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Thread: The Childfree and/or Unmarried Thread

  1. #31
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    No one answered me so I'm reposting my question (sorry about that, I won't re-repost it however, I promise), because I'd really like to know what you guys think about a situation like this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandros View Post
    What would any of you do in case their partner did find marriage essential? The relationship is great and all, yet the other person needs to have that ceremony. What then? That's a legitimate question by the way, I'm not berating you.

  2. #32
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    ^^I don't really know. Perhaps I'd be like Tea and go through with it for them. But then, if they found marriage *essential* would I even get past a few dates with them?

    Quote Originally Posted by redshoewearer View Post
    9. When are you going to have children?
    Do you want to wait in the living room? We can go start trying now....
    HA! I LOVE this. Next time someone asks me I should just have sex in front of them.
    Last edited by icklekitty; 12-08-2011 at 04:03 AM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by icklekitty View Post
    ^^I don't really know. Perhaps I'd be like Tea and go through with it for them. But then, if they found marriage *essential* would I even get past a few dates with them?
    I don't think it's that simple. You would be surprised (or maybe not) at how entrenched the idea of marriage is to some. That person could be (almost) perfect for you, yet retain that one notion. And sometimes it may well not be their notion anyway, it depends on what sort of society you live in and what the family thinks. It's all well and good to say "I don't believe in marriage, I'd rather avoid it", but would you really want to put your partner in a place where he/she has to deal with a disapproving family? And for what is simply one day of ceremony and a signature in a piece of paper? I know it sounds like the coward's way out and a compromise one shouldn't be forced to do, but it is something to think about.

  4. #34
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    Okay, I got bored and decided I'd play along.

    1. Who's going to take care of you when you get old?

    I'll worry about that IF I get old. As it is, I sure as hell won't be taking care of my parents when they get old - I love them dearly, but I'll never be able to afford it financially. And who's to say my kids won't hate me?

    2. Don't you want a smaller/younger version of yourself?

    I've already been a younger version of myself. I was THERE. I don't need to see it again - I was kind of a pain in the ass more often than I'd like to admit. Why subject myself to that all over again?

    3. Why wouldn't you want to continue your legacy?

    Legacy? Who the hell do you think I am? I'm a nameless blue collar worker. When I'm done, I'm done.

    4. What if you fall in love?

    I'll keep my mind open, but I don't see this happening until I'm at an age where my partner would have already realized that she doesn't want kids, either.

    5. Why are you being so selfish? / Aren't you being very selfish?

    You just asked me if I wanted to raise a "little version" of myself. Who's selfish, again?

    6. How could your life not be meaningless without children?

    The love of a woman...a career that makes you glad to be alive...hobbies...friends...

    7. The human race would die out if everybody had the same views as you.

    And the human race will quickly drain every finite resource on the planet if they all had the same views as you. But thankfully, not everyone thinks the way I do.

    8. Why don't you want to become a parent?

    Lack of a financial means to provide for a child (or two). Lack of patience with over-active kids. An appreciation for a good night's sleep, and being able to leave the house when I feel like it.

    9. When are you going to have children?

    When I win the lottery. Maybe.

    10. You and your parents wouldn't be here if they were childfree.

    Duh. But they did, so what's your point?

    11. Oh yeah? But children are beautiful.

    Are you going to be saying that when they take all of your money, pour paint over your brand new TV, total your car, and move away at 18 and vow never to speak to you again?

    Yeah...kids? No.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandros View Post
    No one answered me so I'm reposting my question (sorry about that, I won't re-repost it however, I promise), because I'd really like to know what you guys think about a situation like this:
    I think botley answered you, and I suppose I'll try to answer your question as well. Oh, and that's no problem at all. If I was curious, asked a question, and didn't receive any responses, I'd try to bring it up more than once too.

    Quote Originally Posted by botley View Post
    Define "essential". Marriage is supposed to be a union of two people, after all... if they find having another person united to them is essential to what defines who they are, then I'm not going to be terribly interested in them. This is a discussion you should have relatively early in a long-term relationship (within the first year or so) and if they aren't going to budge on their opinion then it's a pretty clear sign there'll be trouble down the road.
    As for me, I would try not to bring it up. This also has a lot more to do with the fact that I'm very uncertain about marriage altogether. Even if I had the means to provide for a relationship financially, I wouldn't be prepared for marriage mentally or emotionally even though I have a tendency to be romantic. (Then again, marriage obviously isn't all fun, games and romance.) If people want to get married, I'm okay with that, but not if they wanted to prod other people into marriage.

    So in several ways, I'm definitely with botley on this one. The same can also be said about a childfree person dating somebody that wants to eventually become a mother or a father.
    Last edited by Halo Infinity; 12-08-2011 at 11:04 AM.

  6. #36
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    ^^I completely missed botley's answer, don't know how I managed to do that! Sorry, botley.

