Yeah fromm what I've heard and read, everyone wants the break-up to be done with ASAP, now that the decision's made.
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Yeah fromm what I've heard and read, everyone wants the break-up to be done with ASAP, now that the decision's made.
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Only problem being: the ball's in London now. The EU can't act until the British apply for a leave.
You can imagine how EU leaders feel about Cameron deciding to take a few months time until his party finally figured out who will follow him...
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Originally Posted by r_z
Its hilarious how how the Leave leaders keep passing the buck on "taking control" on this.
Legally the referendum is advisory. Parliament still have to vote on it and can call a referendum. Whenever Article 50 is invoked legally nothing can change with our EU relationship for two years. It's looking more likely that this won't happen. We may stay in this stalemate for some time.
Throbbing Member
Im not surpised by the result at all. People forget how much difference the English channel has made to our mindset.
Charles De Gaulle knew this too. He knew Englnd had a different mindset.
But i think people really need to stop catastrophising, the left leaning media are like acting like manic, delusional, depressives.
The Guardian website has become a fucking joke.
The markets will stabilize, Scotland will not have a referendum for many years, Westminster will never allow it, Nicola Sturgeon SNP leader does not even have a majority government, and Scottish conservatives who have made a comeback recently will never vote to leave. Over a million Scots voted to leave the Europen Union too. Higher than expected.
i do agree were there a referendum tomorrow they would leave...but the relationship is so complex.
Even if they did leave it would make no difference to the U.K, it would not really effect the economyl
I didnt vote to leave, im upset we left, i had no problem being in the European Union. And i cannot be fucked for the anxiety inducing chaos we have to be subjecting to..this uncertain feeling. Im certain by December things will be ok.
But its such a leap in the dark.
The only thing im genuinely depressed about...is how powerful the conservatives will be now, and urgh Boris Johnson as PM.
David Cameron was an ineffectual blip in history. No one will remember him, he was weak forgettable.
The conservatives have not been this powerful since Margaret Thatcher.
Last edited by Exocet; 06-27-2016 at 08:15 PM.
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And if the people who voted Leave think they will spread the wealth back to those needy areas like the EU did then they can think again
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Of course, UK won't turn into Greece just because it left the EU.
The problem isn't if the UK will make it through, but at what cost. Politically, socially, economically, your nation has entered a really thick fog for the foreseeable future. It's a bit early to be doomsaying maybe, but it's way too early to be optimistic as well. Saying that by December things will be okay doesn't mean much, that's not the worrisome time frame, it's not a matter of a few months. Things will be okay by December, the problem is will be things okay two years from now, and again, at what cost ?
Markets stabilize, they're gyros, they always do. The question is, where will they stabilize, at what level ?
Throbbing Member
The pound has already rebounded, UK/US trade deal wont take long to rearrange, they have acctually all been very supportive post Brexit, Canada/Australia/Russia/China/India are all being co-operative. no one (other than Europe) is going to give the U.K too much of a hard time rearranging things.
Merkel says she wants things to go smoothly.
I know many in Europe DESPISE the British now because of this..i worry there are people in Brussells who will actively work against the U.K out of spite.
That cunt Martin Schulz comments worry me the most.
im more concerned with rising racism against minorities, and reconnecting with the working class who voted for this, thats something else, and Boris Johnson running the new U.K government. And the Labour party sorting itself out. I feel Jeremy Corbyn MUST go.
despite the harsh Auesterity measures George Osbornes financial cabinet are very capable, they did wonders for the U.K economy past 5 years, they are a strong bunch. Im not too worried.
Im certain London will retain its position too but this year will be rocky.
I dont know whats next for Europe though.
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Nobody is going to be pleased with UK beating around the bush, its been that way since the 70ies (I want to say since WWII, but that's not the point), there's enough of that.
The UK wasn't quite sure it wanted to be part of the EU, now it's not quite sure it wants to be out? Come on... Its like a boyfriend who never wanted to move in, who eventually decided to call it quits, and now wants to stay in the couch for a few months while he gathers his things.
