pro is not the same ship from Alien, but a "Brother" ship even though there are so many things externally of the ships that say otherwise but who knows. When I have some more time I will do some extensive research on how these all add up together. Even playing Alien: Isolation had me guessing at times... not anymore I suppose and it makes me love the game even more now (Those face huggers can go fuck themselves though.)

    I am about to start Aliens and then hit 3 by the weekend. Everywhere it says that Ripley is the sole survivor of the Nostromo... nah, it is two! Team Jonesy y'all.
    Last edited by Self.Destructive.Pattern; 02-21-2018 at 09:41 PM.

  13. #223
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    I loved this film, even though it has holes you could fly a spaceship through.

    I'd rather have something a bit weird and creepy than yet another retread. I view the Prometheus/covenant timeline as like an alternate universe to the alien trilogy (that's right, trilogy. Resurrection was sub fanfic crap with a bizarrely good pedigree)

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    I loved this film, even though it has holes you could fly a spaceship through.

    I'd rather have something a bit weird and creepy than yet another retread. I view the Prometheus/covenant timeline as like an alternate universe to the alien trilogy (that's right, trilogy. Resurrection was sub fanfic crap with a bizarrely good pedigree)
    It's funny with the Alien 3 vs Resurrection debate I have been reading lately after finishing Alien 3 earlier today. I see a lot of fans saying they enjoy Resurrection over Alien 3, and I really do not understand the universal hate for A3. It was a shame that Fincher couldn't put his full vision into this film due to a gigantic mess before production even began with over 12 to 13 different writers pitching storyboards to fox. Not only that, but with Sigourney Weaver being nominated for Aliens, she had much more leeway with what she wanted and didn't want in the film so that she could sign up for the film to begin with with not wanting guns in the film, and even her wanting a sexual encounter with a Xenomorph (Weird). I watched the assembly version and it is far superior to the theatrical release, but doesn't elevate the film all that much. It is just a so-so movie to me; a mixed bag, but I still enjoyed it, and could never compare to the atrocity that is Resurrection. That basketball scene....ugh.

    Also with A3, I was very disappointed to find out how they treated Hicks and Newt. I am very very curious how the script for a Hicks and Bishop story line killing breeding Xenomorphs would have turned out in the end instead of what we got. But how the hell did that Egg get on the E.E.V??? Bishop? This had me a bit confused in the end and I remember Bishop being interested in the species but that never really went anywhere. Ugh... this franchise has so much more potential, yet they keep fucking it up with crap like Covenant.

  15. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by Self.Destructive.Pattern View Post
    It's funny with the Alien 3 vs Resurrection debate I have been reading lately after finishing Alien 3 earlier today. I see a lot of fans saying they enjoy Resurrection over Alien 3, and I really do not understand the universal hate for A3. It was a shame that Fincher couldn't put his full vision into this film due to a gigantic mess before production even began with over 12 to 13 different writers pitching storyboards to fox. Not only that, but with Sigourney Weaver being nominated for Aliens, she had much more leeway with what she wanted and didn't want in the film so that she could sign up for the film to begin with with not wanting guns in the film, and even her wanting a sexual encounter with a Xenomorph (Weird). I watched the assembly version and it is far superior to the theatrical release, but doesn't elevate the film all that much. It is just a so-so movie to me; a mixed bag, but I still enjoyed it, and could never compare to the atrocity that is Resurrection. That basketball scene....ugh.

    Also with A3, I was very disappointed to find out how they treated Hicks and Newt. I am very very curious how the script for a Hicks and Bishop story line killing breeding Xenomorphs would have turned out in the end instead of what we got. But how the hell did that Egg get on the E.E.V??? Bishop? This had me a bit confused in the end and I remember Bishop being interested in the species but that never really went anywhere. Ugh... this franchise has so much more potential, yet they keep fucking it up with crap like Covenant.
    I love Alien 3, especially the Assembly Cut. It is my favorite Alien film and I actually liked what they did to Newt and Hicks. It is also my girl's favorite Alien film. Resurrection is atrocious and I like to pretend Alien was a trilogy that ended with the amazing ending of Alien 3. Alien, Aliens: Director's Cut, Alien 3: Assembly Cut is probably one of the greatest movie trilogies ever.

