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Thread: Marilyn Manson

  1. #811
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    I never bought into the image of Manson. Always felt it took away from the music. ACSS could have been just as good if he was another "industrial" band wearing black t shirts onstage. What I dig about HEOL is what a lot of people seem to hate. The experimenting. I know a lot of goth type girls who still worship their dear Manson..ACSS is their bible...and they HATE songs like 'four rusted horses' and 'unkillable monster'...i think those songs are fucking brilliant...I much prefer Manson the artist who experiments and not Manson the hot topic poser trying to appease his goth fans who cant leave 1996 behind...HEOL is good if you want experimental bluesy Manson....If you want a pale attempt at HolyWood Part 2 then try Born Villain..see how that works out lol

  2. #812
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    From THEOL, I like "Four Rusted Horses," "15" and "I Have To Look Up Just To See Hell" which is one more song than I like off of BV ("Overneath The Path of Misery" and "The Flowers of Evil") and none from TPE, which I ended up hating more than EMDM ("Putting Holes In Happiness"). I didn't think such a thing was possible as EMDM is fucking abysmal but TPE is just so boring, so utterly ineffective and derivative. At least he was trying and failing at something different with EMDM.

    It's just sad. He really hasn't made a halfway decent album since TGAOG with Holywood being the last truly good one. I haven't heard much from HUD and what I have heard is awful.

  3. #813
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    lmfao I sincerely hope nobody who actually knows me on these forums honestly took that "if you don't like it I think you're dumb" remark seriously. Jesus flipping christ, I'm shamelessly defending Manson's most reviled album as one of my favorites; who's the real idiot here. I'm not repentant.

    I'm with @Helpmeiaminhell though: THEOL is easily his most interesting album since MA. Holywood is basically ACSS Pt. II, so it's a "safe" record to me, just like Trent regards With_Teeth. EMDM is his worst, by far. Born Villain is average and kind of toothless. Pale Emperor is a big step in the right direction and thus, a keeper.

    Always a surprise to see TGAOG get crapped on though; that's like a quintessential Manson record to me. If the guy has an "avant garde" album in his oeuvre, that's the one. Especially when you factor in that weird af performance piece movie that came with some copies..

    That was also the album tour that spawned this forever-hilarious Manson live moment:



    Literally piss myself every time I watch that shit..

  4. #814
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    One issue I had with GAOG was he totally jacked the "Be Aggressive" Faith No More cheerleader chorus for "Mobscene' and never even gave them any credit...GAOG isnt terrible (like EMDM) it just seemed to be more of a party record, esp the 1st half of the record where every song sounded like he was trying for another Fight Song MTV hit single

  5. #815
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prettybrokenspiral View Post
    lmfao I sincerely hope nobody who actually knows me on these forums honestly took that "if you don't like it I think you're dumb" remark seriously. Jesus flipping christ, I'm shamelessly defending Manson's most reviled album as one of my favorites; who's the real idiot here. I'm not repentant.
    ah, the classic, "i'm not retarded, I'm just pretending to be, jokes on you!" i guess I just don't hang around here enough to pick up on the subtle nuances of your personality. fuck me, right. One of the biggest MM fans I know LOVES Born Villain and thinks it his best album, so anything's possible.

  6. #816
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sesquipedalism View Post
    I wish I had more time to articulate my point, but I'm just chiming in to say that, in my opinion, Eat Me, Drink Me is by yards the best thing Manson released after Mechanical Animals until Pale Emperor (I know I'm even more in the minority here, but I feel Holywood is twice as long as it needs to be and the stuff that should have been trimmed really hurts the LP's overall quality) and I might actually prefer Eat Me to Emperor, based solely on relative lyrical coherence when you compare the two. I'll never understand the hate Eat Me gets. And Tim Skold's solos are some of the most fun guitar has ever been on a Manson record (some coming close to the transcendence of "Fundamentally Loathsome"). It seems weird to me that "Of course I hate Eat Me, Drink Me more, but..." is one of the truly safe things to say here.

