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View Full Version : Sheepdean calls someone a dick. You'll never guess what happens next!



sheepdean
04-17-2014, 06:54 AM
So considering how much unopened vinyl goes for nowadays for TSN and TGWTDT, i'm starting to think that vinyl for this new thing might be a good investment! buy a few, don't open them, then sell to rabid collectors and make a profit.It's a great way to be a dick, yeah

eversonpoe
04-17-2014, 08:14 AM
So considering how much unopened vinyl goes for nowadays for TSN and TGWTDT, i'm starting to think that vinyl for this new thing might be a good investment! buy a few, don't open them, then sell to rabid collectors and make a profit.
Also, trent said in an interview that he was working on a new project that would be released in the fall. Is this the project?
this is my second time asking...does no one care about good old eleveno anymore? He would really like to know the motherfucking answer!
Does anyone think it might be a new NIN album? Or perhaps How We Destroy Angles?

1. no one has answered your question because no one knows. it's probably this that he was referring to, but none of us are sure.

2. if you're going to buy vinyl just to flip it for a profit, you're a dick. and you've never come off as a dick before, so i really hope you were joking about that.

3. if you're going to buy vinyl for any reason, leaving it sealed (in shrink wrap) is a bad idea. you have to at least slit the side open, but the best thing to do is remove the shrink wrap and put it in a protective plastic cover (i recommend putting the plastic cover opening on the spine end of the record). if the sleeve is a tight fit around the discs, take them out and put them outside the sleeve, inside the plastic cover (this will avoid ring-wear and physical compression of the discs).

Prettybrokenspiral
05-07-2014, 09:49 PM
It's a great way to be a dick, yeah



2. if you're going to buy vinyl just to flip it for a profit, you're a dick. and you've never come off as a dick before, so i really hope you were joking about that.



i can't believe the two of you, @sheapdean and @eversonpoe (http://www.echoingthesound.org/community/member.php?u=588) , could possibly think i was serious...i wouldn't talk about flipping shit to rabid collectors in a forum of rabid collectors.


I don't see how flipping an LP for profit is being a dick. Any rabid collector of any musician is going to buy something like this from the jump. And if they don't, they should expect to pay an exorbitant price for it later if the market value increases.

sheepdean
05-07-2014, 10:34 PM
I don't see how flipping an LP for profit is being a dick. Any rabid collector of any musician is going to buy something like this from the jump. And if they don't, they should expect to pay an exorbitant price for it later if the market value increases.
Well I'm sorry that I don't always have $300 in my spending account ready to drop on an album? And it's a total fucking cunt move to flip an album ESPECIALLY if you're a fan of the band already, as you know how much a fellow fan would want it.

Prettybrokenspiral
05-07-2014, 10:45 PM
Well I'm sorry that I don't always have $300 in my spending account ready to drop on an album? And it's a total fucking cunt move to flip an album ESPECIALLY if you're a fan of the band already, as you know how much a fellow fan would want it.

Again, if you miss out on the first run of a rarity for whatever reason, it's only natural to expect to pay the increased-value price for it later. Any self-respecting fan of any band isn't going to gouge another fan of the band simply to turn a profit. At least, I would hope not..

I don't understand how, for instance, I'd be a cunt if I had an extra sealed copy of TSN that you wanted, and it goes for $300 on the market, so that's what I charge you for it. Just because you're also a fan doesn't mean I'm just going to knock $50 off the price; then I'd be getting ripped off.

It's just business, man. A record store owner doesn't give a fuck if you're Trent's lost brother; you're still going to pay handsomely for that sealed original of TDS or the Fragile.

sheepdean
05-07-2014, 10:53 PM
No, you wouldn't be getting ripped off if you sold it for anything less than what you paid + shipping. And if I go to a record store, I expect to pay commercial prices, that's their job. There's a big difference between having a copy you're willing to sell after the fact and buying bulk to flip straight to fans too.

Prettybrokenspiral
05-07-2014, 10:59 PM
Fret not, sheepdean. I'll be sure to pick up an extra copy of Gone Girl for you and then sell it to you at a steal when you have the money to pay for it.