  16. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Self.Destructive.Pattern View Post
    It's funny with the Alien 3 vs Resurrection debate I have been reading lately after finishing Alien 3 earlier today. I see a lot of fans saying they enjoy Resurrection over Alien 3, and I really do not understand the universal hate for A3. It was a shame that Fincher couldn't put his full vision into this film due to a gigantic mess before production even began with over 12 to 13 different writers pitching storyboards to fox. Not only that, but with Sigourney Weaver being nominated for Aliens, she had much more leeway with what she wanted and didn't want in the film so that she could sign up for the film to begin with with not wanting guns in the film, and even her wanting a sexual encounter with a Xenomorph (Weird). I watched the assembly version and it is far superior to the theatrical release, but doesn't elevate the film all that much. It is just a so-so movie to me; a mixed bag, but I still enjoyed it, and could never compare to the atrocity that is Resurrection. That basketball scene....ugh.

    Also with A3, I was very disappointed to find out how they treated Hicks and Newt. I am very very curious how the script for a Hicks and Bishop story line killing breeding Xenomorphs would have turned out in the end instead of what we got. But how the hell did that Egg get on the E.E.V??? Bishop? This had me a bit confused in the end and I remember Bishop being interested in the species but that never really went anywhere. Ugh... this franchise has so much more potential, yet they keep fucking it up with crap like Covenant.
    I totally understand the disappointment with covenant, but for me the original alien trilogy concept is not only dead, but spent - quite happy to have an offbeat cronenberg-esque thriller like a:c over tired stuff like res and the avp films (which imo totally miss the point by prizing action and theatrical verve over atmosphere and body horror).

    As for why people increasingly prefer res to 3... sorry, but im done being a diplomat. It's because they're dumb ass kids (temporally or mentally).

    I can understand the disappointment with 3, as it binned the progression of the first two and was basically a retread of the first. But it has the edge on res by virtue of its filthy, depressing, 2000 ad esque universe. The setting feels as real as the worlds depicted in clockwork Orange or blade runner, whereas res feels like the borderline fantasy setting of total recall or starship troopers. A cool aesthetic - but not in any way like the used future, depressingly plausible world of the first 3 movies

    For this reason, I liked Prometheus and covenant. Some utter Bollocks writing aside, I don't feel like I'm watching the fifth element or space truckers. I resent this idea that all there is to the alien universe is faux, lurid comic book grittiness. If the characters have funny haircuts, punky nicknames etc then mission accomplished - no. It's a delicate balance, I admit. But I know it when I see it

  17. #227
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    @Sutekh
    I love how Alien 3 decided to not go bigger than Aliens, but instead returned to its roots. The setting feels almost claustrophobic as I imagine being stuck in a prison would be. I thought 3 did an amazing job at feeling that isolation. I liked that it went back to being more Ripley going 1 on 1 with the xenomorph. These aren't trained soldiers, but ordinary people... well rapists, murderers, criminals, etc. These folks have no weapons, just their surroundings. The way it opens up with major characters dying in their sleep without the ability to do anything to stop it sets up how absolutely no one is safe anywhere as long as these creatures still exist. Newt's death is even more poignant when you watch the scene from Aliens between her and Ripley when she is too afraid to fall asleep. With the Assembly Cut, you are invested in these characters because they are are fleshed out where as the theatrical cut out a lot of character development. I feel much more connected to Ripley in 3. This time it is personal.

  18. #228
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    It's a flawed film with a savage beauty at its core, the oppressive industrial setting & dreadful characters, the hopeless feel and strangely downbeat/upbeat ending. The score is great too. History will be kind to it, I'm sure. I feel like one of the few people that doesn't mourn the loss of that weird wooden planet/monks initial concept. One of the weird things about the internet was finding out people hated it