    That said, this album is terrible. This is the first time I feel like I'd be tempted to turn off a Manson album out of embarrassment if someone caught me listening to it—although "Pretty as a Swastika" was fucking moronic in its attempted edginess then bullshit ex-post facto Riefenstahl justification, the tune itself sounded badass so long as you ignored that line and focused on the burning musicality and awesome, raw shrieks of "let me show you where it hurts." On Upside Down, even his puns are now incoherent and lazy. That's like his stock and trade these days—and he's half-assing his turns of phrase? If Cocaine and Abel is the best you can muster, maybe delay the release a whole year instead of just six or so months. "I'm unstable. I'm not a show horse. I can't be bridled, of course"? And if I had to guess, the vocal affectation put on "of course" is totally a nod to the theme song of Mr. Ed. I am, unfortunately not kidding in this supposition.

    After listening to this LP, I seriously wondered if the really real reason for the delay was that no profit-seeking entity would put it out. Like someone at some stage of the process said, "Dude, improve it, or we won't cooperate with your release plans."

    And man, am I SO not convinced by his roughneck, "I'll beat you up or maybe shoot you" shtick. I can think of musicians for whom it would work. Most have served prison time, most have (semi-)verified gangland ties. Most have histories that can be plausibly told or emended to prominently feature physical violence. Marilyn Manson is not one of these musicians. I remember when I was 16, we were both 120-pound weaklings, and I felt inspired by him for his ferocity which was pointedly in spite of that fact. His...ironic braggadocio and self-destructive, reckless aggression was supposed to read as dangerous to two things: the established order and himself.

    Something about seeing the very visible ribs of a scarred and starved long-haired dude in chaps and eyeliner screaming about how he'd destroy the world felt...familiar to those of us who had that kind of rage, but were also trapped inside of lives and bodies that wouldn't allow us to "fight back" in the traditional sense. That juxtaposition was what made it interesting. His right-hand-man was a made up dude in a baby-doll dress. He was the scrawny, gender non-conforming wormboy with no balls who would one day avenge his abuse and end the unjust world—that's what a lot of us felt like or wanted very much to feel like.

    I know the seeds of this sort of more traditional violence have always been an element of the performance, but I think he forgot he's not actually a hard-ass. He's the kind of guy who gets sucker punched at a Denny's and then spends time miraculously not getting the shit kicked out of him by an interviewer whom he ambushes with a capgun and flicks in the balls—his ass not kicked by virtue of his fame and that poor bastard's tenuous job security. I assume you still get fired for punching someone you're supposed to be interviewing, no matter how much he or she deserves it. Regardless, I don't think any amount of gun talk, invitations to wrestle, silver grills, or videos of you shooting pistols in the dangerously dumb John Woo side-tilted style will make us suddenly think: "Marilyn Manson is someone of whom I am and should be physically and martially afraid."

    In "Snake-Eyes & Sissies," he took a position as an indictment of that position—think Trent Reznor and "God Given." Anyone think that if Manson sang "Sissies" now he would remember that breaking someone's teeth out with a wrench was ever supposed to be something other than cool as fuck? I somehow doubt it. These days, it's about how you look pretty when you cry" and how "I don't want to hit you" but I will...blah, blah. I've never been sure if "Pistol Whipped" was 1) A poorly executed romanticization of extreme BDSM meant to succeed on the back of the Fifty Shades phenomenon; 2) A callback to the "Sissies"-era about the idiocy of romanticizing domestic abuse done deliberately poorly so we'd understand it's farcical; 3) A chaser for that "Running to the Edge of the World" video where he beat the shit out of a stand-in for his ex-girlfriend and here he's admitting that he gets off on hitting women, but also kind of wants to be punished for it. But I digress.

    With that in mind and back to Heaven: Bloody noses are like roses? I love the sound of shells hitting the ground? He claims recently not to understand why shitty rappers started loving him—he's an inch away from smacking his bitch and busting a cap in your ass. He's closer to 1993 gangsta rap than most 2017 rappers are. And again: I don't think he remembers that the whole point of him was satire. He was our culture's shit and we should be ashamed of what we've eaten? He put it in liner notes more than once and on a few tee shirts, too. Maybe it's all those bees in his nose—which actually IS a kind of cool line.