    How about the situation which I'm describing in my other post (#33, I am not requoting!), where it may be a bit more complicated than one person's opinion?

  7. #37
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    I'll admit that it isn't that simple and can get very tricky. It would also be just like finding that perfect somebody to find out that the somebody you found also wanted to become a parent when you don't want children. Complicated is right. I'm sorry, but I don't have much of an answer for that question right now either. I'm rather stumped on that issue too.
    Last edited by Halo Infinity; 12-08-2011 at 01:46 PM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandros View Post
    No one answered me so I'm reposting my question (sorry about that, I won't re-repost it however, I promise), because I'd really like to know what you guys think about a situation like this:
    I think there's always the chance of compromise, and by that I don't mean totally giving in. If it's the cold and hard legal part that you find gross about marriage, you could do a purely symbolic wedding, involving your loved ones and possibly your religion. That way you both are mentally, ceremonially tied for life- it's really not the state's business anyway, so their thoughts on your relationship shouldn't matter, and why should your partner care about it?

    My husband didn't find it essential, but I could tell how much he wanted to go through with it (he even flew out to speak with my parents, since he knew of their disapproval when we started dating), so I wasn't going to tell him no when I wasn't completely negative about marriage, mostly passive.

  9. #39
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    Well, I believe that children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way. Show them all the beauty they posses inside! Give them a sense of pride!

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by theruiner View Post
    Well, I believe that children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way. Show them all the beauty they posses inside! Give them a sense of pride!
    I decided, long ago, never to walk in anyone's shadow.

  11. #41
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    i think i just gave myself a hernia singing along with you.

  12. #42
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    See, the problem with kids is, not all of them are going to turn out as cool as us.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alexandros View Post
    I don't think it's that simple. You would be surprised (or maybe not) at how entrenched the idea of marriage is to some. That person could be (almost) perfect for you, yet retain that one notion. And sometimes it may well not be their notion anyway, it depends on what sort of society you live in and what the family thinks. It's all well and good to say "I don't believe in marriage, I'd rather avoid it", but would you really want to put your partner in a place where he/she has to deal with a disapproving family? And for what is simply one day of ceremony and a signature in a piece of paper? I know it sounds like the coward's way out and a compromise one shouldn't be forced to do, but it is something to think about.
    There is no such thing as someone who is even "almost perfect" for you. That is a lie, perpetuated by greeting cards. You either love someone to the point where you can meet them halfway on issues where you disagree, or you don't. This was an issue for me in my recent failed LTR. We'd had discussions about getting married one day and I was not very open to the idea (except in the weaselly "maybe I will one day when I'm older" way). My ex had it entrenched in her upbringing that she wanted a marriage in order to start her own family unit... not necessarily with kids, but including a public ceremony. I could sort of understand the desire for that, but I wasn't exactly sure whom it would benefit... was she trying to get back at her parents for splitting up? I don't know.

    You make a fair point about cultural differences. I wouldn't want to get involved with someone whose family ties are closely entrenched in strict religious rules that I can't get behind, but people fall in love before they look at that shit all the time.

  14. #44
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    I think I should've reconsidered what I've just said then. I could understand somebody being a special person to somebody, but such perfection or "almost perfection" doesn't exist. (Considering how all humans have flaws anyway.) Due to such an ideal being perpetuated on cards and such I've said that out of a force of habit. And yes, such cultural differences can create quite barriers between people, inevitably closing certain lines of communication that are needed in order to help the relationship thrive.

  15. #45
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    Oh, I agree about the "almost perfect" being overstated. I just used it in response to icklekitty's post, where she said that she probably wouldn't even get past a few dates with someone who found marriage essential. I wanted to describe a situation where you have gone past few dates and even into a long term relationship, because you get along fine and you see eye to eye with eachother in most issues, but there is just this difference in perspective about marriage.

  16. #46
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    Thing is, marriage is the one issue that's INTEGRAL to your relationship with that person. If you're a vegetarian you get into a relationship with an omnivore, you might be able to be OK with that as nobody's forcing you to be an active part of the meat-eating world, but if you're getting into a relationship with someone that thinks the culmination/ultimate level of a relationship is marriage, that's different. If they found marriage essential and I thought it was meaningless....what's the point of dating them you know it's not going to go anywhere?

    Like you say, the idea of marriage is ENTRENCHED to some. So why would I want to date someone that was THAT ADAMANT about getting married when I'm THAT ADAMANT about not getting married? The question you set up involved binary opposites - if one person quite liked to get married and the other person didn't care for marriage, that's an entirely different scenario.

    Similarly, I wouldn't date a celibate person or a religious person. To be honest, I've turned down dates with people for far less.

    Were you just curious with your question or do you have an agenda to push?