  19. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by neorev View Post
    I love Alien 3, especially the Assembly Cut. It is my favorite Alien film and I actually liked what they did to Newt and Hicks. It is also my girl's favorite Alien film. Resurrection is atrocious and I like to pretend Alien was a trilogy that ended with the amazing ending of Alien 3. Alien, Aliens: Director's Cut, Alien 3: Assembly Cut is probably one of the greatest movie trilogies ever.
    Yea, at this point after watching all of the films over again I can comfortably say it is a trilogy. My favorite I would have to say is Aliens: DC and it is because of it's characters that support the film and the stakes being highly raised, even though I enjoyed the no weapons aspect of A3. There is just something about it that clicked for me and has one of the best iconic lines ever in film. There is a little something I like from all three films and that alone makes it a strong ass trilogy for me. So glad I watched them all over again after all of these years. The isolated, claustrophobic feel these films have I absolutely love, and Alien 3 did this very well as far as that aspect goes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh
    I totally understand the disappointment with covenant, but for me the original alien trilogy concept is not only dead, but spent - quite happy to have an offbeat cronenberg-esque thriller like a:c over tired stuff like res and the avp films (which imo totally miss the point by prizing action and theatrical verve over atmosphere and body horror).


    I totally agree with the concept the Alien trilogy brought to the table, but with these new films, I want to see an Alien film where the crew, or supporting cast are not a bunch of bumbling morons for once. There were a lot of aspects about Covenant I did enjoy like the scenery which is fucking beautiful to watch, but I was really hoping we would have had a bit of a continuation from where Shaw left off and see a bit more engagement with the Engineers planet instead of seeing them completely wiped out with yet ANTOHER android wanting to do something diabolical. Fassbender carried that movie, but that flute scene had me cracking up for all the wrong reasons, along with a cliche shower scene. I could digress from those minor nitpicks, but as a whole the movie has me rolling me eyes more than widening them.

    I enjoyed Prometheus a lot more for some reason than Covenant even thought they share pretty much the same problems. Being introduced to the engineers, seeing another ship with them in it since we had no idea about anything in Alien when they ran into the fossilized engineer had me really intrigued and kept me going. Is there anything else out there as far as comics or anything canon related??
    Last edited by Self.Destructive.Pattern; 02-27-2018 at 09:52 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Self.Destructive.Pattern View Post
    Cries inside. Covenant was so disappointing for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodiak33 View Post
    Cries inside. Covenant was so disappointing for me.
    Yes. A total waste of an opportunity. The original prologue would have framed the movie in a much more interesting light.
    Anyone who thinks this movie is good is a Trump supporter.

  23. #233
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    Here in Canada, The Movie Network is premiering Covenant tonight and someone who works in the programing dep there thought it would be a good idea to show Alien and Aliens before Covenant.

    It is a great idea: any self respecting movie aficionado will gladly devote 4-5 hours of their life watching those two movies. The question is: did this unknown person genuinely wanted to give fans a treat by showing Covenant after these two or did they want fans to see how bad Covenant is compared to those classics?

    Anyway, I have a night of facehuggers and xenomorphs ahead of me. And sweet moments with Private Hudson. RIP Bill Paxton; you are sorely missed.

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    It still bugs me that the main plot point surrounding David and Walter was shamelessly ripped from a Star Trek: The Next Generation episode (Datalore). It is the exact same thing.

    Also, why are aliens now birthed after only 10 minutes as fully formed 'mini-me's and can be controlled with home-made whistles?

    The creature design in Prometheus was so freaking awesome. Hammerpede, Trilobite, Deacon. They could've gone really wild with it and made something incredible, but instead they played it safe and brought back the old Xenomorph that really isn't scary anymore. Don't get me wrong, Giger's Alien is awesome, but Prometheus promised something new after the Xeno became stale after 35+ years. Something similar to Blomkamp's creature in Zygote is where I thought this would go.

    Covenant, like Prometheus, was edited to shit (check out the deleted Engineer scenes in the latter! holy crap). We're never introduced to the characters and as a result, it doesn't matter that they're expendable. There are some great concepts that are only touched upon and then thrown away almost immediately. The whole notion of using Shaw's mutated womb to become the first Egg is utterly monstrous but it's only vaguely hinted at in the film. The end result is a movie that's just a retread of stuff we've seen before with a new coat of paint. If it had been 45 minutes longer, it would have been much more fleshed out. I'm unsure how much of this is Ridley's fault and how much of it is the studio forcing him to make something digestible for the masses.

    Just stupid.