    Not that artists aren't allowed to evolve or even change their minds completely. It's an important part of human existence and art itself. "Flip-flopping" is not inherently bad. But in the case of intellectual and performative satirists specifically, I think it's probably a sign of respect for one's audience (and decent business practice) to stop at some point and say "Remember when I used to represent the weakling who got a metal lunchbox and fought back the unthinking bully? When I pretended to be a shit-caked redneck asking 'Who said date rape isn't kind?' just so that you would justifiably respond with 'Well, it isn't, and you're a shit-caked monster for thinking otherwise?' Remember when I sang about how fucking nuts it was that people in this country love guns so much that they could serve in songs as stand-ins for lovers, babies, and even deities? Okay, well, now when I sing about weaklings, it's about kicking their ass for not standing up for themselves or for being "haters" standing up to me; if I'm singing about smacking women or anything like that, it's because I discovered I need to be the Alpha animal and want you to know that I'm the Dominant/Sadist in my sexual relationships which are all 1990s eXXXtreme; and if I'm singing about guns it's because guns are powerful and cool and I have guns and I could kill you with guns and maybe I should. So now you understand—all the meanings shifted. Please sing along accordingly."

    Would've been a nice memo to get. Rather than years of hints that Mr. Manson was maybe slowly infected by, uh, Ted Nugent's brain spores?

    Or maybe he's really, really, really into the long game. And in 2024 we'll get that long awaited acoustic LP, For Twenty Years I Was Your Shit and We Were All Ashamed of What You'd Eaten, and the accompanying ethnological treatise in that finally clears everything up and proves he's been doing more than just chugging midmorning tumblers of vodka which, yes, I guess he does regularly now. Every time a new album comes out and I fork over my ten bucks (which I still will do upon actual release, despite deriding this thing), this is the thing I secretly hope for.


    Bonus criticism: On first and second passes, the last two tracks make me think of a twelfth grader writing lyrics for Bon Jovi, who's just recently purchased a vocoder and decided to start a Marilyn Manson cover band. Take my hand, spin me around, this is heaven upside down indeed. Or whatever the hell the line is.

    Funniest criticism I've heard (paraphrased): "In 'Revelation 12,' Manson forgets the number 11 exists at all and skips it completely every time he chants the main refrain of the song. There seems to be no significant reason for this other than...sheer forgetfulness?"
    So, essentially, Marilyn Manson became the exact thing Trent was mocking in "Big Man With A Gun"

  7. #817
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airbornefeline View Post
    ah, the classic, "i'm not retarded, I'm just pretending to be, jokes on you!" i guess I just don't hang around here enough to pick up on the subtle nuances of your personality. fuck me, right. One of the biggest MM fans I know LOVES Born Villain and thinks it his best album, so anything's possible.
    I mean, you're the one who completely misread what I posted about THEOL being regarded as a masterpiece. Can't help you there. Most people would probably agree that I must be retarded to enjoy that album so much, but who cares. That album is nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be. I honestly don't think a lot of people even know what kind of Manson album they'd like to hear, at this point..

  8. #818
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    So old Brian is still doing Marilyn thing? Well, I guess if 1500 Juggalos can gather at the Lincoln Memorial in 2017, there’s probably still got to be some love out there for Marilyn as well. But like the song goes, old gray mare she ain’t what she used to be.