Free shipping on me, too. I'm a swell fan like that.

jmtd
05-08-2014, 03:10 AM
Don't forget to ignore inflation!

Prettybrokenspiral
05-08-2014, 06:47 AM
Lol did that Sheepdean guy really facepalm my post directed specifically to Image13?

What a dick! He's definitely not getting free shipping on his Gone Girl order now.

eversonpoe
05-08-2014, 09:01 AM
Again, if you miss out on the first run of a rarity for whatever reason, it's only natural to expect to pay the increased-value price for it later. Any self-respecting fan of any band isn't going to gouge another fan of the band simply to turn a profit. At least, I would hope not..

I don't understand how, for instance, I'd be a cunt if I had an extra sealed copy of TSN that you wanted, and it goes for $300 on the market, so that's what I charge you for it. Just because you're also a fan doesn't mean I'm just going to knock $50 off the price; then I'd be getting ripped off.

It's just business, man. A record store owner doesn't give a fuck if you're Trent's lost brother; you're still going to pay handsomely for that sealed original of TDS or the Fragile.


No, you wouldn't be getting ripped off if you sold it for anything less than what you paid + shipping. And if I go to a record store, I expect to pay commercial prices, that's their job. There's a big difference between having a copy you're willing to sell after the fact and buying bulk to flip straight to fans too.

to me, the difference between being a record store owner (someone whose job it is to make a profit selling records) and being a fan (someone who appreciates the music and wants to own something unique) is vast.

i agree that, if you miss out on the first run of something, you're pretty much screwed, but i WISH that's not how it was. and it wouldn't be if people were less concerned with turning a profit and more concerned with helping out fellow fans.

for example, if i decided to sell my NM copy of with teeth on vinyl, i would probably sell it for about $50 (which is half of what the cheapest copy is on discogs right now). why? because when i bought it (the day it came out), i think i paid $25 or $30. i've kept it in good shape. i listened to it twice, i believe. and i'm not in it to make a massive profit. if someone who's a fan really wants it, and wants it more than me, the "market" dictating a ridiculously inflated price doesn't make it the right thing to do. but i'm also just a nice person, and i've always been willing to make sacrifices to make other people happy. i'd much rather have it in the hands of an appreciative fan than piss someone off because they had to pay me a shit ton of money for it.

:: shrug ::

i also think that there's a difference between buying something because you want it and then selling it later, and buying something with the INTENT to sell it (at a profit) later.

Leviathant
05-08-2014, 10:34 AM
Nice job spilling whine all over the Gone Girl soundtrack thread.

Pro-tip: Want to invest your money? Don't buy and hold on to recordings on vinyl... talk to a financial planner.

theimage13
05-08-2014, 01:27 PM
Nice job spilling whine all over the Gone Girl soundtrack thread.

Pro-tip: Want to invest your money? Don't buy and hold on to recordings on vinyl... talk to a financial planner.

Yeah...counting on a bunch of aging hipsters - who can barely afford Ramen noodles after paying off their student loans - to sweep in and pay collectors fees for records isn't exactly a safe bet for the future.

However, I'll admit to scalping on two occasions while I was in college. Each time, it was a matter of fully intending to go to a show, finding out I couldn't, then putting the tickets on ebay and letting the free market decide what they were worth. I'm not proud of it, but when you're paying thousands of a year out of pocket for tuition and working part time at a barely minimum wage job, accepting a few extra dollars that have been voluntarily offered to you isn't the biggest dick move in the world in my opinion. And let's face it -a reseller isn't going to put in the highest bid and then try to get more, so the tickets still wound up with fans - just those who were better positioned financially. (Although now that I'm slightly less broke, I'm willing to take a loss on, or even give away, tickets that I can't use, as I just had to do a couple weeks ago.)

RhettButler
05-08-2014, 02:33 PM
I don't see how flipping an LP for profit is being a dick. Any rabid collector of any musician is going to buy something like this from the jump. And if they don't, they should expect to pay an exorbitant price for it later if the market value increases.

Agreed. Sorry Sheepdean, but I don't see what the problem is.

I bought two copies of the Nevermind super-deluxe set--one for my collection and one that I might sell in a few years if its valuable. A lot of people sell baseball cards, campaign and movie memorabilia, comics, classic cars and all kinds of stuff for a profit. No one is forcing anyone to buy anything.

