The Walking Dead (SPOILERS)

[elevenism]

So I was pretty impressed with the season premiere.

I don't know how the hell this show works without Rick, but I'm really looking forward to seeing how they handle it.

I'm cautiously optimistic, especially because FTWD started out great this year before going just utterly fucking sideways.

But I will say this: that premiere was one of the best episodes in YEARS.

[bobbie solo]

Why was it good?

[elevenism]

Why was it good?

did you watch it?
It LOOKS a whole hell of a lot better than it has in a long time.
The dialogue and writing are better.
The focus is back on the main characters.

But, most of all, the show is moving into new territory. It had already gotten repetitive as fuck. Then, the whole All Out War thing was about a fucking YEAR too long.

Now, we have a new story that's interesting. I have no idea what's going to happen next. I've heard about the whisperers, but keep in mind, I've never read the comics.

There was a 1.5 year time jump. The whole thing feels fresh again: fresher than it has in a few years, imho.

Now, that being said, there's PLENTY of room for it to go sideways. But if they can manage to keep this level of quality and do Andy Lincoln's exit right, this could be the season I've been waiting for.

It feels almost like a reboot. It DEFINITELY feels like the season 8 finale was the end of an era (I think I said a few posts back, when it aired, that it should have been the end of the series.)

And I'm thinking that, in a way, it was.

This is going to be a whole new thing going forward.

Whether or not it works with no Rick is anyone's guess. It COULD, but it's going to be pretty much a different show.

I have a feeling they knew Andrew Lincoln was going to leave, which is why they unceremoniously killed Coral. I think pseudo new show/reboot is what they're shooting for.

But yeah: better writing and cinematography and fresh story.

Will it work going forward? Maaaaybe? I'm putting my money on no.

But it's POSSIBLE, and I have hope.

I still like this show. It's dark as fuck and I dig that. I want it to continue and I want it to be decent.

[ickyvicky]

I thought the premiere was alright, a little slow, but at least someone finally died. I can't believe they just popped out Little Glenn without showing Maggie really going through the pregnancy.

[ickyvicky]

What's up with that helicopter?

[miss k bee]

Still feel like it’s plodding on a bit, and wtf with Jadis and Gabriel?!

[elevenism]

Still feel like it’s plodding on a bit, and wtf with Jadis and Gabriel?!

I don't trust Jadis, like, at all.
@ickyvicky I think she's involved in some sort of dirty dealings with whomever is in the helicopter.

[ickyvicky]

Gabriel looks even more creepy with that blind eye

[elevenism]

Gabriel looks even more creepy with that blind eye

You guys know I'm kind of a theology nut. So, okay, there's a kind of obscure verse in, Zechariah, I think, that some have interpreted to mean that the antichrist is blind in one eye.

So I wonder if that was part of the decision for father Gabriel's one eye look.

[ickyvicky]

@elevenism I think so too.

[ickyvicky]

I don't like how they're saying "Only 2 episodes of Rick left!"

[elevenism]

These past five episodes have been fucking GREAT. I'm loving this show again.

[chuckrh]

just read that andrew lincoln has signed on for walking dead movies. hmmmmm

[ImTheWiseJanitor]

just read that andrew lincoln has signed on for walking dead movies. hmmmmm

Edit: Here’s a link for anyone’s learnin’ pleasure: https://www.indiewire.com/2018/11/wa...os-1202017997/

After how long they’ve been pushing “omg Andrew Lincoln is leaving omg better watch the new season,” this news is kinda disappointing. But then again, I say that having not seen the majority of the last two seasons. I’m not saying the show needs to be canceled or anything, but if you’re gonna say someone is leaving your show, stick to your guns. :/ Even if it was always planned as a marketing bait and switch, that makes the announcement feel a little more gross.

If they wanted Walking Dead movies, they should have started that years ago, and embraced the R rating the series deserves. 9 seasons in, when so much of the fanbase is still wavering on how they feel about the show (not saying MOST fans are, but there’s definitely been a polarization in public opinion over the past few years), it feels more like an act of desperation than anything else. Maybe it’ll be hugely successful! But if it’s gonna be more of the same...ehhh...count me out.

That being said, maybe I’ll stream the last couple sessions and see if I change my mind! This decision still feels very strange, though.

[miss k bee]

Managed to come across the news about Rick before the episode premières over here tonight. Takes the shock of 'Rick's last episode' away. They could have delayed this news by a week at least. SMH

[bobbie solo]

Walking Dead & AMC just cannot get out of their own way. Stop f'ing with the fans that are left.

[versusreality]

I'm kinda disappointed how they semi-trolled us, but they're technically not wrong. Counting down his last few episodes (which I'd prefer them not to have done) wasn't lieing to us. He won't be featured in any more episodes, and we won't be seeing him weekly anymore. Instead, we'll see him a once a year for a movie. I can't imagine them advertising that in advance: "3 episodes of Rick left, but you'll see him in the future for some movies" . That'd be a spoiler for sure.

Either way, the time jump was awesome. Bring on the whisperers.