  9. #819
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    From '95-'07, Manson was my favorite band. Started with Smells like Children and went through all of the phases after. Golden Age is when everything started to go downhill. There's a level of cheese and insincerity that started with that record and has continued through the rest of his career. But at least Golden Age of Grotesque and Eat Me Drink Me were tolerable in my opinion. The lyrics had become diluted and campy at that point but I could still stomach listening without cringing. EMDM is incredibly underrated. Skold's guitar work stands next to John 5's. I wish he had continued on this path. The High End of Low was a complete disappoint at the time it was released. It's grown on me over the years but there's still plenty of problems with that record. First of all the production sounds rushed and amateur. The guitars and drums especially. Twiggy is a amazing songwriter (one of my all time favorites) and rhythm player. THEOL just doesn't have the same intensity and bite that previous guitar players contributed. John 5, Skold, and shit even Daisy all ran circles around him. Like I said he's a great rhythm player but what's missing is the leads that give the instrumentals the extra melody they need. And it seems like at this point they stopped giving a shit about recording with a real drummer and used the crappiest presets on whatever drum program they used. Born Villain was even more demo-ish. Both records are basically Spooky Kids material made with expensive equipment. That's why The Pale Emperor and HUD seem like huge improvements over those albums because Tyler Bates is a great guitar player and producer. I would love to see him play more lead stuff but he's got the thing that's been missing since Skold's absence. I'd like to see Twiggy and Tyler write some stuff together the way he did with John 5 on Holy Wood. And it still seems like they're using drum machines on the studio recordings when they have a perfectly capable drummer. Maybe I'm wrong but to my ears it sounds programmed. If it's not, they really need to get a better "live" studio sound. Manson works best as a rock band. Even Antichrist feels like a real band behind the synths and industrial noises (damn I miss Pogo's contributions as well...that was the icing on the cake).

    Heaven Upside Down is on the same level as GAOG for me. It's passable. I'd rather have something like Holy Wood or The Pale Emperor when it seemed like Manson put effort into the themes and lyrics. I don't know if he's lazy or burnt out or both but I don't really feel like he's trying anymore. It's just kind of a fun job for him now. Would love to see him tackle another concept record and focus on delivering a more potent message. It's hard to defend his music now because it's kind of moronic and juvenile. And he seems perfectly happy with that image. Eh, whatever.

  10. #820
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    Well now that he is buds with Reznor again, maybe they can do a collab...I am sure working with TR again would light a fire under his ass....Would be even better if they shared vocal duties on a record

  11. #821
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Channard View Post
    So old Brian is still doing Marilyn thing? Well, I guess if 1500 Juggalos can gather at the Lincoln Memorial in 2017, there’s probably still got to be some love out there for Marilyn as well. But like the song goes, old gray mare she ain’t what she used to be.
    Marilyn Manson's Instagram has 2.1 million followers and his Twitter has 1.37m. His numbers are closer to Pearl Jam, Foo Fighters and Metallica's than the likes of Soundgarden, Alice In Chains, or, even, yes, NIN, who hover around the 200-500k range. He's got crazy fan presence outside North America still. There's a Brazil fan group with 17,000 members alone.

    It seems incomprehensible in this day and age, yes, but it's a mark to remember just how big of an impact he made in the 90s and still kind of maintains albeit sans most of his shock factor; he secured himself a legacy passed down through a few generations of fans. When I went to the End Times tour, I ran into two kids no more than fifteen I wound up walking to the show with, who were riveted when I described what seeing him on the Holy Wood tour was like. They were insanely jealous.

    And this is one way he gets away with putting out bad albums, I'd say - there are enough people out there still interested that I'm guessing he still probably sees decent returns on sales for whatever that's worth in 2017.
    Last edited by Shadaloo; 09-23-2017 at 06:21 PM.

  12. #822
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    Marilyn Manson's Instagram has 2.1 million followers and his Twitter has 1.37m. His numbers are closer to Pearl Jam, Foo Fighters and Metallica's than the likes of Soundgarden, Alice In Chains, or, even, yes, NIN, who hover around the 200-500k range. He's got crazy fan presence outside North America still. There's a Brazil fan group with 17,000 members
    Yet his impact was due to the man behind NIN. What's this post even represent. Is it a swinging dick contest? Trent reznor has 1.8 million followers on his twitter (more than Manson), who gives a fuck. I'd take quality over popularity anyway. Reznor impact and talent far out weigh Manson's shock factor. Justin Bieber has over 100 million followers yet guess what he will be remembered for.

    *Also twitter and instagram followers can be bought and inflated by companies.
    Last edited by OSLIN; 09-23-2017 at 07:34 PM.

  13. #823
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    Quote Originally Posted by OSLIN View Post
    Yet his impact was due to the man behind NIN. What's this post even represent. Is it a swinging dick contest? Trent reznor has 1.8 million followers on his twitter (more than Manson), who gives a fuck. I'd take quality over popularity anyway. Reznor impact and talent far out weigh Manson's shock factor. Justin Bieber has over 100 million followers yet guess what he will be remembered for.
    Holy shit. Defensive much?