I've spent 50-100 bucks on OOP CDs and bootlegs. They cost what they cost and no one forced me to buy them.

Jinsai
05-08-2014, 03:58 PM
I buy records because I like listening to them, but I can't fault people who are collectors. I see it as the same kind of thing as stamp collectors or baseball cards (is that still a thing?). It's not my thing... I generally don't like owning records that are so valuable that I cannot justify playing them. It's a hobby, and in general it's not a very reliably profitable one, but I don't view it as being on par with something like ticket scalping, which is definitely a lame thing.

Mantra
05-08-2014, 04:33 PM
i also think that there's a difference between buying something because you want it and then selling it later, and buying something with the INTENT to sell it (at a profit) later.

Yeah, this.

Like there was this dude who found a place selling a new Burial vinyl single at a much cheaper price than usual (like 60% less), so he bought the store's entire stock and is now waiting a couple years, because Burial's shit always sells out and then gets insanely expensive. I really can't see how that's any different than ticket scalping.

If you find a piece of music and just see an investment opportunity, you're part of the problem. Just cause it has a certain amount of crude market logic doesn't mean it's not parasitic.

aggroculture
05-08-2014, 04:44 PM
Didn't we already have this conversation with SIRLONDONCLEANLILLY a while back?

RhettButler
05-08-2014, 04:57 PM
If you find a piece of music and just see an investment opportunity, you're part of the problem. Just cause it has a certain amount of crude market logic doesn't mean it's not parasitic.
Would that also apply to baseball cards and comics?

sheepdean
05-08-2014, 07:05 PM
Would that also apply to baseball cards and comics?
Baseball cards exist to be collected. Vinyl, and other things people buy to use, are not just collector's pieces. Sure, people collect them, but people collect all kinds of things. Think of stamp collecting, if someone bought ALL first class stamps in the US, to sell to both collectors and people who simply want to use them, would that be ok because it's just investments? Dick. Moves.


And as I think I said, if you have something that appreciates in value and you choose to sell, that's very different to buying bulk or buying multiples with the intention of selling to people who, had they had the chance, would've just bought first time round.


Related: I really fucking hate intentionally limited runs of things (Ghosts LE etc), because it causes this exact problem. If someone were to buy 500 of a non-limited run, they'd just press more and then the scalper gets nowt.

RhettButler
05-08-2014, 07:55 PM
But I don't think that elevenism is going to buy 5k copies of a record. Sounds like he wanted to buy a few records and wait a few years and sell them. Seems pretty harmless.

I will say one thing, sheepdean, you would make a horrible Ferengi.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvFYBkesqGU

sheepdean
05-08-2014, 08:09 PM
That's true, but if there's 2500 copies (the usual amount, though I have some limited records from 100 or even 50 runs), then just a handful could be a fairly large chunk ya know?

And I love DS9, but I'm happy to not be a Ferengi :P

Ryan
05-08-2014, 08:32 PM
Stop picking on my lil sheepdean.

RhettButler
05-08-2014, 08:33 PM
Stop picking on my lil sheepdean.

He's a big boy, he'll be okay.

RhettButler
05-08-2014, 08:35 PM
That's true, but if there's 2500 copies (the usual amount, though I have some limited records from 100 or even 50 runs), then just a handful could be a fairly large chunk ya know?

And I love DS9, but I'm happy to not be a Ferengi :P
Would you rather be a Vorta or a Cardassian?

sheepdean
05-08-2014, 08:53 PM
I feel there might be a star trek thread

Also, Cardassian, Vorta never seem happy with their lots and are programmed to worship the Founders, whereas Cardassians are more fleshed out and have a society, it's not the fault of individuals that their governance is in the shitter.

Mantra
05-08-2014, 09:18 PM
Would that also apply to baseball cards and comics?
Yeah, kind of. I mean, it's not some horrible tragedy, but I do think it's a little parasitic. I could go buy 5 copies of some rare comic and flip them on ebay and make $100 profit on each one, but it's not like I actually did anything to deserve the extra cash from those people. It's just opportunism, where I'm squeezing them for more cash just because I can, cause I know they can't get it anywhere else for cheaper.