I hate to see UK go, but if it has to go, just go...
God is an American
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I signed that but I don't necessarily think it's the right thing, it's clutching at straws.
I don't want to leave but @Khrz is right, now it's been done we need someone to take charge and get on with it. It takes 2 years anyway but we need decisive action to give some financial stability.
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Exactly. Stalling won't do any good to anyone, in fact it will only make things way harder. Neither the UK nor the EU can afford to stay in limbo, now less than ever. UK needs to come up with solutions for its own financial safety, and the EU needs to be able to move on quick, otherwise the extreme right will have a field day everywhere making it seem like leaving the union is no big deal.
At least UK kept its currency, our own "dissidents" are even more stupid, saying we'll be better off jumping ship...
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7102931.html
I can see how this approach is tempting, and part of me is rooting for some way to stop this idiocy and for the UK to stay
...but again, like the contents of that referendum, they needed to say this stuff before.
Since they didn't it is just a case of trying to bolt the door after the horse has escaped.
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On the other hand, there's no saving faces now. The tories either own up the forecoming mess that a departure entails, o back off and look like utter morons. Either way they're drowning in a huge, smoldering pool of shit.
Might as well pretend it was all a joke and look like idiots anyway. I mean, it's not like the mess could be any worse at this point, it won't divide Britain any further...
Bored
Why Brexit is the biggest step backward since World Ward II
Ouch.
From the outside, it looks like a huge bunch of people got drunk and, like drunk people mostly do, made bad decisions and woke up the next morning, going WTF JUST HAPPENED?
I feel for you guys, I really do. I cannot imagine how you are going to get out of this mess.
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Well some people apparently are now claiming they only wanted it to be a protest vote, but on the other hand there's no statistics about that, so there's no way to tell if it's any significant... But thanks for fucking up the democratic process just because you wanted to piss your pants in a temper tantrum. That's how we almost ended up with a far right president in 2002,over here.
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And that is the key. SO may of the liberals attached to this issue are trying to frame the entire vote of SEVEN MILLION as simply racism, old people, and regretful protest voters. The way i am seeing liberals continually "other-ize" people in such cartoonish narratives is sad. You'll never understand why people are voting this way and it means this type of problem is only going to continue to grow. So thank you for being a very small portion of people who seem interested in questioning that narrative.
It's interesting to see that this divide is happening globally though. The US is about to have a similar dilemma soon.
Throbbing Member
It was seventeen million. Specifically: 17,410,742. Which is evidence enough that you don't really know what you're talking about. Trust the perspective of someone who spent the first 30 years of their life in an increasingly intolerant, dangerous UK. This is seventeen million votes cast from the perspective of racism, old people, and sad, ill-informed, regretful protest. That's not a liberal filter, it's just Occam's razor, and the UK knows it. Hence why anyone there who isn't an intolerable cunt-bag is absolutely horrified right now.
You're questioning the wrong thing- you should be wondering why there are so many intolerable cunt-bags in the UK in the first place. Geographically distributed in Middle England especially. These traits don't just spring up overnight.
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I come from the same background as people who voted leave, white working class, but I left my roots and went to work in London. Part of the problem is that wealth seems locked up in the metropolitan regions and doesn't spread out to the rest of the country and they feel alienated and left behind. People seem to want to turn the clock back on globalisation also but they still want their smartphone and cheap consumer goods, you can't have both.
The old people narrative pissed me off too because even if a high proportion of young voted remain, a high proportion of them didn't bother to vote either
Last edited by WorzelG; 06-27-2016 at 01:26 AM.
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Ok 17mil. That just makes it more insane to try and explain all those people away with such simple and all-inclusive statements.
Yup! I recall seeing a huge correlation between wealth (or income?) and the voting pattern. Those with more money voted for remain. There are some fundamental societal issues that tie into this whole thing and it needs to be addressed or you will see more of this.