    My only point is not to underestimate how many fans Manson still has worldwide and not to forget how much of an impact he had, and that any surprise that he's still an active force is actually very explicable. That's all. I'm not the one making it into a swinging dick contest.

    Trent having more twitter followers than the NIN band doesn't surprise me at all, considering being an Apple CEO and his soundtrack works.

  14. #824
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    Holy shit. Defensive much?

    My only point is not to underestimate how many fans Manson still has worldwide and not to forget how much of an impact he had, and that any surprise that he's still an active force is actually very explicable. That's all. I'm not the one making it into a swinging dick contest.

    Trent having more twitter followers than the NIN band doesn't surprise me at all, considering being an Apple CEO and his soundtrack works.
    I was stating how defensive you sounded, it made it seem like you were making it a swing contest. I wasn't trying to argue. I wanted to basically state that those numbers really mean shit.

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    It's good to see that even without Haz around, the music is still shitty enough to turn this thread into the nightmare it always becomes

  16. #826
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    Quote Originally Posted by OSLIN View Post
    I was stating how defensive you sounded, it made it seem like you were making it a swing contest. I wasn't trying to argue. I wanted to basically state that those numbers really mean shit.
    Defensive and defending are two different things, and I'm neither here. I'm making observations, nothing more.

    It's really easy to dismiss the numbers as being bought and paid for, but I don't think Manson A) would care enough to buy followers OR b) has the kind of budget to throw around to inflate his fanbase. A few million is really believable, and is still nothing compared to the following he or anyone else had in his heyday.

    Again - only point I'm making is he has shit tons of fans still. I know the NIN community looks at MM like the Skinny Puppy community looks at Trent - but objectivity shouldn't be that tough.

    It took more than Haz to shit up the prior threads and I'm not going anywhere near that territory, thanks very much.
    Last edited by Shadaloo; 09-23-2017 at 08:35 PM.

  17. #827
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    Defensive and defending are two different things, and I'm neither here. I'm making observations, nothing more.

    It's really easy to dismiss the numbers as being bought and paid for, but I don't think Manson A) would care enough to buy followers AND b) the kind of budget to throw around to inflate his fanbase. A few million is really believable, and is still nothing compared to the following he or anyone else had in his heyday.

    Again - only point I'm making is he has shit tons of fans still. I know the NIN community looks at MM like the Skinny Puppy community looks at Trent - but objectivity shouldn't be that tough.

    It took more than Haz to shit up the prior threads and I'm not going anywhere near that territory, thanks very much.
    I'm definitely not being defensive, I'm not really a fan of Manson at all. I just don't get the social media angle for defense. I think Manson is more of an idea than an actual artist anymore but I don't think bringing up instagram followers means much. I wasn't stating Manson buys followers I'm just stating anyone can and that doesn't change how much of an impact they make. Really just stating my opinion, you definitely have a right to yours

  18. #828
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    That's fair. I just look at rough numbers and to me they just seem right and believable, you know? Not inferring quality or anything.

    And I dunno about you guys, but up here in my city, I see a fair amount of people with Manson shirts on to this day, maybe once or twice every month or two. It kind of surprises me, every time.

    It feels natural to me to think of the guy as washed up, but seeing stuff like those numbers, the occasional - but not so occasional it's rare - person in a T-shirt, the fact that the media is even bothering to report on any of this Bieber feuding shit just leaves me with the overall impression of "the general public hasn't forgotten this guy to anywhere near the degree it feels like they should have, or might have. He never quite became a straight-up footnote the way certain people like *cough* Billy Corgan did (if I can contaminate this thread with my inexplicable obsession a little bit). I really do think that, despite the fact that by now he's had as many bad albums as good ones, he's secured himself something of a legacy.