I mean, it honestly isn't all that different from scalping. Scalpers know that when the tickets are all sold out they'll be able to jack up the price and turn a profit. It's a different commodity, but it is literally the EXACT same process.

Leviathant
05-09-2014, 08:23 AM
Every time I have the opportunity to flip something like this, I just can't pull myself to do it. I've been on the other side too many times, and appreciate it when things that shouldn't cost hundreds of dollars don't. This is probably why I still don't have "For Your Consideration" copies of TSN or TGWTDT, and definitely why when I got a box of "Still" CDs and super cheap deluxe Hesitation Marks CDs, I gave them all away. (Well, most of them, I have leftovers). That's a personal choice, though. Just because my own economic situation has improved in the last two decades that I can afford to do stuff like that doesn't mean I necessarily look down on people who sell for an absurd profit. Some people get stuck in unfortunate situations and that's one way they can help get out of them. For other people, it may be a symptom of a larger money-and-priority management problem.

Mantra
05-09-2014, 12:42 PM
^Right, well for that matter even ticket scalpers may have understandable reasons. It's not about getting all moralistic and judgmental, I just think it's strange that some people think there's nothing even remotely unethical about this type of thing. If you're intentionally grabbing rare vinyls (or whatever item) with the intent of flipping them for a way higher price later on, you are ripping people off. Maybe you have totally sympathetic reasons for doing so, and that's alright, but we don't need to pretend that this is honest work for honest pay. It's still a bit of a scam.

RhettButler
05-09-2014, 12:50 PM
I have little tolerance for ticket scalpers--they're bastards. Buying tickets in bulk and selling them far above face value is just wrong. A few years ago Garbage played the Paradise in Boston (holds about 1000 people) and it sold out in under a second. About a third of tickets were on stubhub at about 3-4x what they were originally sold for. That's way, way different than buying a few copies of a record and waiting a few years and selling it at a profit, IMO.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 01:01 PM
How is it different? Commodity is in limited amount and in demand, someone sees an opportunity to turn a profit. And hell, remember the prices of Ghosts LE the following few months after it sold out? This isn't always waiting years, this can often be waiting days (as a vinyl lover, Record Store Day is an example of this where on the same DAY items can quadruple in cost).

RhettButler
05-09-2014, 01:26 PM
How is it different? Commodity is in limited amount and in demand, someone sees an opportunity to turn a profit. And hell, remember the prices of Ghosts LE the following few months after it sold out? This isn't always waiting years, this can often be waiting days (as a vinyl lover, Record Store Day is an example of this where on the same DAY items can quadruple in cost).
Because Boston area Garbage fans didn't even have a chance to buy tickets. Everyone who went (excluding reporters, radio DJs, etc) had to pay a fortune. This thread is about a guy who wanted to "buy a few" copies of a record and sell it down the line, not really the same thing. Elevenism didn't ruin anyone's chances of buying these records when they were first released. If he had bought 5000 records and then sold them at a profit, yeah, that would be a dick move, but he didn't. He talked about buying a few, when they were still available, and then waiting a few years and selling them. It's the same when people buy comics or baseball cards and sell them a few years later at a profit.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 01:34 PM
Elevenism didn't ruin anyone's chances that's true, but how many people with the same idea does it take before it is ruined? Let's say everyone buys 10, that's 250 people and they're all gone. It's the same concept as scalping tickets, the only difference is you can play the long game with records.

RhettButler
05-09-2014, 01:41 PM
Elevenism didn't ruin anyone's chances that's true, but how many people with the same idea does it take before it is ruined? Let's say everyone buys 10, that's 250 people and they're all gone. It's the same concept as scalping tickets, the only difference is you can play the long game with records.


But not everyone buys 10, very few in fact will. My impression is that this guy wanted to buy 2-3 copies of a record and then sell it in a few years. So what? There's a million things that are limited edition that people buy in hopes of selling down the line at a profit. It's just how it is.

