Random NIN Thoughts

[Microwave Jellyfish]

whoa, any reason given?

Maybe he couldn't see the fucking piano.

[snichols]

i finally bought a really good set of sony headphones today and am starting to listen to the nin catalog. i am currently listening to sanctified and hearing things i've never heard before! its going to bee a fun week!

[nmitchell86]

i finally bought a really good set of sony headphones today and am starting to listen to the nin catalog. i am currently listening to sanctified and hearing things i've never heard before! its going to bee a fun week!

Headphone are the way to go! I know this is a little off topic but what model?

[snichols]

MDR XB450. got them super cheap at a pawn shop. love em!

[MacabreMagpie]

Listening to the studio version of 'Piggy' for the first in a while, recently and was genuinely shocked to realise that "hey motherfucking pig" isn't in the second verse.

[ltrandazzo]

Listening to the studio version of 'Piggy' for the first in a while, recently and was genuinely shocked to realise that "hey motherfucking pig" isn't in the second verse.

It is when I sing it.

[ryanmcfly]

Listening to the studio version of 'Piggy' for the first in a while, recently and was genuinely shocked to realise that "hey motherfucking pig" isn't in the second verse.

Piggy is one of the songs where I never listen to the studio version of it unless i am listening to the album in full. The studio version is so dull to me. The vocals in the live versions are so much better.

[WorzelG]

I remember listening to the Ghosts Piggy version on the LITS tour and I could hear a slight hesitation at that part until he went on to sing ‘mother fucking pig’ like he was weighing up if he should sing that or not

[sheepdean]

Listening to the studio version of 'Piggy' for the first in a while, recently and was genuinely shocked to realise that "hey motherfucking pig" isn't in the second verse.

Terrible Lie not having "You [fucking] promised me" throws me sometimes too

[neorev]

Perhaps this has been said before, but a part of me would like to see a Nine Inch Nails / Muse tour. I know it seems like an odd pairing, but I think it could work.

[kel]

please no.

[iamclassic]

Terrible Lie not having "You [fucking] promised me" throws me sometimes too

When I'm singing along to it I just sing fucking promised. ... There's a little bit of time for it

[sheepdean]

Perhaps this has been said before, but a part of me would like to see a Nine Inch Nails / Muse tour. I know it seems like an odd pairing, but I think it could work.

Trent's vaguely anti-government stuff combined with Matt's literally insane anti-everything stuff? They'd just sit in a locked box scared of opening the door

[Ruined]

Seeing that clip of Robin singing most of "Shit Mirror," with Trent, just makes me excited to (hopefully) see it played live, in December!

[thevoid99]

please no.

I agree friend.

[eversonpoe]

"over and out" is what i wanted "while i'm still here" to be. i also think it has replaced "ripe (with decay)" as my favorite album-ending track on a NIN record. it gives me goosebumps every single time i hear it.

[Deacon Blackfire]

As I've said elsewhere, the trilogy is basically the exact opposite of Hesitation Marks, and Over and Out is definitely a perfect foil to While I'm Still Here. While I'm Still Here is a heartfelt and somewhat peaceful sense of resignation and acceptance of mortality as the void slowly creeps in and inevitably rends it all into oblivion. Over and Out, on the other hand, is this musical equivalent of idly twiddling your thumbs as you wait for the end, devoid of any meaning or purpose to populate what little time remains left with - and as opposed to Black Noise, which characterizes the oblivion that consumes the ending as terrifying and overpowering, the outro of Over and Out is almost alarmingly peaceful and as close to soothing as Bad Witch gets. As if the only peace our foul species can hope to achieve is in death, and the potential in that blackness of nonexistence for something less tainted than us to emerge.

Fun stuff!

[sheepdean]

As the only commonality between the trilogy is the word "World" in song titles, how about we call it the Worlds Trilogy?

Or World's End

[Pbgut]

As the only commonality between the trilogy is the word "World" in song titles, how about we call it the Worlds Trilogy?

Or World's End

I'm Not From This Dear Background World,

[ImTheWiseJanitor]

FUCK, "Shit Mirror" is incredible.

[Kyle]

They also all have the word "the" in a song title

[sweeterthan]

They also all have the word "the" in a song title

The nine inch nails plays the shit mirror live for the first time Eva!