    Fuck, I'm listening to "In The Shadow Of The Valley Of Death" now and wondering how in the christ this is the same person who penned "I MAKE SONGS TO FIGHT AND TO FUCK TO IF YOU WANT TO FIGHT I WILL FIGHT YOU IF YOU WANT TO FUCK I WILL FUCK YOU"

    This makes me sad and I am reaching for the alcohol now
    Last edited by Shadaloo; 09-23-2017 at 09:10 PM. Reason: sadness

  19. #829
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    Marilyn Manson's Instagram has 2.1 million followers and his Twitter has 1.37m. His numbers are closer to Pearl Jam, Foo Fighters and Metallica's than the likes of Soundgarden, Alice In Chains, or, even, yes, NIN, who hover around the 200-500k range. He's got crazy fan presence outside North America still. There's a Brazil fan group with 17,000 members alone.

    It seems incomprehensible in this day and age, yes, but it's a mark to remember just how big of an impact he made in the 90s and still kind of maintains albeit sans most of his shock factor; he secured himself a legacy passed down through a few generations of fans. When I went to the End Times tour, I ran into two kids no more than fifteen I wound up walking to the show with, who were riveted when I described what seeing him on the Holy Wood tour was like. They were insanely jealous.

    And this is one way he gets away with putting out bad albums, I'd say - there are enough people out there still interested that I'm guessing he still probably sees decent returns on sales for whatever that's worth in 2017.
    And yet Less Than got to 2 million views on youtube faster than "We Know Where You Fucking Life" even though that single had a lot of hype, as did the entire album. Almost nobody is talking about his new music or his new album, only about him as a person and about things he DID. Even with "CONTROVERSIALAA" music video, it seems like no one really cares. Goddamn, people care more about his Justin Bieber controversy than his new music. Which is pretty sad. Even with a controversial video which contains rape, he didn't manage to get enough of press to get people to look at his video, it's been a week.
    Currently WKWYFL is at 700k and that geninelly surprises me.

    I'm not impressed.
    Last edited by HWB; 09-23-2017 at 09:13 PM.

  20. #830
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    Quote Originally Posted by HWB View Post
    And yet Less Than got to 2 million views on youtube faster than "We Know Where You Fucking Life" even though that single had a lot of hype, as did the entire album. Almost nobody is talking about his new music or his new album, only about him as a person and about things he DID. Even with "CONTROVERSIALAA" music video, it seems like no one really cares.

    I'm not impressed.
    WKWYFL was debuted a good month before the album came out. I'd make comparisons to some of the first live videos instead, maybe.

    No one is talking about the new album except the few thousand of us who downloaded it early because the review embargoes are still on it because it isn't due out for two weeks. You'll start hearing buzz for good or ill then. The general public isn't aware of it yet.
    Last edited by Shadaloo; 09-23-2017 at 10:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    WKWYFL was debuted a good month album came out. I'd make comparisons to some of the first live videos instead, maybe.

    No one is talking about the new album except the few thousand of us who downloaded it early because the review embargoes are still on it because it isn't due out for two weeks. You'll start hearing buzz for good or ill then. The general public isn't aware of it yet.
    That is a good point, but I'd still expect for a new single which is hyping up new album with controversial music video to have a further reach than it currently does.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HWB View Post
    And yet Less Than got to 2 million views on youtube faster than "We Know Where You Fucking Life" even though that single had a lot of hype, as did the entire album. Almost nobody is talking about his new music or his new album, only about him as a person and about things he DID. Even with "CONTROVERSIALAA" music video, it seems like no one really cares. Goddamn, people care more about his Justin Bieber controversy than his new music. Which is pretty sad. Even with a controversial video which contains rape, he didn't manage to get enough of press to get people to look at his video, it's been a week.
    Currently WKWYFL is at 700k and that geninelly surprises me.

    I'm not impressed.
    Are we really going the route of nin vs Manson numbers?

  23. #833
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conan The Barbarian View Post
    Are we really going the route of nin vs Manson numbers?
    Yeah, I am sorry for bringing that up in the first place, that was a childish mistake on my part, really.I didn't mean to go "Look NIN has more numbars ha!",it was more of a shock at Marilyn not having super big numbers at the single, the comparison wasn't necesarry.