I think that we are going to have to agree to disagree, my friend.

sick among the pure
05-09-2014, 03:45 PM
~anecdote time~

Wave Goodbye Chicago
I was pre-sale
in line early enough to have been on the rail in front of Robin
instantly went to merch table
the posters were already gone because there was no limit, so people bought as many as they could carry
posters show up on eBay the next day for $100+ each

People bought up a bunch of something to turn around and make a profit off. 98%+ of the people there that night had no chance to buy it outright, so they were faced with a few hundred precent markup because someone was being a dick.

Buying something that you want, and could be worth more money someday if you want to sell it, I get that.
Buying something, or a bunch of something, just to keep supply low and demand high, to turn a profit on it, that's a dick move.


Love the thread title, btw. ;)

Mantra
05-09-2014, 05:20 PM
I just don't see why people should make money off these items. If a seller does some work (i.e: fixing up a car), I can totally understand wanting to be compensated for their labor. They've added real value to the item by improving it, so the higher price is justified. But people who just buy stuff for a nickel and wait til they can sell it for a dime, what exactly have they done to justify that profit?

screwdriver
05-09-2014, 05:44 PM
If I decide tomorrow to sell my Dragon Tattoo vinyl, I don't see what the problem is with putting it on ebay and letting the market do whatever it wants

but if I bought 20 of them when it came out, just for the purpose of doing that? that seems like a real dick move.


the same logic goes for tickets, it seems to me: if I buy two for me and my lady, but we can't go -- fuck it, put it on ebay and see what happens. if I bought 20, to scalp? fuck me.

this doesn't seem hard. like most things in life, you can profit by being a dick, but don't be upset if people call you a dick.

Prettybrokenspiral
05-09-2014, 09:09 PM
How is it different? Commodity is in limited amount and in demand, someone sees an opportunity to turn a profit. And hell, remember the prices of Ghosts LE the following few months after it sold out? This isn't always waiting years, this can often be waiting days (as a vinyl lover, Record Store Day is an example of this where on the same DAY items can quadruple in cost).

This is the way the market has always worked. Why are you so butthurt about this?

When a band releases a "limited edition pressing" of anything, be it a box set, colored vinyl, etc., why do you think they do it? To turn a profit, because that's business. They don't care who buys it and what happens to it afterwards, just like the guy who is re-selling this limited edition item doesn't care who buys it or what they do with it. As long as they're getting paid.

Nobody is going to hatchet the price down just because you think it's unfair or unscrupulous. That's why anything that's valuable is marketed as "limited edition": so that it sells and so that profits are made.

sick among the pure
05-09-2014, 09:23 PM
why do you think they do it? To turn a profit, because that's business. They don't care who buys it and what happens to it afterwards, just like the guy who is re-selling this limited edition item doesn't care who buys it or what they do with it. As long as they're getting paid.

Exactly why Trent came up with name on ticket instant entry presale tickets, am I rite?
Except Trent does care about his fans being over-charged by dicks looking to make a profit. He saw people buying up all the good tickets they could, to turn a profit and sell them to fans at radically inflated prices, so he did something to stop them.

The one butthurt in here is you.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 09:34 PM
I 100% agree that LEs are to turn a profit (DE of Ghosts: $75, Vinyl of Ghosts: $30, ∴ either giclée prints cost $200 or Trent was slightly inflating prices), but that's profit on part of the artist. If they didn't care about the fans, they'd reprint an LE, they'd say "well that was 1-2500, now they've sold well here's 2501-3000 for only a little more".

And I know people aren't going to stop just because I think it's a dick move, but that doesn't change that it's totally a dick move. Either the item will sell out right away, meaning the person buying bulk was preventing others from getting it, or it won't and the person is trying to remove them all from the market to drive up prices. If you do it to make some money, you're not breaking any laws (probably), and sometimes you might need to make some money for personal reasons. Doesn't make it a decent thing to do, ESPECIALLY if you're a fellow fan.

(am I just repeating myself?)

Prettybrokenspiral
05-09-2014, 09:35 PM
Exactly why Trent came up with name on ticket instant entry presale tickets, am I rite?
Except Trent does care about his fans being over-charged by dicks looking to make a profit. He saw people buying up all the good tickets they could, to turn a profit and sell them to fans at radically inflated prices, so he did something to stop them.