[ImTheWiseJanitor]

I'm kinda disappointed how they semi-trolled us, but they're technically not wrong. Counting down his last few episodes (which I'd prefer them not to have done) wasn't lieing to us. He won't be featured in any more episodes, and we won't be seeing him weekly anymore. Instead, we'll see him a once a year for a movie. I can't imagine them advertising that in advance: "3 episodes of Rick left, but you'll see him in the future for some movies" . That'd be a spoiler for sure.

Either way, the time jump was awesome. Bring on the whisperers.

Right, but what I'm hearing from this announcement is "well, TECHNICALLY he's really not gonna be in the show anymore so we didn't really lie about anything, so nyeh nyeh." Okay, but you KNEW what you were doing - especially with the ridiculous counting down in promos. The way to handle that would have been to NOT DO THAT. Just have some balls and kill off your character surprisingly and poetically without jerking yourself off about it. They could have handled it any number of ways without dragging out the announcement of his "departure" for months before being like "lol jk" and running it back at the last minute in the most cliched way possible. (Spoiler: I read the spoilers.) Can you imagine how monumentally lame it would've been if they ended Breaking Bad and then said "surprise, we're actually giving Bryan Cranston his own made-for-TV movies that take place apart from the events of the series but continuing the main series without him in it?"

The one thing that HAS stood through all of TWD for me is holding out to see what the ending is, because it's always, aaalways been pushed that there's a known ending for the series in mind, but they're not going to approach it yet. Now that they're doing this, I have less of a desire to even find out where everything goes, because they're very clearly just dangling carrots from the stick now until the money runs dry, which I'm going to predict will be very, very soon. I imagine this going the same way as the recently-announced and even more recently cancelled Star Wars standalone films. "Alright, people LOVE Star Wars, so let's cash in on that and make a whole series of standalone movi- Ooooookay, maybe not."

I'm glad they're finally making it to The Whisperers, and I still really love the source material, but man. Is this really the way? Are the events in the show just gonna be completely made up from season to season now, and the movies will follow that thread instead? Will they both be about the Whisperers and needlessly split into a series AND movies but take place at the same time? None of it makes any sense.

[versusreality]

The whole thing is a mess, and the AMC marketing department leaves much to be desired.

I think they should have been looking for ways to wind down both series (FTWD) , merge them together in the next year or two and have it all wrapped up by no later than 2021. Instead, this seems like this will be endless.

That could work with Marvel. It ain't gonna work with zombies.

[ickyvicky]

I'm so disappointed in how they they just continue to milk and milk the fuck out of this show. They should've let Rick die!

[elevenism]

Part of me wishes rick would have died, but I'm also glad he didn't.

I'm I like the only one who's still feeling this show here?

The show is WAY better than its been in YEARS.

[ickyvicky]

And how Maggie didn't kill Negan?! C'monnn...... he was totally trolling her.

[elevenism]

And how Maggie didn't kill Negan?! C'monnn...... he was totally trolling her.

Maybe he was trolling her, and maybe not.
Either scenario could be interesting.

But i DAMN sure didn't want to lose Negan, AND Maggie, AND Rick.

Also, you guys talk about "the few fans who are still watching" or whatever. But isn't TWD still the highest rated show on cable?

And as far as an extended universe not working for TWD, i think it could. I'm skeptical of their ability to pull it off, but i hope to god it works.

There are those of us who are FAR more interested in horror and things that are dark than colorful movies about people in tights who have special powers.

[ImTheWiseJanitor]

Also, you guys talk about "the few fans who are still watching" or whatever. But isn't TWD still the highest rated show on cable?

I’m not saying that it’s not a “successful” show, or even that it’s BAD, but aside from yourself and maybe one other person, I really haven’t heard hardly anyone speak highly of the show to me. That’s just how it is, and I wish I knew more people that watched it and gave me positive input. I can’t think of anyone else off the top of my head that still watches out of enjoyment. Maybe it’s great, and admittedly I DO need to see where things went over the last two seasons to have a fair opinion, for sure! But the number of things I’ve heard about the show from word of mouth (excluding this thread, of course!) has been...almost non-existent, and drastically outweighed by negative reception. You can’t really fault me for not knowing of many people in my personal life that still watch it. They all tailed off at one point or another, or never got into it to begin with. I’m merely speaking based on what I’ve seen and heard for myself, and there hasn’t been a whole lot. :/ I wish it were different, but it isn’t.

As for ratings - I wish it wasn’t true, but the number of people watching week to week isn’t quite a measure of a show’s quality. It’s a measure of the number of people there to watch, unquestionably. It works the same way with movies, ya know? Suicide Squad made nearly $400 million and is considered a commercial success, but that doesn’t mean all of those people LIKED it. It just means they showed up and bought a ticket. Hell, I bought a ticket to “The Nun,” but if anyone were to ask, I wouldn’t consider that a particularly “great” horror movie. To assume a ticket purchase means instant approval isn’t accurate. The same thing applies to TV ratings, unfortunately. People tune in to watch things for any number of reasons from “I really love this” to “I need to see how this dumpster fire ends.” (NOT to say at all that TWD is a dumpster fire, I swear, just mentioning two extremes of the spectrum!) The ratings system only even factors in such a portion of the viewing audience. Even if every survey turned in was overwhelmingly positive, that sample is still excluding the millions of other opinions out there, whether positive or negative.