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Except that a lot of those places (Wales particularly where I live) got a lot of money from the EU for regeneration schemes whatever so they've shot themselves in the foot. The remain campaign should have pointed this out of course but it failed completely against the awful racist rhetoric of the leave campaign.
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Except that the campaign's point was largely xenophobe, and since there are apparently displays of triumphant racism right now, acknowledging that a large part of the Leave vote was xenophobia-driven is only a fair assumption. Statistics also show that the youth vote was tipping heavily towards the Remain, and that curve reverses past a certain age threshold. And a lot of people voted to protest, which is expected, no matter the issue, except this time this is a definitive decision, there's no amending, there's no going back, which makes this kind of senseless democracy a wee bit more enraging.
Your point is sound, but unfair. Both sides act this way, all the time. Your wording make it seem like it's exclusively a liberal thing to paint the other side with the broadest strokes, like the conservatives never do that when they don't have their ways. Sounds biased to me.
If these are the Leave voters denounced by the Remain voters, it's because those are the problem with UK politics right now, the people who wouldn't trust no experts because it was too complicated and intellectuals can't be trusted. Nobody has any grief with those who made an informed decision, who knew what they voted for and why. Despite having an opposite point of view, that point is respectable and informed. No, the problem is with those who voted to kick out anyone who wasn't British enough, those who voted for some Downtown Abbey image of England that never was, those who just wanted to stir shit up and didn't realize that was no time for it.
And again, racism has its roots, angry nostalgia has its reasons, disillusion with politics and the wish to kick the house of cards are rooted in a deep, day to day discontent. Sure. But if, say, Trump was elected, it would be hard to actually do a proper post-mortem on that and "make sure it won't happen again". It's happened, it's done. And from my experience, people who vote that way don't have many complex layers to their thinking. They're unhappy with the way things are, and their reasoning is that it all began when things became less French, or less American, or less British. There's no solution to that, even compromise is met with defiance and frustration.
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If only we can learn from this..... Plenty of middle Americans who feel just as passed over.
Throbbing Member
"Hey guys! I'm gonna piss my jeans!"
"Oh.. really? Why?"
"Cus I hate the pockets, frankly I could hold most of this stuff in my hands anyway."
"Oh.. okay, I guess, but what about the urine all over you?"
"Ah screw it" *Pisses jeans*
".."
"Guys my legs are sticky and this is uncomfortable, also I forgot to take my phone out of my pocket and now there is piss on it"
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It's descending into farce now. The Labour party are eating themselves alive, the Labour deputy leader has gone missing on the way back from Glastonbury, George Osborne has gone missing, the petition for a 2nd EU referendum has reached 3 million ..
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Problem is, even IF that decision was cancelled, UK has lost most of its leverage, and the EU can't afford to make you look good. They have all the reasons to use UK as an example of why leaving is a terrible decision, there's just too much at stake, too many countries waiting to see what happens to inform their own decision...
If you guys eventually decide to stay, EU will try its best to chain you to the plumbing for good.
Edit : ironically, politicians here are asking to cancel the agreement of Calais, effectively restoring "proper" frontiers between France and Britain, which means that a campaign based on the fear of immigrants will result in a huge wave of immigrants.
Last edited by Khrz; 06-26-2016 at 10:49 AM.
Banned
That's not surprising.. Many people from the losing side will want to add their names to the petition, along with some people from the winning side who are now having second thoughts.
Maybe the system should be changed. Any major vote should be held three times. Whatever side of the vote wins 2 out of 3 times will be held to.
Last edited by cashpiles (closed); 06-26-2016 at 11:18 AM.
Throbbing Member
My view on referendums in general. Every 4 years during the "big" elections, I responsibly choose and go vote. Then I expect them (parties, politicians, whatever) to leave me alone, do their work professionally, and do not waste my money on referendums. They already have our mandate, or don't they...?
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The way things are going there won't be any MPs in Parliament to even discuss it, no matter how many signatures are there. It's seriously disturbing how there is no leadership after such a momentous result
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7104076.html
Oh my fucking God...
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