The one butthurt in here is you.

Are we talking about tickets or are we talking about vinyl? Did TR do anything to equalize the Ghosts/TGWTDT boxsets? I'm thinking no...because I was able to buy two of each. Some bands (Jesu and Hum come readily to mind) DO put a limit on how many limited edition items a person is allowed to buy from them (one item per buyer).

And I'm interested to hear your logic behind your claim that I'm the one who's sore here. Especially when we seem to be talking about two different things entirely.

Mantra
05-09-2014, 09:46 PM
When a band releases a "limited edition pressing" of anything, be it a box set, colored vinyl, etc., why do you think they do it? To turn a profit, because that's business. They don't care who buys it and what happens to it afterwards, just like the guy who is re-selling this limited edition item doesn't care who buys it or what they do with it. As long as they're getting paid.

Yeah but the band is profiting because they did real work and created something. The dude who just buys up a bunch of rare shit so he can jack up the price later on hasn't actually earned that money, which is why I think he's kind of a scammer.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 09:51 PM
Are we talking about tickets or are we talking about vinyl?We're talking about an item of limited quantity. Tickets and vinyl are basically the same with this argument, if you can defend buying bulk to flip, your logic applies exactly the same to support scalping.

allegro
05-09-2014, 09:52 PM
You guys are communists. You wouldn't survive 5 seconds in my world of real estate. "Here, take my house, I wouldn't want to make a profit off a fan, that would be too capitalist of me. Here, have some oat bran."

Prettybrokenspiral
05-09-2014, 10:05 PM
You guys are communists. You wouldn't survive 5 seconds in my world of real estate. "Here, take my house, I wouldn't want to make a profit off a fan, that would be too capitalist of me. Here, have some oat bran."

I agree 100%. I was just about to use real estate as an analogy, but now I don't have to.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 10:05 PM
I'm a socialist and proud~

Mantra
05-09-2014, 10:06 PM
You guys are communists. You wouldn't survive 5 seconds in my world of real estate. "Here, take my house, I wouldn't want to make a profit off a fan, that would be too capitalist of me. Here, have some oat bran."

No offense, but like...the real estate industry isn't exactly the most shining example of ethical business practices. Jeez.

Prettybrokenspiral
05-09-2014, 10:24 PM
We're talking about an item of limited quantity. Tickets and vinyl are basically the same with this argument, if you can defend buying bulk to flip, your logic applies exactly the same to support scalping.

I guess that makes me a bad person in your eyes then, Dean. I'm confident the sun will still come up tomorrow though.

You've never paid for a scalped ticket before? Or an LP at an inflated price?

Because I've paid for scalped tickets before. Of my own free will. Which makes me no better than the guy who's scalping the tickets. Just like I've paid an inflated price for an LP or a boxset that I missed out on during the initial run for the hilltop.

But you know what? In the end, I'm not pissed off about it, because I understand that there's a price to be paid for being late to the show. and in the end, I'm too busy remembering how awesome that show was or how much I enjoy pissing off my neighbors with that translucent gold LP or limited box set I shelled out a princely sum for.

All of my own free will. That's not the seller's fault. He just knew the magic recipe of luck = opportunity meeting preparation.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 10:31 PM
I have never bought a scalped ticket, no. In fact, I've been at a venue of a sold out show, and traded a spare ticket I had because a friend couldn't come for a pint inside because I have just the same issue with scalpers. And I've paid more for albums than they originally cost, but often that'll just be because the album cost 5d and it's 60 years later, inflation happens.

And buying the item, whilst funding the scalper, isn't in itself a bad thing, if you can avoid it obviously you always should, but at the end of the day, it's your money. The seller is the one who is a shit, if only people who wanted it bought it, then there'd still be reselling form people changing their mind and so on, but the prices would not be as high and the items wouldn't have sold out as fast, meaning more people who wanted it would get it at the right price.

allegro
05-09-2014, 10:31 PM
No offense, but like...the real estate industry isn't exactly the most shining example of ethical business practices. Jeez.
Yeah all of capitalism has greed. And supply and demand.