    I feel that the only new thing we saw here was the backburster. That made my hackles rise for sure. The rest of it, not so much.
    Last edited by katara; 03-18-2018 at 08:17 AM.

  25. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by katara View Post
    ...the old Xenomorph that really isn't scary anymore. Don't get me wrong, Giger's Alien is awesome, but Prometheus promised something new after the Xeno became stale after 35+ years.
    Alien Isolation is proof that there's still plenty of scare-factor in the alien, it just needs to be done properly. You can make a chihuahua scary if directed like Ridley managed in 1979, and make a walking ebola virus mundane if directed like Ridley managed in 2017. Giger's giant biomechanical penis with teeth does at least have the advantage of being a lot closer to the ebola end of the innate scare-factor scale, and most films in the series (including Covenant) have actually done a bad job of recapturing the otherworldly menace of that original design. They always tweak it, and with the possible exception of Alien 3 the changes are always detrimental.

    Isolation is more a triumph of execution and worldbuilding rather than original storytelling, but there's plenty of material in the novels, Dark Horse comics and even the AvP2 game that could inspire a good, fresh film.
    Last edited by Vertigo; 03-18-2018 at 09:04 AM.

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    All I want to know is who the Space Jockey was, how he ended up on LV-426 in an Engineer spaceship full of facehugger eggs, how the Company knew about it (and sent Ash with the Nostromo to get a xenomorph back to them).

    Is it too much to ask?

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    Quote Originally Posted by marodi View Post
    All I want to know is who the Space Jockey was, how he ended up on LV-426 in an Engineer spaceship full of facehugger eggs, how the Company knew about it (and sent Ash with the Nostromo to get a xenomorph back to them).

    Is it too much to ask?
    inb4 the Space Jockey in Alien 1979 is actually David. And *he* sent the signal to the Company.

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    Well @marodi , don't worry, Ridley's got you. Spoiler: The Space Jockey is an nine-foot Homo sapien with no melanin in a skeleton-shaped suit, who decided to drop a biological WMD on Earth for killing Jesus, who was actually one of them. The weapon was originally going to be a bunch of black goo, but 2100 years later an android turned evil and created the xenomorph, so presumably the Jockey decided this was a better weapon and packed up some eggs instead, only to fall afoul of his cargo and crash land on LV426.

    Does leave the holes of why Weyland-Yutani looked for the Jockey/Engineer's ship instead of David's planet to get hold of the xenomorph (David had apparently been sending transmissions back to WY in some versions of the script), who this Engineer was, and how he got hold of the eggs. Also why he's so vastly shorter than Alien's Space Jockey, but this has already been explained as a retcon.

    Personally, I'd just rather pretend these two movies never existed, or have nothing to do with Alien.

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    watched this for the first time last night, lot wrong, i think Scott, need to pass this to someone younger. like blumenkamp. storytelling is all over the place. I think one it tries to be a sequel to Prometheus,which only muddies the story further. we lean nothing more about the engineers. Other than when a new ship arrives the all stop what they are doing and all huddle up for a look see. we learned nothing of the black goo. other than David had been mucking about with for what a decade and using it as a genetic erector set. I think Scott. got confused if he was making an Alien or blade runner movie. could have used more editing. trying to put elements of the first movie in. such as the distress call. running down corridors and incubating aliens. but there's never any real threat or motivation for the crew David or Wayland industries. so the movies end up being people run around shit blows up and shit bursts out of people. I thing up until now the franchise has been a question. what do they want what are they capable of what does Wayland, already know and want with the species. my .02
    -Louie

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    So I've been watching Star Trek TNG recently and already made mention in this thread that the David/Walter switcheroo is basically identical to the episode Datalore.

    Here's something else. In Season 6, episode Chain of Command Pt 1, the concept of 'metagenic weapons' is brought up. Here's a transcript:

    "They're genetically engineered viruses that are designed to destroy entire ecosystems. When metagenic toxins are released into a planet's atmosphere, they immediately begin to mutate. They seek out and destroy all forms of DNA they encounter. In a few days, everything is dead. In a month, the metagenic agent itself breaks down and dissipates completely, leaving every city, every road, every piece of equipment perfectly intact."

    Sound familiar?

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