[GavinCollins420]

Has anyone listened to the debut album from SOPHIE that came out this month? (Fucking great album by the way.)

https://open.spotify.com/track/3JcAm...TSOrYEPaQPODUQ

The last track, Whole New World/Pretend World does this thing where the main beat degrades and disappears over time until it's just an ambient whirring sound. Reminded me of The Background World, but kind of the opposite end of it where it gets taken apart piece by piece rather than becoming a behemoth wall of noise.

Even the title is similar!

Could, obviously, just all be in my head, but thought it was worth mentioning.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk

[Alabaster Creature]

Has anyone listened to the debut album from SOPHIE that came out this month? (Fucking great album by the way.)

https://open.spotify.com/track/3JcAm...TSOrYEPaQPODUQ

The last track, Whole New World/Pretend World does this thing where the main beat degrades and disappears over time until it's just an ambient whirring sound. Reminded me of The Background World, but kind of the opposite end of it where it gets taken apart piece by piece rather than becoming a behemoth wall of noise.

Even the title is similar!

Could, obviously, just all be in my head, but thought it was worth mentioning.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk

[Initial Writing] Hey I posted about this record. [Written Later] So I am going to type out a mini-essay on this apparently. If you do not want an analysis that is not grounded in actual music theory, and instead solely attempts to give specific language to aesthetic and textural choices: skip this.

This particular, broadly defined dynamic, of a dense and noisy section into a sparser more ambient verse that you bring up, is if not common, a known "trope." Lots of post-rock songs have a similar, if perhaps distinct from what you are describing, dynamic. Gradual deterioration as a concept of course rears it's head in other Reznor stuff, from off-the-top-of-my-head, like . I am not sure any other commercially available SOPHIE songs (there may be a bootleg) do this, but some of her PC Music contemporaries have certainly done stuff that lands or nearly lands in ambient territory like the final sections of both these songs. Without diving into the PC music backcatalog, I'd say the bridge of AG Cook's gets "pretty ambient." Though my head actually goes somewhere else specific with regards to the outro of the Add Violence track.

'The Background World's' perhaps most obvious point of comparison RE: degradation for me, was the The Disintegration Loops. With the final section of that song clearly looping as it degrades. It's possible that this a common influence, if not the origin of these specific ideas on these specific songs. The two hypothetical arguments that Mr. Reznor and Ms. Xeon probably know Disintegration Loops, look really similar. Though this is not a SOPHIE board so I'll just do the latter. I suspect Sophie is familiar with William Basinski's work if only because she's an "acclaimed experimental electronic musician", and the degree of creative curiosity it takes to cultivate the imagination to ever end up in that space (being acclaimed) means she's probably heard his work before. Basinski's work is a big deal in ambient and avant-garde spaces, she's at least got to have absorbed some influence from him second-hand¹. Though at the same time I have to now acknowledge there's lots other possible influences here.

Like I already said, lots of music does this. Particularly in more fringe genres, to try and prove that point here's from this year that does something similar. But I think you're getting at something more specific. I mean, the degradation in one of my earlier examples 'Closer to God,' is way simpler than in either of the two songs you were originally comparing. Neither is just letting some effect ring-out/feedback to provide a drone, both songs are specifically arranged to eventually create that effect. It's not just changes on the timbre level, but also what instrumentation is present. The drums, the lead synth, and the "lead" vox parts finish or fade out on the Sop

The way Sophie breaks things down on 'Whole New World/Pretend World' feels very "modern" it reminds of Arca, Lotic, and other "deconstructed club music" I do not think people that was ever really named ever given a genre label that stuck for good and/or bad. It is then filtered through some Tim Hecker-y, or Ben Frost like droning music we also have also apparently not reached consensus on what language to use for (ambient, goth, dance)². Reznor's version of this "degrad[ing]" is more rooted in "industrial" proper to me: it recalls the music of Coil et al. as that's where so much of his palette seems to come from. Describing NIN as "industrial" is A) not novel at all B) definitely open to argument, but please go with me here. Now, industrial I think clearly influenced many people the first two """movements"''' I have described here. Though there is a distinction worth noting³. If I am going to reductively give the commonality here, all of this stuff is from the deliberately messier ends of electronic music.

But these songs are not only their instrumentation they have clear texts in the form of their song titles and lyrics. Both those songs also have "world" in their titles, which reflects their length and scope. Though that word's thematic purpose in both songs is different. We all know this is long, so right to the point: SOPHIE's "world" is if not one of her own creation, one she is ushering in via this album and this specific song, which in some ways feels like a distillation of her earlier material. In contrast Reznor seems to have no agency over or within "the background world," he can draw attention to it, but it looms over him. Both "worlds" are anxious, in the NIN song because of apparent creeping doom, and in the SOPHIE song because of of the implied endless possibility space that is emerging.

