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Faceplams: Because Manson takes so much longer to write than Brian...
Active Member
Because Manson takes so much longer to write than Brian...
House Always Wins
This is old news but I'll happily buy it if it were a full artwork spread with a booklet and photographs out the yin yang. The High End of Low was a bland album but even had a redeeming quality in the packaging. Born Villain seemed like it was thrown together, which is sad because it's been in the work for over 2 years.
I just recently acquired a physical copy of Born Villain too so a deluxe edition would only garner a download from me unless the artwork is that amazing.
Stubby Member
Exactly,AS and MA had amazing packages,he souldn't release albums without artwork.I believe Manson's albums are experiences both musically/visually.
Mansonwiki posted this on facebook.Pretty amazing!
House Always Wins
Active Member
Nice , did Daisy post that? Hearing new acss era stuff after so long is great
Behold the morning star
I wonder if he did a track race recently. I was following them until he stopped.
Throbbing Member
Pretty cool, some of the lyrics went into The Apple of Sodom.
Matador de Froot Loops
(Not so) Random MM thought: I would love "D is for Dirty" (among many other rarities) in a deluxe edition for Antichrist Superstar!
Stubby Member
They lost the master tapes to the recording so AS will probably will probably never get a remaster or remix. Sucks really, I always thought of that album as The Downward Spiral's sequel!
Resident Asshole
They lost the master tapes? How did this happen?
i'm too thin
The story is that some random producer whose name rhymes with "Rent Friendster" destroyed them.Originally Posted by NotoriousTIMP
Resident Asshole
What? Why the hell would this producer do something like that?
Stubby Member
It's so fucking cool to hear this. I'd truly love to hear everything left over from this era. Shit. So cool.
Active Member
I remember something about a flood at nothing studios and then Manson saying Reznor did it deliberately
Resident Asshole
Is that why the two are at ends with one another? I still don't understand the whole feud with those two. Either way, that's a same that the masters and gone. That album needs a remaster!
Active Member
Pff... Poor show expecting some guy you've publicly slagged off to look after your master tapes for over a decade. And no duplicates made of them? Really the acsss tapes would be one of mm's key assets, why didn't he sort it out earlier
Quiet Member
I know it's not a popular opinion around here and I've gotten lots of shit for it from the douchier elements of this community, but it's worth repeating and I at least have half an idea of wtf I'm talking about.
As much as I absolutely LOVE his artistic output and always will, Trent Reznor is a hypocritical fucking scumbag for whatever part he played in the loss of the masters for Portrait of an American Family, Smells Like Children, and Antichrist Superstar.
Reznor's spent his ENTIRE CAREER bitching about record labels interfering with and destroying his art, yet whether through sins of omission or commission -- depending on his level of involvement -- he is ultimately responsible for EXACTLY that. Could've been deliberate, could've been negligence, could've been someone else...but it happened under HIS roof and under HIS watch.
Inexcusable.
Furthermore, anyone claiming "Oops, Katrina" is full of shit and needs to check their timeline. Katrina happened in '05 and the masters were discovered to be "missing" during the prep work for Lest We Forget, which was released in '04. So more than likely they'd been looking for them probably as early as '03. Their mysterious "disappearance" had NOTHING to do with Hurricane Katrina.
And has anyone else from Nothing had trouble finding their masters? Is NIN missing three albums worth of masters that Interscope can't track down for their upcoming greatest hits collection? Even one? Nope, nope, and NOPE. Looks like the devastating loss is solely isolated to the case of the guy who the owner of Nothing was already publicly engaged with in a bitter feud. Hmm. Funny how that works.
But anyway.
While I do agree that interesting packaging has obviously been an important element in Manson's output, I disagree that it's crucial to their output. The music supports itself and I think that with Born Villain being such a strong outing for the band the bare-bones packaging wasn't such a bad idea. Kind of a big FUCK, YOU to anyone who tries to criticize the band and the music for being "all about the image" or whatever.
And then of course there's the financial realities of Born Villain being the band's first release as an independent entity in an era of nearly non-existent sales for physical music media. With the prevalence of album piracy and iTunes how much does anyone really expect a band with no real label backing them to spend on fluff like packaging? Someone also mentioned the simplistic packaging of With Teeth earlier and even though NIN was still on Interscope I believe the comparison holds, given the industry climate at the time and "comeback" nature of the release. Definitely worth mentioning.
In short, I'd be excited about more elaborate packaging too, but given how great the album itself is it seems pretty petty to complain about the meal's wrapper, if you will.
And we also have the "link" in the liner notes to a decent website with the lyrics and videos and artwork and stuff. As with With Teeth I don't particularly care for the expectation that fans from all over the world can just dig around on the internet as easily as they can open a CD case...but that's another matter and it's something, at least.
FUCKING BADASS.
Missed the TrackRace, thanks for the link!
Don't forget "Deformography" and "Dried Up, Tied and Dead to the World," it was pretty interesting to hear all three of those songs mixed-and-matched together in their larval stages. I just love hearing work-in-progress stuff like this. Moar, plz!!!
100% agreed!
Despite the aforementioned missing masters, it's still not entirely impossible to remix and/or quasi-remaster what source material IS available, and even if it's merely re-released "as is" there's obviously PLENTY of demo and live material out therer for a bonus disc to accompany the album, not to mention videos for a DVD.
Repackage the original with a bonus disc and make some new liner notes and lyric sheet material with the the absolute GLUT of alternate artwork and photography from that era it would still be a MUST HAVE item for any fan with or without a bona fide remastering.
Fingers = crossed!