Mantra
05-09-2014, 10:54 PM
^Of course, but the laws of supply and demand have nothing to do with ethics, which is what sheepdean was invoking when he called whoever it was a dick. It wasn't like "Hey you DICK, you're not making a very sound investment choice!" It was "Damn, you're kind of screwing people over."

the most vile things on earth are justifiable from a perspective of pure supply and demand, but that's totally irrelevant if you're having a debate about what's fair and ethical. I understand perfectly well the basic market logic behind ticket scalping and flipping rare albums (or flipping over-inflated mortgages for that matter) but that doesn't say anything about whether its cool to fuck people over like that.

allegro
05-09-2014, 11:16 PM
Ticket scalping is based on the laws of supply and demand. Scalpers don't always make a profit; they sometimes misjudge demand, and they're stuck with a large supply with low demand. Ethics is relative.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 11:22 PM
Scalpers don't always make a profit but they do always deprive people of tickets, unless the show isn't sold out.

Ethics is relative sure, but capitalism isn't ethical. You want money? Go capitalist. You wanna feel good about yourself at the end of the day, maybe don't be a dick?

aggroculture
05-09-2014, 11:22 PM
Never understood the point of limited editions. If there's demand for it, the artist should just print more. Win/win.

allegro
05-09-2014, 11:23 PM
Never understood the point of limited editions. If there's demand for it, the artist should just print more. Win/win.
As far as I'm concerned, people who buy these expensive "Limited Edition" albums from the artists just got fucked.

sheepdean
05-09-2014, 11:25 PM
Never understood the point of limited editions. If there's demand for it, the artist should just print more. Win/win.
Well yeah, ideally, fuck limited editions. Obviously everything is finite, but intentionally making something scarce is purely a money making initiative. I wonder if there's a legal reason, such as an implied contract, why artists DON'T just make a second run of limited editions for cash though, you look at some things that sell for a fortune and think the band clearly could make a bit more on that.

Mantra
05-09-2014, 11:56 PM
Ethics is relative.
Well duh, but no one would debate anything if we just ended it with that. Pretty much the whole point of this thread is to discuss whether you think its fair or not.

allegro
05-09-2014, 11:57 PM
Well duh, but no one would debate anything if we just ended it with that. Pretty much the whole point of this thread is to discuss whether you think its fair or not.
Who said I was trying to "end" anything?

Mantra
05-10-2014, 12:13 AM
Well...I don't know, I just thought your post had a certain "wrapping things up" kinda vibe to it, so I was like "Oh no you don't!!!!" My bad.

tony.parente
05-10-2014, 12:35 AM
Not trying to be too much of a douche but it was kind of nice to see the king of the facepalm button get a little friendly heat. Love you sheepy!!
<3

nothing8
05-10-2014, 01:11 AM
Buying something that you want, and could be worth more money someday if you want to sell it, I get that.
Buying something, or a bunch of something, just to keep supply low and demand high, to turn a profit on it, that's a dick move.


This.


You wouldn't survive 5 seconds in my world of real estate.

Exactly what I've had in my head reading through this thread. Even more so being on the valuation side of property.

RhettButler
05-10-2014, 07:12 AM
I guess that makes me a bad person in your eyes then, Dean. I'm confident the sun will still come up tomorrow though.

You've never paid for a scalped ticket before? Or an LP at an inflated price?

Because I've paid for scalped tickets before. Of my own free will. Which makes me no better than the guy who's scalping the tickets. Just like I've paid an inflated price for an LP or a boxset that I missed out on during the initial run for the hilltop.

But you know what? In the end, I'm not pissed off about it, because I understand that there's a price to be paid for being late to the show. and in the end, I'm too busy remembering how awesome that show was or how much I enjoy pissing off my neighbors with that translucent gold LP or limited box set I shelled out a princely sum for.

All of my own free will. That's not the seller's fault. He just knew the magic recipe of luck = opportunity meeting preparation.
Agreed, with the exception being if someone were to buy all of the items in question (tickets, CDs, records) in bulk and they prevented you from getting the said item from the start.

staleincense
05-15-2014, 09:42 AM
Quality thread right here.

Leviathant
05-15-2014, 09:51 AM
Your contribution was the cherry on top.


Fin.