Both songs need their scope to make that transition you highlight actually register as a real moment, and that moment also enables and underlines that apparent scope. I mean they both crack nine minutes. Thematically they need that moment because they are both about emergence of new and more ambiguous or ambivalent ways of being into our lives. SOPHIE did similar drone work on 'Pretending' but it was still pretty new material for her as of this record. I had never heard NIN take this particular method to making drone before 'The Background World.' They both enter new (to them!), droning, sonic spaces on these songs. While we're talking theme, I think gender is crucial to both SOPHIE and NIN, if not the 'The Background World' particularly.

I think I have only just begun to establish a context in which both SOPHIE and NIN can be contained, but doing that well is still a much bigger effort. I think and hope this compare and contrast illuminates both songs more. Thanks for spurring my lengthy thoughts on this, thanks to anyone who indulges me by reading this.
(hey do you like SOPHIE and noisy music? Find this by searching "SOPHIE" on this board? Read this essay by somebody that is not me)

1. This is kind of gossipy, but I have also gotten the impression that Alessandro Cortini and Basinski are professionally familiar at least.
2. My feeling is that these two spaces are broadly recognized as kinds of super-genres, but if pressed I will cede that maybe this is a stretch. Also hey, if we're being cynical we could say this whole essay is a stretch, but I'm just trying to demonstrate self-awareness here.
3. There's also something to be said about trying to describe an artistic moment/movement/sub-genre/whatever by it's edges instead of by it's core is often problematic. I think I've defined 'The Background World' and 'Whole New World/Pretend World' by their cores okay already and I need to be finishing this.

[ChipRock]

Seeing a few comments with regards to Trent playing sax on Bad Witch, so I'd just like to declare my approval of more saxophone in Nine Inch Nails records. It would be awesome.

This leads me to the sax scene (LOL) in Lost Highway. Looking this up just now I read that Pullman does actually play that solo, despite having not played the instrument before. Possibly untrue, but if so then I want a Pullman / Reznor duet on a Lost Highway influenced jam session for the next tour. I'd crowdfund that shit.

[GavinCollins420]

[Initial Writing] Hey I posted about this record. [Written Later] So I am going to type out a mini-essay on this apparently. If you do not want an analysis that is not grounded in actual music theory, and instead solely attempts to give specific language to aesthetic and textural choices: skip this.

This particular, broadly defined dynamic, of a dense and noisy section into a sparser more ambient verse that you bring up, is if not common, a known "trope." Lots of post-rock songs have a similar, if perhaps distinct from what you are describing, dynamic. Gradual deterioration as a concept of course rears it's head in other Reznor stuff, from off-the-top-of-my-head, like . I am not sure any other commercially available SOPHIE songs (there may be a bootleg) do this, but some of her PC Music contemporaries have certainly done stuff that lands or nearly lands in ambient territory like the final sections of both these songs. Without diving into the PC music backcatalog, I'd say the bridge of AG Cook's gets "pretty ambient." Though my head actually goes somewhere else specific with regards to the outro of the Add Violence track.

'The Background World's' perhaps most obvious point of comparison RE: degradation for me, was the The Disintegration Loops. With the final section of that song clearly looping as it degrades. It's possible that this a common influence, if not the origin of these specific ideas on these specific songs. The two hypothetical arguments that Mr. Reznor and Ms. Xeon probably know Disintegration Loops, look really similar. Though this is not a SOPHIE board so I'll just do the latter. I suspect Sophie is familiar with William Basinski's work if only because she's an "acclaimed experimental electronic musician", and the degree of creative curiosity it takes to cultivate the imagination to ever end up in that space (being acclaimed) means she's probably heard his work before. Basinski's work is a big deal in ambient and avant-garde spaces, she's at least got to have absorbed some influence from him second-hand¹. Though at the same time I have to now acknowledge there's lots other possible influences here.