Also, in case somebody here missed it, anyone who was excited about "D is for Dirty" should DEFINITELY check out "P is for Porno," too. Daisy leaked it months and months ago and it's clearly a companion/alternate/refined version of the newly leaked demo:
Administrator
And in the end, Interscope still were able to add songs from aforementioned "lost" albums on LWF, and particularly ACSS songs do sound pretty improved to my ears. Whoa, how'd they do it?
I just wonder, all this pile of shit comes from where? Some Manson quote from that era? Can you even bring it, the quote? And suddenly it's not just ASCC but three albums? Please, get the fuck out.
Quiet Member
Again with the douchebags that don't know wtf they're talking about here, what a surprise.
It was always the case that it was Manson's first three albums from their partnership with Nothing which had gone missing, ever since that fact was first brought to light.
Took all of 15 seconds to track down the quote, ffs:
Full interview here.Have you considered re-releasing any of your older albums with remastered tracks, b-sides, and other goodies? Antichrist Superstar turns ten years old next year - any possibility of fans getting to hear an improved mix of this milestone album in the future?
I’d like to say yes, but there’s a legal matter pending that I can’t say too much about. It’s very hard to believe this, but representatives from Nothing Records have indicated that they are not able to find or have lost the master recordings to my first three records and without me saying my feelings on that, I think people should just understand what that means and what kind of respect and what kind of people would go to such lengths or not go to such lengths to let something like that happen, because it’s not something that you would ever have happen in musical history. I would imagine something like that could only be intentional or, if not intentional, it would have to be done only through complete disregard. Now that Nothing Records doesn’t exist, I think there’s only one of two people responsible for that. Out of those two people, there’s only one that really has an opinion of me that is voiced very often and I don’t have an opinion that is voiced very often. In fact, the last thing I said was very nice and I remember doing a favor for a friend. So I don’t know why people would do something like that, but I’m often painted as the bad guy in a relationship – in most relationships. I will not deny that I am an asshole at times. I will not deny that I’m probably completely insane and most people will agree with that. I don’t betray people that I care about. I don’t forsake people that are important to me and I would do anything for someone I love, but I don’t know what kind of people do things like that. It’s erasing history. It’s erasing your life’s work. It’s killing a part of you.
And like I'd already mentioned, it is of course possible to essentially reverse engineer new "masters" from the existing tracks. Someone from this very board once mentioned that same fact with regards to this discussion concerning some cobbled-together quasi-masters for a Garbage album, I believe it was. With mixed-results, needless to say.
Not to mention the fact that most of the tracks remastered from those three albums for Lest We Forget were able to be found because they were duped for use as singles and soundtrack contributions...in other words NOT from the actual ALBUM masters.
So kindly try and keep up or just STFU, thanks.
Last edited by Hazekiah; 01-06-2013 at 07:17 PM.
Active Member
Hmm, legal issues, 2005 interview...did it ever occur to you that John Malm might be to blame here instead of Trent? Or is it just easier to blame him because that's what gets people more riled up?
FATUM NOS IUNGET
Yeah I've read that before. If true, a dick move for sure, regardless of whatever spat there was, it's worthy of a slap upside the back of the head. Isn't it all just hearsay though? If MM had any grounds legally whatsoever, he seems like the guy that would've done something about it instead of just hurl an accusation. Not a slight, I just feel that if there was anything there legally, something would've happened. Maybe something was attempted but never got very fair in the courts or whatever. No need to get defensive. You may or may not have realized that this is the only music thread on this entire forum where anything remotely negative said brings the fanboy whining like nowhere else. In any other thread there is good AND bad shit discussed about the artist, but any opposing view here just makes a select few do nothing but piss and moan. It's pretty stale at this point.
Quiet Member
Hmm, did it ever occur to you to actually process what you've read?
Or is it just easier to blame someone for not qualifying a statement that was already clearly and appropriately qualified at the outset just because you're all riled up?
:P
FATUM NOS IUNGET
Meh, it's still hearsay. Manson could say he was from Mars and people would buy in to it. Show me proof or GTFO.
Active Member
Exactly. Besides, if anyone is to blame, it's probably John Malm. Considering all the shit that went down between him and Trent, it wouldn't surprise me if that stuff was lost in the shuffle. I highly doubt Trent was concerned about destroying the masters when he was in the middle of a lawsuit and also dealing with his own personal issues. Sorry, but I just don't see him standing over a fire and dumping the master tapes in while twirling his non-existent mustache.
Active Member
who knows what is going on... Malm binning the tapes for a big hitter of reznors sort of makes sense, but did he have access? If were in tin foil hat land, maybe manson somehow binned them to eliminate a possiblity of reznor making money off a future acss remaster (i dont believe this but i just want to point out the wealth of possiblities)
and haz ease up with the "stfu if you dont know what youre talking about stuff", remember you are standing there blaming reznor when you have no idea what happened either, you weren't there. Maybe somebody broke into the studio while he was away, maybe it was an accident of some kind... Sounds unlikely of course, but nonetheless we cannot know for sure either way
really the pair of them are tits, reznor for not being a responsible custodian and manson for not giving enough of a shit about his biggest album to have copies made of the tapes
Behold the morning star
I dont think we would have seen the remasters regardless since two band members who had contribution would have probably not gotten paid. Manson has a record of not wanting to pay anybody.
Active Member
Yeah it sucks gidget got no credit for 1996. Did manson ever actually comment on his death?
Resident Asshole
Gidget died?
Active Member
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gidget_Gein#Death
Behold the morning star
That wiki article states he was on God Is In the TV home video. does anyone know when? Cant be the vids since Twiggy pretty much was in the band at that time.