  17. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by icklekitty View Post
    Were you just curious with your question or do you have an agenda to push?
    Well, I sort of have a personal interest in it, since I'm in a long term relationship (about 7 and a half years now) and the issue of marriage is slowly leaving the realm of a future possibility and entering that of a decision that has to be made sooner or later. The situation is more like what you describe in your latest post, she would like to get married but it's not like she's adamant about it. It's not something religious on her part, but rather the whole ceremonial/celebration thing that appeals to her. She also has quite a large family, and hails from a village in an island, which means that most of them are quite traditionally inclined (not as exaggerated as the Greeks that appear in movies like My Big Fat Greek Wedding, but not that far either). I have not felt pressured either by her or her family, but I do feel that they expect us to be married eventually. And of course they would expect us to have a religious wedding and all, which is something that would be hypocritical on my part since I'm an atheist. But I digress, that's another discussion.

  18. #48
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    Yeah, you kinda picked the wrong thread, assuming this was all actually just a roundabout way of soliciting wedding advice, but if you feel like it's the right thing to do then maybe start setting some terms. Like, don't get married in a church if doing so makes you a hypocrite, and be prepared to explain why.

  19. #49
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    We probably should have a marriage/babies thread to balance things out though, so get on that.

  20. #50
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    I think kids are the devil.
    And I think marriage is silly.

    That isn't to say I'm not going to one day destroy my body and my values, but for now... no thanks.

    Luckily, my sister is both married and pregnant, so it gets me off the hook for the time being.

  21. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by iamanexit View Post
    I think kids are the devil.
    And I think marriage is silly.
    Marry me.

    (ten characters)

  22. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by botley View Post
    Yeah, you kinda picked the wrong thread, assuming this was all actually just a roundabout way of soliciting wedding advice
    Asking for advice sort of spilled over unfortunately, at first I was simply curious about how you guys would handle a situation like that, because right now in my life I identify more with the Childfree/Unmarried philosophy and I could see a possible snag in a situation where there is otherwise a very good relationship (generally speaking now, not my own). Thanks for the input anyway.

  23. #53
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    The subject of being childfree always reminds me of one particular gripe I have: I have a few acquaintances who are adamantly and vocally childfree (I do not have kids but I'm not opposed to having them someday). These particularly vocal friends will bitch all the time about "breeders" and how obnoxious they are on facebook, posting every detail of their child's existence - but they themselves do the EXACT SAME THING about their pets. It cracks me up. I actually saw someone post something about how you should beware of hanging cords on blinds, because your cat looking out the window could get tangled up and choke themselves so "everyone with pets should read this! And babies, too, I guess."

  24. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by theruiner View Post
    Marry me.
    babysit me!

  25. #55
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    Hey guys! I found this website, very comprehensive information about how to be CHILDFREE
    http://bedsider.org/methods

  26. #56
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    I'm not opposed to the idea of marriage and children in the future, but because I want to finish school and get a career started, those things aren't really a priority right now. My parents and sister are totally supportive of my choice, but my extended family? It's an alien concept to them. Every so often I get bombarded with questions about my love life and when I'm going to start dating someone again (the answer: When I get out of this godforsaken anti-intellectual city and meet someone who appreciates that I'm not an airhead), and I haven't been asked about having kids for a while, probably because I snapped at the last person to ask me that. I guess I should be lucky that I haven't been harangued about my decision to hold off on marriage and kids by total strangers.

  27. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by theruiner View Post
    Marry me.

    (ten characters)
    teehee!
    gosh!

    OK, FINE!

  28. #58
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    It's not so much marriage I'm opposed to, rather it's the whole wedding business. What an absolute waste of money.

  29. #59
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    It just occurred to me yet again that I intensely dislike it when parents make countless excuses for their children's atrocious behavior. It's no wonder why some of those parents are also horrible to speak to. The nuts really don't fall far from the tree in such cases. I'll suppose that I'll just never understand the "They're just children." cop-outs. Age is no excuse for being a douche bag or a first-class asshole. The same can be said about teenagers too.
    Last edited by Halo Infinity; 12-15-2011 at 08:32 PM.

  30. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kris View Post
    I'll suppose that I'll just never understand the "They're just children." cop-outs. Age is no excuse for being a douche bag or a first-class asshole.
    Whaaa? Dude, they're just little kids, they don't know any better. This goes beyond life experience; biologically, their brains aren't fully developed. You can't fault them for that. Plus, at that age, bad behavior a lot of the time can be blamed on bad parenting, though, obviously, that's not always the case. Sometimes kids are just being kids, and they have no control of that. It's just where they are in their brain development.

    That being said, every time I hear a kid screeching and throwing a giant temper tantrum in the middle of a store I feel like jumping out a window. I don't blame the kid, and really, I don't blame the parent, because I know even the most well-behaved kids can have their moments, but God damn does it drive me up a wall. I have sympathy, but that doesn't make it any less annoying.

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