Like I already said, lots of music does this. Particularly in more fringe genres, to try and prove that point here's from this year that does something similar. But I think you're getting at something more specific. I mean, the degradation in one of my earlier examples 'Closer to God,' is way simpler than in either of the two songs you were originally comparing. Neither is just letting some effect ring-out/feedback to provide a drone, both songs are specifically arranged to eventually create that effect. It's not just changes on the timbre level, but also what instrumentation is present. The drums, the lead synth, and the "lead" vox parts finish or fade out on the Sop

The way Sophie breaks things down on 'Whole New World/Pretend World' feels very "modern" it reminds of Arca, Lotic, and other "deconstructed club music" I do not think people that was ever really named ever given a genre label that stuck for good and/or bad. It is then filtered through some Tim Hecker-y, or Ben Frost like droning music we also have also apparently not reached consensus on what language to use for (ambient, goth, dance)². Reznor's version of this "degrad[ing]" is more rooted in "industrial" proper to me: it recalls the music of Coil et al. as that's where so much of his palette seems to come from. Describing NIN as "industrial" is A) not novel at all B) definitely open to argument, but please go with me here. Now, industrial I think clearly influenced many people the first two """movements"''' I have described here. Though there is a distinction worth noting³. If I am going to reductively give the commonality here, all of this stuff is from the deliberately messier ends of electronic music.

But these songs are not only their instrumentation they have clear texts in the form of their song titles and lyrics. Both those songs also have "world" in their titles, which reflects their length and scope. Though that word's thematic purpose in both songs is different. We all know this is long, so right to the point: SOPHIE's "world" is if not one of her own creation, one she is ushering in via this album and this specific song, which in some ways feels like a distillation of her earlier material. In contrast Reznor seems to have no agency over or within "the background world," he can draw attention to it, but it looms over him. Both "worlds" are anxious, in the NIN song because of apparent creeping doom, and in the SOPHIE song because of of the implied endless possibility space that is emerging.

Both songs need their scope to make that transition you highlight actually register as a real moment, and that moment also enables and underlines that apparent scope. I mean they both crack nine minutes. Thematically they need that moment because they are both about emergence of new and more ambiguous or ambivalent ways of being into our lives. SOPHIE did similar drone work on 'Pretending' but it was still pretty new material for her as of this record. I had never heard NIN take this particular method to making drone before 'The Background World.' They both enter new (to them!), droning, sonic spaces on these songs. While we're talking theme, I think gender is crucial to both SOPHIE and NIN, if not the 'The Background World' particularly.

I think I have only just begun to establish a context in which both SOPHIE and NIN can be contained, but doing that well is still a much bigger effort. I think and hope this compare and contrast illuminates both songs more. Thanks for spurring my lengthy thoughts on this, thanks to anyone who indulges me by reading this.

1. This is kind of gossipy, but I have also gotten the impression that Alessandro Cortini and Basinski are professionally familiar at least.
2. My feeling is that these two spaces are broadly recognized as kinds of super-genres, but if pressed I will cede that maybe this is a stretch. Also hey, if we're being cynical we could say this whole essay is a stretch, but I'm just trying to demonstrate self-awareness here.
3. There's also something to be said about trying to describe an artistic moment/movement/sub-genre/whatever by it's edges instead of by it's core is often problematic. I think I've defined 'The Background World' and 'Whole New World/Pretend World' by their cores okay already and I need to be finishing this.

Dude, you went above and beyond. Great read.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk

[spahn]

just wanted to give a HUGE THANKS! to @nmitchell86 for obtaining the BotP poster for me over in Vegas. Got me #119 and even threw in the Vegas magazine with the NIN article as well.

[nmitchell86]

just wanted to give a HUGE THANKS! to @nmitchell86 for obtaining the BotP poster for me over in Vegas. Got me #119 and even threw in the Vegas magazine with the NIN article as well.

No problem homie!

[neorev]

Trent should perform the trilogy in full live. Could be a cool way to visually flesh out the story being presented into a three act sorta play live. Give each act/section of the show its own distinct look and feel.

[StockAvuryah]

About the relation to Bowie, with Bad Witch.

The album "Heathen" is very relevant.

It was made in 2002 when Bowie was 55yo (Trent is now 53).

Bowie said that "the songs deal with the general feeling of anxiety that he'd had in America for a number of years".

And in the track "Afraid", the end lyrics are :

"I won't be Be afraid

Anymore
Anymore
Anymore"

--

And while I'm on this, here are some bits of Bowie tracks that reminds me of some Trent tracks :

In Scary Monsters (and Super Creeps) : "And I'll love her till the day she dies"

And in She's Gone Away : "Yeah, I was watching on the day she died"

In Ashes to Ashes : "Hitting an all-time low"

And in Hesitation Marks : "All Time Low"

In The Leon Suites (first suite, Leon takes us Outside): "But wait, I’m getting ahead of myself"

And in Bad Witch : "Ahead of Ourselves"