And as far as an extended universe not working for TWD, i think it could. I'm skeptical of their ability to pull it off, but i hope to god it works.

This is what I’ve wanted more of from the beginning. Proper integration of new stories from the extended universe. FTWD is alright, but couldn’t keep me on board for more than one season. Fault of the show/writing? I dunno. But it wasn’t for me, and for someone else it might be even better than the mainline series. I still think it’s possible, though. But saying “this character is leaving the show, JK he’s leaving the show but just moving to television movies instead of a television show” isn’t the way. They should have said nothing at all about Lincoln leaving, let the surprise twist in the show happen organically, and following it up that night with the announcement of the movies, instead of starting the hype train, doubling down on it, and letting people generate false expectations, as the internet is known to do. That would have made for a much smoother announcement, in my opinion.

There are those of us who are FAR more interested in horror and things that are dark than colorful movies about people in tights who have special powers.

Heh. If you think I care more about anything other than horror when it comes to film/TV, you need to get to know me a little better. I’m far more interested in horror than other genres when it comes to any medium. That being said, that’s exactly why I think AMC’s telling of TWD is so lukewarm to me now. After 7 years of seeing it, one of the things that remained true season to season was “Man, HBO, or somebody else, might have handled this differently.” If there were no source material that had already primed up my expectations for what a Walking Dead show could be like, I’m 100% sure that I’d probably hold the show in higher regard. It isn’t inherently bad, at all. But it just feels so relatively clean as a result of being on a cable network. Granted, it IS AMC we’re talking about. They aren’t exactly The Hallmark Channel in terms of content by any means, but if it were up to me, I would have given the show to another network that could go to more of the places that the cable series will just never, ever go.

Shoot. I was talking to a friend just yesterday, who hasn’t watched the last couple seasons either, and I managed to blow his mind by telling him just a couple of the things that had been completely omitted from the show. Those things alone were enough to get him to say “what the fuck, that’s awesome! Why didn’t they do that in the show??” Well, because that’s the nature of cable television, and I honestly feel that, over time, the show’s kind of suffered somewhat for it. :/ They’ve tried to compensate, and I LOOOVE that things happen somewhat differently from the comics just to shake things up because that’s how you make a show interesting for people who are already familiar with it, but that doesn’t mean that every change is the best thing since sliced bread, either. Some of the moments that are a solid 10 in terms of intensity and narrative weight have been replaced with moments that are dialed down to like a 7 or 8, and sometimes it shows way too clearly.

I absolutely do not hate this show, nor do I wish it was brighter and happier like a superhero series. It isn’t even fair to compare the two because they’re two completely different genres. I just wish it was being handled differently.

Edit: ALL of that being said - just in the name of fairness and curiosity, I’m probably gonna pick up where I left off with this series and catch up over the weekend! I’ll probably report to you first thing, so expect to hear from me this weekend, my friend.

[elevenism]

Also, you guys DO realize that these planned movies are TV movies, right?

[elevenism]

I don't think they meant for the news of Andy leaving to get out, and then they had to say something because it was all over the internet, I THINK.

And as far as "ratings," I was specifically talking about the number of people still watching, in response to people saying no one still watches it.

Dude, @ImTheWiseJanitor , keep in mind that I'm not familiar with the source material.
And don't blame ME if you don't like 7 and 8.
They kind of drag, although binge watching them would probably make that go down easier.
I can guarantee that there are parts of 7 and 8 you really WON'T like. Don't get me wrong here. There are some rating stunt deaths. There's a part that implies that people can turn from coming in contact with walker blood- like they forgot they've already shown this not to be the case.
I'd still say they're worth watching though. My wife just rewatched them and thought they were better the second time around, not waiting a week between episodes and such.

This show does have its problems, and 7 and 8 are where they show the most, imho.

I'm mostly just excited because 9 is really, REALLY badass. It's a return to form. They got a GREAT showrunner.

[elevenism]

Well, this is it. Last night's episode is the beginning of TWD without Rick.

It was kind of slow, but that's also sort of necessary when setting up a 6 year time jump.

It seems reasonable. I REALLY hope it works.

I'd love to see this show head for the home stretch: fix FTWD, do the three movies of whatever Rick and Jadis are up to, and have the whole thing converge and end in season...12, maybe?

It frightens me when they talk about the show being on for another 10 years and such.

I don't want ThIS story to go on forever. A prequel show might work at some point. But as far as the core story, has that EVER worked? I was trying to think of ANY serialized show that was on for 20 fucking years and having a pretty hard time.

[zaps30]

Tons of people died before the time jumps in less time, but during a total of 8 years worth of time jumps no one died? Ok.

[elevenism]

Tons of people died before the time jumps in less time, but during a total of 8 years worth of time jumps no one died? Ok.

Also, they're still talking about "ever since, you know, what happened" about Rick dying six YEARS later?

[ickyvicky]

Last night's episode was great! I loved it.