  24. #834
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conan The Barbarian View Post
    Are we really going the route of nin vs Manson numbers?
    Yeah the numbers for these bands are relatively similar, it's not even really worth discussion because there's really no point. This is the manson thread, where we should be discussing how disappointing this new album is

  25. #835
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    Ehhhh, my bad for making the comparison in the first place. I don't wanna start shit, I just noticed the numbers and it really did come as a surprise to me, which got me to thinking about how he may still be more relevant than I've been considering for some years now.

    Back on topic:

    I seriously fucking hope he gave songwriting credit for Saturnalia to Bauhaus on the album because I'm starting to become worried this is grounds for a lawsuit (or I would if I thought Bauhaus listened or cared)

  26. #836
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    This new record fucking sucks. His worst record without question. Horribad.

  27. #837
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony.parente View Post
    This new record fucking sucks. His worst record without question. Horribad.
    It's on par with EMDM, so I'd say they're both equally his worst horribad record without question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadaloo View Post
    Marilyn Manson's Instagram has 2.1 million followers and his Twitter has 1.37m. His numbers are closer to Pearl Jam, Foo Fighters and Metallica's than the likes of Soundgarden, Alice In Chains, or, even, yes, NIN, who hover around the 200-500k range. He's got crazy fan presence outside North America still. There's a Brazil fan group with 17,000 members alone.

    It seems incomprehensible in this day and age, yes, but it's a mark to remember just how big of an impact he made in the 90s and still kind of maintains albeit sans most of his shock factor; he secured himself a legacy passed down through a few generations of fans. When I went to the End Times tour, I ran into two kids no more than fifteen I wound up walking to the show with, who were riveted when I described what seeing him on the Holy Wood tour was like. They were insanely jealous.

    And this is one way he gets away with putting out bad albums, I'd say - there are enough people out there still interested that I'm guessing he still probably sees decent returns on sales for whatever that's worth in 2017.

    Yeah, I get it. Being a youth of the 90s myself Manson was more of a celebrity figure than Trent. Especially considering that at that time it seemed like Trent would disappear from the public eye for years at a time, while Manson would be Mansoning it up in front of the cameras at every chance. So if still projecting that persona is keeping him relevant at 50 and keeping the paychecks rolling in, more power to him. But despite the enamoring persona, I personally didn’t find his music output all that great back then, and like his newer stuff even less.

    But I won’t be a hypocrite. Personally being a much bigger fan of White/Rob Zombie, objectively others could say the same things about them. So to each their own.

  29. #839
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony.parente View Post
    This new record fucking sucks. His worst record without question. Horribad.
    Wow, I never thought in a million years you of all people would hate a MM record!

    Thinking back to the mini "review" I gave it a page or two back, I think I was being too generous giving it a 4.5/10. It's more like a 2.5 or 3/10. It actually gets worst the more you listen to it. Normally records have the opposite effect. They grow on you and get better.

    This is hands down the worst thing he has ever done in his career. The production and recording team he works with should be embarrassed to have witnessed the creation of this record.

    One of my favorite comments here was from someone saying something along the lines of "at no point did anyone he was working with try and stop him at all during the recording process to say, I don't think this is turning out very well" Nobody stopped for a second to think "Hey, I don't think this is a good idea" unless, like the person said (sorry, too lazy to go find the quote I read it a couple days ago), this was the BEST his production team managed to conjure up from an even worse abomination of crap, then that's saying something...

    With that said, I do really like Kill4me though. That song has grew on me, but that's pretty much the only song I can tolerate. I can't even look at Saturnalia in the same light anymore after seeing all the comparisons to "Bela Lugosi's Dead" anymore. Song is a blatant rip off.

    I just love all the Manson die-hards in the facebook comments for posts on the new songs/records praising this stuff like it is the best stuff ever.

    Anyone know what our good friends Hezekiah's opinion of this gong show is? I bet he thinks it's a total Masterpiece.

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    Who cares what he thinks, lol. I bet since the ban though, and the fact that his name keeps coming up...he's bragging about it. On his FB or whatever...I would bet my mortgage on it, it's that predictable.

    Back on topic...I finally made it through a full listen while at work, and pretty much agree with you...the production is pure garbage. Sure the songs are sorta ho-hum, forgettable...sure the lyrics are laughably bad, pandering to the aging Hot Topic crowd...but fuckssakes, the production of the thing.

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